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Author	Topic: The Jedi Council DID Insult Anakin By not Making him a Master....
obiwankoti Registered: Apr '05	Date Posted: 9/21/05 10:54am Subject: The Jedi Council DID Insult Anakin By not Making him a Master....
	.......First they volunteer up with the Idea Without even consulting Anakin , then "request" him to take advantage of his close friendship with the Chancellor and Spy for them. how about including the "Chosen One"?. if the Council want Anakin to betray the Jedi Code and a Mentor , why not bring him in on it. it Shook Anakin's faith in the Jedi, to be taken Outside the Council and asked to do , what appears to be an isideous deed . it's ironic that although the Jedi Want Anakin to be selfless in this matter,this was a selfish and Un Jedi like move. and further Played into Palpatines hands. then to top it off the Council chooses not to Make Anakin a Master. seems small payback for fighting as a hero in the war and for the sneaky an unprecidented request they make of Anakin. Having Anakin "Off the record" Spy on Palpatine , was a treasonous offence. and if Anakin was caught or Exposed , do we know if the Jedi would even Support him?.Anakin could have been labelled a traitor . Trust is a two way street. what do you think. ? -----signature----- I used to be with 'it', but then they changed what 'it' was. Now what I'm with isn't 'it' anymore and what's 'it' seems weird and scary. http://outerrimsieges.com/
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COMMANDER76 Registered: Mar '05	Date Posted: 9/21/05 10:58am Subject: RE: The Jedi Council DID Insult Anakin By not Making him a Master....
	No they did not insult him.....he just doesn't understand Master level Jedi business yet.........and never will -----signature----- Master C76 of TheForce.Net http://boards.outerrimsieges.com <---- Utopia....even for Bashers!!!
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obiwankoti Registered: Apr '05	Date Posted: 9/21/05 11:00am Subject: RE: The Jedi Council DID Insult Anakin By not Making him a Master....
	what?, you don't call using him to spy "off the record", and then not telling him what is going on "using" him?. they don't evem trust him to know what's going on. they played a gamble with Anakin's name, reputation, and maybe life. sounds like "using" to me. -----signature----- I used to be with 'it', but then they changed what 'it' was. Now what I'm with isn't 'it' anymore and what's 'it' seems weird and scary. http://outerrimsieges.com/
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darth-sinister Title: Manager Emeritus Registered: Jun '01	Date Posted: 9/21/05 11:04am Subject: RE: The Jedi Council DID Insult Anakin By not Making him a Master....
	Anakin wasn't insulted, he just thought he was. He's not ready to be a Master. He might never had been ready. Until he let go of his attachments and controlled his emotions, he would never be fit to sit on the Council. He's egomanical. And his outburst in the Council proves their point. A real Jedi wouldn't get angry at being denied the rank of Master. A real Jedi would be humble and gracious. A real Jedi would be proud that he's at least sitting on the Council. If he really pulled his head out of his butt for five seconds, he'd realize that Palpatine was using him. That he planned for this to happen. -----signature----- Stewie: "Oh, this is an even bigger jackpot than when the Emperor came up with the formula for great Star Wars dialouge." Palpatine: "Something, something, something. Dark side. Something, something, something complete."
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MasterVodo Registered: Apr '05	Date Posted: 9/21/05 11:08am Subject: RE: The Jedi Council DID Insult Anakin By not Making him a Master....
	Anakin is a newly ordained Knight of the Jedi order. This is NOT a democratic orgainization. It is his duty as a Knight to do as he is told no matter what. He should have enough sence to respect the wisdom of the masters. Perhaps if he did, he would be made a master! You wouldn't expect a common army footsoldier to be able to sit in on a meeting with his generals and plan his own orders would you?
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obiwankoti Registered: Apr '05	Date Posted: 9/21/05 11:11am Subject: RE: The Jedi Council DID Insult Anakin By not Making him a Master....
	You wouldn't expect a common army footsoldier to be able to sit in on a meeting with his generals and plan his own orders would you? I HARDLY CALL THE POSTERBOY AND HERO OF THE REPUBLIC A COMMON SOLDIER. and since they only appointed Anakin so he can spy on Palpatine, I would say they used him. and that is an insult to any Jedi. i mean come on they don't even tell him what the [lan is. just that he must do it . -----signature----- I used to be with 'it', but then they changed what 'it' was. Now what I'm with isn't 'it' anymore and what's 'it' seems weird and scary. http://outerrimsieges.com/
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SAND-CRAWLER Registered: Sep '03	Date Posted: 9/21/05 11:18am Subject: RE: The Jedi Council DID Insult Anakin By not Making him a Master....
	I would tend to agree that Anakin was insulted, in the sense that he was lied to. When he found out he was going to be on the council, he automatically assumed that he would be a master because everyone who has ever been on the council had been granted the rank of master for it. Not granting Anakin the rank of master creates an exception to the rule which insults Anakin because he is the one that suffers for the council setting a double standard. The council should have either denied Anakin's apointment to the council because they didn't want to grant him the rank of master, or they should have given him the rank of master when the put him on the council. If your boss told you that you were going to be put on the board of directors in your company but not allowed to influence any decisions and just forced to sit there and take notes, you'd be pretty insulted too. I know I would. obiwankoti posted: You wouldn't expect a common army footsoldier to be able to sit in on a meeting with his generals and plan his own orders would you? Actually it's more like you wouldn't tell your most promissing commander that they were being promoted to the elite "Council of Generals" and not give him the rank of a "general". Again, it's the double standard that's insulting. Everyone who has been on the council for a Millenium has been granted the rank of master. Anakin is somehow the exception to the rule. Big mistake by the council. Making exception to rules in leadership always brings rebellion. -----signature----- Darth Vader clawing his way on the lava bank is THE Sand-Crawler.
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MasterVodo Registered: Apr '05	Date Posted: 9/21/05 11:32am Subject: RE: The Jedi Council DID Insult Anakin By not Making him a Master....
	obiwankoti posted: You wouldn't expect a common army footsoldier to be able to sit in on a meeting with his generals and plan his own orders would you? I HARDLY CALL THE POSTERBOY AND HERO OF THE REPUBLIC A COMMON SOLDIER. and since they only appointed Anakin so he can spy on Palpatine, I would say they used him. and that is an insult to any Jedi. i mean come on they don't even tell him what the [lan is. just that he must do it . Posterboy or not, Anakin IS just a knight. A Jedi is not supposed to seek personal acclaim or glory. ("Adventure, heh! Excitment, heh! A Jedi craves not these things.) It is exactly this arrogance that holds Anakin back and eventually causes his downfall. He is unable to detach himself from his emotions and see the wisdom of others. Yes, this circumstance would make any normal person feel insulted, but Anakin is a Jedi ("I'm a Jedi, I KNOW I'm better than this!") and should therfore let it go and give himself to the Force and to his superiors.
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darth-sinister Title: Manager Emeritus Registered: Jun '01	Date Posted: 9/21/05 11:45am Subject: RE: The Jedi Council DID Insult Anakin By not Making him a Master....
	Palpatine was the one who wanted Anakin on the Council. It was his fault for starting that. Anakin was going to try to be patient and wait until the Council was ready to make him a member. As pointed out, Anakin's motivations for wanting to be on the Council are wrong. Just cause he's a hero doesn't mean that he's deserving of it. Obi-wan got to sit on the Council because of his experience as a Knight, his ability to control his emotions, and his understanding of the Force. He also needed to remain objective. If the Jedi have reason for suspecting something is wrong with Palpatine, then he should've taken them at face value and not let his personal feelings get in the way. -----signature----- Stewie: "Oh, this is an even bigger jackpot than when the Emperor came up with the formula for great Star Wars dialouge." Palpatine: "Something, something, something. Dark side. Something, something, something complete."
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Obi_Frans Registered: Jul '03	Date Posted: 9/21/05 11:49am Subject: RE: The Jedi Council DID Insult Anakin By not Making him a Master....
	SAND-CRAWLER posted: The council should have either denied Anakin's apointment to the council because they didn't want to grant him the rank of master, or they should have given him the rank of master when the put him on the council. Deny him the rank of Master: You get the same reaction as we get in the film, "how dare they". Anakin never asked to be a Master, or on the council; but he wanted it. It's Palpatines job now, since he is a Sith Lord, to make Anakin realize that the Council doesn't think he's ready to be a Master. Realistically, even Anakin knows he's not ready; but when it's shoved in his face like that, he reacts. It's in his nature. Grant him the rank of Master: Slap everybody who earned it in the face, reinforce Palpatine's notion that Anakin is the greatest thing since blue milk and have Anakin as a Master.........who still isn't able to save his wife as a Jedi. What the Jedi did wasn't insulting; it was a smart thing, Anakin's just too blind to see it. - O_F -----signature----- "He only wanted to save them. Padme, from death. Obi-Wan, from ignorance But they failed to recognize his power. Instead, Padme was dead & Obi-Wan was running for his life As stripped of everything as Vader was. Without friends, family, purpose" - Vader
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PADMELUVA Registered: Nov '04	Date Posted: 9/21/05 11:51am Subject: RE: The Jedi Council DID Insult Anakin By not Making him a Master....
	The council is forced to take anakin aboard...they cant refuse an executive order from the supreme chancellor, especially during times of war. they accept the appointment because they dont want to cause trouble and because they want to know what palpatine is up to. being a master is a whole different scenario. knight or master, anakin can still fulfill his duties as palpatine's emissary and spy. being a knight doesnt impeed either duty...so why make him a master if he doesnt deserve it? posterboy or not...it isnt power that defines a master, its wisdom, self restraint, humility and the mastery of one's emotions. anakin had none of these...why give him a title if he doenst embody a single one of these qualities? as sinister said...if he would just pull his head out of his anas he would relaize this and accept their decision with humility. heck, that would have been a great way to prove to them your ready, but by lashing out as he does, he proves he doenst deserve the title. -----signature----- Shaak Ti my dear, you've come to rescue me!
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mjerome3 Registered: May '00	Date Posted: 9/21/05 11:52am Subject: RE: The Jedi Council DID Insult Anakin By not Making him a Master....
	I've been wondering about this myself. I think the boy was slighted, and the Jedi Council would have been better off to go ahead and give Anakin the rank of Master, especially if they wanted him to spy on the Chancellor and risk treason. I mean, the Jedi end up getting wiped out anyway because of this. Had they granted Anakin the rank of Master the Jedi Order would have been better off. Anakin was clearly granted the seat on the Council so they could use him. Forget that he rescued the Chancellor. Forget that his victory over Count Dooku was more impressive than Kenobi's victory over Maul. The Jedi Council had nothing to lose by granting Anakin the rank of Master. If fact, they had more to gain. It wasn't a good decision at all. -----signature----- May the Force be with you- Luke Skywalker May the Force be with you- Han Solo May the Force be with you- Qui-Gon Jinn May the Force be with you- Anakin Skywalker The Force will be with you...always- Obi-Wan Kenobi
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Obi_Frans Registered: Jul '03	Date Posted: 9/21/05 11:54am Subject: RE: The Jedi Council DID Insult Anakin By not Making him a Master....
	mjerome3 posted: I mean, the Jedi end up getting wiped out anyway because of this. Had they granted Anakin the rank of Master the Jedi Order would have been better off. Anakin was clearly granted the seat on the Council so they could use him. Please explain how making him a Master would solve his "Padme" issue; since that is the reason he betrays them, since that's the reason Sidious lives on while Windu perishes with a knife in his back. - O_F -----signature----- "He only wanted to save them. Padme, from death. Obi-Wan, from ignorance But they failed to recognize his power. Instead, Padme was dead & Obi-Wan was running for his life As stripped of everything as Vader was. Without friends, family, purpose" - Vader
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SithOWNtheJedi Registered: Jul '05	Date Posted: 9/21/05 12:03pm Subject: RE: The Jedi Council DID Insult Anakin By not Making him a Master....
	Both Palpatine and the Jedi clearly used Anakin, Jedi messed up
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mjerome3 Registered: May '00	Date Posted: 9/21/05 12:05pm Subject: RE: The Jedi Council DID Insult Anakin By not Making him a Master....
	Obi_Frans posted: mjerome3 posted: I mean, the Jedi end up getting wiped out anyway because of this. Had they granted Anakin the rank of Master the Jedi Order would have been better off. Anakin was clearly granted the seat on the Council so they could use him. Please explain how making him a Master would solve his "Padme" issue; since that is the reason he betrays them, since that's the reason Sidious lives on while Windu perishes with a knife in his back. - O_F The only reason Mace gets a knife in the back is because he went in for the kill instead of allowing he and Anakin to take Palaptine into custody. As far as Padme, this was a point where he was torn between the Jedi and the Sith, a crucial moment in the PT. Anakin was more on Palpatine's side for the reasons I explained, not because of his needing Padme to live. Had he been granted the rank of Master, he would have been allowed to go into the Jedi archieves and locate information on how to preserve life(that's what ROTS novel says), but since he was a Knight, he couldn't do that. He was totally denied the rank of Master Jedi, which increased his dilema even more. So, once Palpatine makes that offer to him, the dark side of the Force is the only way. -----signature----- May the Force be with you- Luke Skywalker May the Force be with you- Han Solo May the Force be with you- Qui-Gon Jinn May the Force be with you- Anakin Skywalker The Force will be with you...always- Obi-Wan Kenobi
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darth-sinister Title: Manager Emeritus Registered: Jun '01	Date Posted: 9/21/05 12:14pm Subject: RE: The Jedi Council DID Insult Anakin By not Making him a Master....
	Anakin ignored his destiny, which was to destroy the Sith, because of his selfishness and greed. Had he done what he should've he would've been able to save Padme. And he might've gotten the rank of Master by proving that he was worthy. Instead, he made the wrong choice and paid dearly for it. -----signature----- Stewie: "Oh, this is an even bigger jackpot than when the Emperor came up with the formula for great Star Wars dialouge." Palpatine: "Something, something, something. Dark side. Something, something, something complete."
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