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Topic:
The ROTS Conspiracy Theory Thread
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Master_Shaitan
Registered:
Dec '04
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Date Posted:
8/15/05 2:19am
Subject:
The ROTS Conspiracy Theory Thread
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Now this may appear as a bit of an obscure thread but lets just run with it.
We have all had ideas and theories about Star Wars which may or may not have come true after watching ROTS. I'll hold my hands up, for some time I believed that Mace Windu played a role in the creation of a clone army (though im yet to be proven wrong by hard core facts! lol). I thought before watching ROTS that there wouldnt really be any questions left, but I was wrong. Of course there are. We can find a question anywhere.
But what about a real theory which changes the balance of the film and its characters? Did anything happen or not happen in the film that made you think 'outside the box'. Well, here is mine. Im not sure whether it can be proven wrong but if it cant - listen up George Lucas.
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I have a thought in my mind that suggests that Anakin Skywalker, a.k.a. Darth Vader, did not kill the younglings in the council chamber.
Why, you ask?
Firstly, it comes down to my hopes. Despite the fact that the idea of killing them is very strong and emotive, it just seemed too much to me. Could we ever forgive Vader for such a crime? Could he really have any good in him left? It just seemed too evil to me.
Secondly, there has always been good in Anakin/Vader. There always was. What if he went against the order to kill them? What if he believed he could avoid it? I mean, killing the seperatists is one thing - but younglings?
Thirdly, the more evil acts Anakin commits the more powerful he becomes with the dark side. Well, after doing that to younglings he should be extremely powerful - strong enough to kill Obi wan perhaps? Well, what if the reason he couldnt achieve this and be more powerful is because he didnt kill the younglings?
Lastly, the line from Obi Wan puzzles me - "I saw a security recording of Anakin killing younglings".
The footage that Obi wan see's I thought was of Anakin killing a few real jedi and padawans. I didnt see any younglings. Later Yoda says that "killed by clones this padawan was not".
Now, I could be wrong. Im not sure whether Padawans can be younglings or not, but either way, I didnt think Obi Wan saw the footage of Anakin killing the younglings in the Chamber.
Perhaps its just my imagination running wild - but a little part of me just hopes that Vader lead a few of those kids away, put them in a capsule with Jucosta Nu and let them fly off to a safe haven somewhere in the galaxy.
"He said you have turned to the dark side and killed younglings"
Maybe Obi Wan was wrong. Maybe he didnt see the slaughter. Maybe there was no slaughter. If that is the case, maybe we cant blame Anakin for saying:
"Obi Wan is trying to turn you against me"!
*Flame away or add your own ROTS conspiracy theory*
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Darth_Turkey
Registered:
Sep '04
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Date Posted:
8/15/05 3:03am
Subject:
RE: The ROTS Conspiracy Theory Thread
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I have a thought in my mind that suggests that Anakin Skywalker, a.k.a. Darth Vader, did not kill the younglings in the council chamber.
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But then Yoda would be wrong when he finds the childs body and says.
"Killed not by clones, this Padawn was, but by a lightsabre". So if anakin did'nt do it, who did?
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Master_Shaitan
Registered:
Dec '04
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Date Posted:
8/15/05 3:11am
Subject:
RE: The ROTS Conspiracy Theory Thread
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I accept that darth turkey. Anakin did kill those Padawans - but im referring to the younglings in the council chamber...
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jedimasterinu
Registered:
Jul '05
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Date Posted:
8/15/05 3:12am
Subject:
RE: The ROTS Conspiracy Theory Thread
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I too hope Anakin did not kill the younglings. When I heard the kid say "Master Skywalker whats wrong?" or something to that extent I become sad. When Anakin ignites his saber I felt it was over for the kids, but since they cut away they might still be alive. Although Anakin went to the Darkside I don't think he would kill kids.
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Darth_Turkey
Registered:
Sep '04
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Date Posted:
8/15/05 3:30am
Subject:
RE: The ROTS Conspiracy Theory Thread
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I dont know. From the way the clones entered the building, i dont think anyone survived. Bail says he saw thousands of troops attack the temple, and you saw how they shot to kill the young padawn on the landing platform, no one survibed that raid, and if they did, i'm sure Yoda or Obi-wan would have senced them when entering the temple.
Obi-wan does see anakin slaughtering younglings on the video recording, only we dont get to see that, purly cos Lucas did not want child murder to appear in his movie. It's implied from the look on Obi-wans face. We dont always see everything that goes on in a movie and must rely on dialogue for what we dont/cant or are'nt allowed to see. Obi-wan would not lie about this, he is a Jedi, jedi do not lie or bend the truth to serve their purpose. And what purpose would it serve if he was lying? Whether he killed children or adults it does;nt realy matter. He has ecome a killer and must be stopped.
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Get_in_Gear
Registered:
Nov '04
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Date Posted:
8/15/05 4:09am
Subject:
RE: The ROTS Conspiracy Theory Thread
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Anakin killed the younglings.
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darkscout36
Registered:
Apr '05
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Date Posted:
8/15/05 4:13am
Subject:
RE: The ROTS Conspiracy Theory Thread
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anakin killed the younglings, it just wasn't showed. The reason they were in the middle of the hallway instead of in that room where Anakin found them was probably they ran away invididually and Anakin had to chase them down, some in the hallway, some elseware.
The scene of killing innocent youth was probably too much to be put onto a Star Wars Movie. To make the audience feel vader is evil as it gets, it gives u the idea of what he did, not what he exactly did.
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"as you wish my lord" [shoots down palpatine's private shuttle]
"NO, NO, 66, not 77, it was a type-O, NO, NO"
[Anakin is still crying, palpatine is dead, mace appears]
"You dirty ****er ****er, you think you can kill me"
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darko_blade
Registered:
Jul '05
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Date Posted:
8/15/05 4:22am
Subject:
RE: The ROTS Conspiracy Theory Thread
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I can see your point - if Anakin slaughtered younglings, could he ever be good? How could he ever forgive himself after such an awful thing...and after all, he would believe that he had killed his own children when Padmé died...
So, technically, that's 2 sets of kids he "killed".
I think his killing of the younglings was implied. George Lucas didn't want to show him murdering them, because it was too much - it was infinite evil and if we saw it, how could we ever believe Anakin still had good in him? The idea was not to show us, to let us think about it. It's proven fact that you can forgive people for something far more easily if you never saw them commit the act.
I believe he killed the younglings.
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"Watch your mouth, kid, or you'll be floating home" -Han Solo http://www.storewars.org/flash/index.html _The Force Be With You_
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Darth_Turkey
Registered:
Sep '04
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Date Posted:
8/15/05 4:29am
Subject:
RE: The ROTS Conspiracy Theory Thread
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The scene is meant to show that Anakin, is dead, and darth vader now lives.
"When that happened,the good man who was your father was destroyed"
"The boy you trained, gone he is, consumed by darth rader"
Anakin could never kill kids, this is why he is redeamed and takes on the form of his younger self at the end of ROTJ. Anakin was not evil and commited no evil, darth vader did.
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SEPARATESICKLEROOK2
Registered:
Sep '03
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Date Posted:
8/15/05 4:35am
Subject:
RE: The ROTS Conspiracy Theory Thread
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I think its funny how we can swallow mass murder as long as it doesnt involve children. People can say " oh killing sand people and separatists is one thing, but not poor innocent children". If you're killing, you're killing. Either embrace full murder or stray from it entirely, there are no boundaries. In the sense of ROTS, the younglings of today would be the jedi of tomorrow, so to the sith, they had to be destroyed. the only one anakin ever seemed conflicted about killing was obiwan. And nobody said that anakin 'enjoyed' it, it was just what he thought he "had" to do. He cried throughout the separatist slaughter. Anakin not only betrayed others in his downfall, he betrayed himself as well. "The darkside grows more insidious the closer you draw to it, until it makes a mockery of who you once were."-Bastila Shan, KOTOR.
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Get_in_Gear
Registered:
Nov '04
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Date Posted:
8/15/05 4:43am
Subject:
RE: The ROTS Conspiracy Theory Thread
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Anakin had already killed Tusken women and children indiscriminately.
Rather than saying "how could Anakin be redeemed after killing children?", it seems to me the fact that he plumbed such depths is the reason he needs redeeming in the first place...
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barnsthefatjedi
Registered:
Feb '01
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Date Posted:
8/15/05 4:49am
Subject:
RE: The ROTS Conspiracy Theory Thread
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The younglings are dead son; accept it.
Die thread, die.
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And none of them are worth reading, Bib
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i_dont_know
Registered:
Aug '05
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Date Posted:
8/15/05 4:59am
Subject:
RE: The ROTS Conspiracy Theory Thread
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Darth_Turkey posted:
The scene is meant to show that Anakin, is dead, and darth vader now lives.
"When that happened,the good man who was your father was destroyed"
"The boy you trained, gone he is, consumed by darth rader"
Anakin could never kill kids, this is why he is redeamed and takes on the form of his younger self at the end of ROTJ. Anakin was not evil and commited no evil, darth vader did.
I partly disagree. It was meant to show Anakin was dying. He doesn't totally abandon himself until his second last scene ("Noooooo!"). This is why Sidious is laughing here.
But I agree he wasn't technically Anakin during the temple raid either. I think Yoda failed when he told Obi-Wan that Anakin was already gone. He was still redeemable at this point, but nothing Obi-Wan could have done would help - just seeing Obi-Wan made Anakin lose himself more. Sneaking aboard Padme's ship didn't help.
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dude4c
Registered:
Dec '03
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Date Posted:
8/15/05 5:01am
Subject:
RE: The ROTS Conspiracy Theory Thread
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there is no conspiracy, vader killed the younglings. he became one of the most feared sith lords ever. his killings went on for 3 more movies and countless chapters in between. i know you want to have hope, but the fact is that Darth Vader was one of the most ruthless villians in film history.
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Master_Shaitan
Registered:
Dec '04
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Date Posted:
8/15/05 6:29am
Subject:
RE: The ROTS Conspiracy Theory Thread
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Then my hero is truely dead...lol
Ok, ok. I still say that lack of evidence suggests that they could be alive!
Anyone got any conspiracy theories they'd like to share?
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Get_in_Gear
Registered:
Nov '04
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Date Posted:
8/15/05 7:16am
Subject:
RE: The ROTS Conspiracy Theory Thread
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Master_Shaitan posted:
Anyone got any conspiracy theories they'd like to share?
John Lennon's murder was arranged by the FBI... 
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