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Topic:
Would the Jedi Order had survived if the Jedi Counsil were at the temple during the raid?
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GrUnT_HUNTER
Registered:
May '04
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Date Posted:
11/4/05 2:04pm
Subject:
RE: Would the Jedi Order had survived if the Jedi Counsil were at the temple during the raid?
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FallenKnight88 posted:
DUGGY posted:
so twelve Masters could set it all straight ? 
Did you not see what two masters (Yoda/Obi-wan) were able to do? They took out an entire battalion without breaking a sweat! Multiply that power by 6 (and add the hundreds already in the temple) 
Sure the odds are still stacked against them, but the playing field would be much more level.
Sidious killed 3 Jedi Masters in less than 6 seconds. If Sidious was there with Anakin and the Clones they might be able to push them back. Keep in mind that Mace, Kit, Seaseae, and the other master would be dead, so that already hurts morale, but the Jedi could still hold them and escape after they killed the first wave, considering that Palpatine escapes (which he would) and maybe Anakin, they would be able to make it out alive and rebuild the Order in secrecy.
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Inno-Vader
Registered:
Nov '04
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Date Posted:
11/4/05 4:02pm
Subject:
RE: Would the Jedi Order had survived if the Jedi Counsil were at the temple during the raid?
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There would be no rebuilding in secrecy if the Jedi were known to have escaped. As enemies of the republic they would have been hunted down and destroyed. A Jedi can hold his or her own but against the might of the Empire there would be no escape. Not unless the Jedi were presumed dead.
No matter how the Jedi Temple was configured it would be impossible for the Jedi to escape an attack led by Vader. If laser fire didn't kill them, the sword would. If a pocket of resistance became too troublesome then down would come the turbolaser bombardment.
Remember, this isn't like the Hoth battle. There was no warning; no time for plotting escape vectors into hyperspace. Just a few moments of chaos and suddenly ... silence.
Blitzkrieg baby.
END TRANSMISSION
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ticopuma
Registered:
Aug '05
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Date Posted:
11/4/05 4:09pm
Subject:
RE: Would the Jedi Order had survived if the Jedi Counsil were at the temple during the raid?
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I think that if the whole council including Aayla and Luminara, etc. were all there the order would have survived. It would have been crippled but alive
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Hyperion51
Registered:
Jun '05
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Date Posted:
11/4/05 4:11pm
Subject:
RE: Would the Jedi Order had survived if the Jedi Counsil were at the temple during the raid?
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GrUnT_HUNTER posted:
This also brings up the point of if Mace's Posse had survived longer and at least one of them would have been alive when Anakin walked in, Mace wouldn't have died because the other master would have saved him.
Had at least one of Mace's posse, lets say Kit, survived to the point where Anakin walked in, its possible that combined with the presence of the additional Master being alive and not dead, and Anakin's plea to Mace, Mace may not have overreacted.
IMO, part of the reason that Mace did decide to go and kill Palpatine off at the end may have been at least partially enfluenced by watching 3 of his friends and comrades in arms being cut down like they where nothing. If one survives, Mace may not be as mad, and the other Master may be able to help convince Mace not to kill Palpatine, but to continue trying to arrest him.
Even if Mace still tried to kill Palpatine and Anakin survived, if one of the other Masters where still there after Mace was killed, what would he do, and what would Anakin do?
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voodoopuuduu
Registered:
Mar '04
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Date Posted:
11/4/05 6:33pm
Subject:
RE: Would the Jedi Order had survived if the Jedi Counsil were at the temple during the raid?
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I made a thread on this with another user name around the time the movie came up. The conclusion we came to was that the temple would have still fallen but Yoda would have made sure the Younglings made it out alive. Mace would have at least held on to the temple long enough to where they could have made a tactical retreat into the Coruscant underground or off planet
Yes, I agree. With more experienced Jedi around, they would have made a much more successful escape. They would have known to fight and run away, to fight another day. But Mace made yet another mistake, probably against Jedi rules, and left the temple basically unguarded.
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El-Elyon
Registered:
Feb '02
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Date Posted:
11/4/05 7:05pm
Subject:
RE: Would the Jedi Order had survived if the Jedi Counsil were at the temple during the raid?
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they're jedi, J-E-D-I. if a legion of the emporers troops can be defeated by a rag-tag of rebels and ewoks then i think if the jedi were more prepared they could more than overpower a legion of clones.
Jedi v Sith? i think 2 sith v the jedi in FAIR circumstances the sith would be more than overpowered.
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PalpatineJones13
Registered:
Nov '05
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Date Posted:
11/4/05 7:19pm
Subject:
RE: Would the Jedi Order had survived if the Jedi Counsil were at the temple during the raid?
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No. It is like an earlier poster alluded to that if the whole empire is coming after you then you really have no chance. And there must have been a limitless supply of stormtroopers since the Empire kept the galaxy in check by show of force. More and more stormtroopers would overwhelm the Jedi Masters and after awhile the Jedi temple would be similar to what happened to the Alamo. Not to mention an air strike could take out the temple. Sure, Jedi are powerful but we are not talking about one on one type battles here but a whole battalion(s) of soldiers coming after you. Unless the force users name is Exar Kun than the temple is going to eventually fall.
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Chancellor_Ewok
Registered:
Nov '04
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Date Posted:
11/4/05 7:30pm
Subject:
RE: Would the Jedi Order had survived if the Jedi Counsil were at the temple during the raid?
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FallenKnight88 posted:
As I was watching the scene in the temple where they show Yoda and Obi-wan OWNING a battalion of Clonetroopers, it got me thinking:
If two Jedi Masters can easily manhandle over dozens of troops (i'm assuming they wiped out those guarding the temple), what would've happened if the entire Jedi counsil were there as well (Sans, Mace, Agen, Kit and Tinn)
Assuming Ki-adi, Plo Koon, Aayla (even though she's not a member of the counsil or a master) and the remaining 6 masters on the counsil, would the outcome had been different? Would they had been able to save the Jedi Order?
I don't think so. I think the Temple would have been over run eventually. Remember the clones were hand picked for this assignment and they were lead by Anakin, who we know is an excellent swordsman.However, I do think that the defence of the Temple would have lasted alot longer and probably been better organized, had some of the Order's senior Masters been present. Also, if you read the Databank entry on the 501st, it says that several Jedi proved to be exceptionally difficult to kill, so I'd say that the Jedi in the Temple gave as good as they got.
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Darth Mischievous
Registered:
Oct '99
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Date Posted:
11/5/05 1:57am
Subject:
RE: Would the Jedi Order had survived if the Jedi Counsil were at the temple during the raid?
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I wished they would have shown more of Anakin killing the Jedi.
It's what we were waiting decades to see, but we only got 2 seconds of it.
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DARTHLINK
Registered:
Feb '05
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Date Posted:
11/5/05 2:36am
Subject:
RE: Would the Jedi Order had survived if the Jedi Counsil were at the temple during the raid?
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Darth Mischievous posted:
I wished they would have shown more of Anakin killing the Jedi.
It's what we were waiting decades to see, but we only got 2 seconds of it.
I usually think that the reason Lucas did that, was because we would then feel the true horror of it all when Obi-Wan and Yoda comes and finds all their Jedi comrades...dead. All we got was Anakin marching towards the temple and a quick scene of the Jedi fighting clones.
I think Lucas calculating move here was the shock factor. If we look at the scene where Obi-Wana and Yoda sees the dead younglings and we saw 10-20 minutes of Anakin slaughtering the Jedi, we would still be shocked, but not as nearly shocked as we were with what we have in the film.
The scenes that shows the Jedi dying in the hands of their clone troops, Anakin marching on the temple, the clones betraying and firing at Obi-Wan, they really tug at your heartstrings to see all your favorite Jedi die.
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Obi_Frans
Registered:
Jul '03
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Date Posted:
11/5/05 4:19am
Subject:
RE: Would the Jedi Order had survived if the Jedi Counsil were at the temple during the raid?
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Didn't we all see the Order 66 scenes?
Jedi, even Masters, aren't invincible. Shoot them from every angle and they'll fall. Send enough Troops to shoot them from every angle and they'll fall. Send Darth Vader along with these troops that'll shoot them from every angle and they'll fall.
- O_F
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But they failed to recognize his power. Instead, Padme was dead & Obi-Wan was running for his life
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loebs
Registered:
Jul '05
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Date Posted:
11/5/05 4:34am
Subject:
RE: Would the Jedi Order had survived if the Jedi Counsil were at the temple during the raid?
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all i can picture is this becoming like the scene in the Two Towers where they are hiding and finally open the doors of helms deep - jedi council in this case and fight anyway except in this case yoda comes out on the 5th morning with a petallion of wookies to help hahaha
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dragonsith13
Registered:
Apr '05
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Date Posted:
11/5/05 7:01am
Subject:
RE: Would the Jedi Order had survived if the Jedi Counsil were at the temple during the raid?
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Probably there combined strength may have been too much for Sidious and Vader to handle although I am sure that Vader took out dozens of Jedi Knights in the temple along with a master or two along with all the padawans and bear clan members. An assmbly of 12 or so of the highest masters would be tough.
Sidious' genious was, divide and conquer... The Jedi were effectively neutralized by spreading them so thin.
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Ruthio
Registered:
May '05
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Date Posted:
11/5/05 8:02am
Subject:
RE: Would the Jedi Order had survived if the Jedi Counsil were at the temple during the raid?
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im sure it would of made a huge difference ....for one thing Anakin would of died. But, im sure the jedi would eventually have to retreat and go into hideing. Either way the "Empire" would win, atleast until Luke skywalker kicks their ass 20 years later.
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sith_rising
Registered:
Jan '04
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Date Posted:
11/5/05 9:25am
Subject:
RE: Would the Jedi Order had survived if the Jedi Counsil were at the temple during the raid?
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The Temple raid wouldn't have happened if the entire Council had been in session. They would have had to level the place with artillery, or they'd never flush them out. Besides, Palpatine would never have tried it with the entire Council present. He only did it because he had Anakin, Mace and his posse were dead, Obi, Ki, Yoda, and Plo were off-world, and they were all seperated and surrounded by Clones.
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