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Topic:
Did Lucas betray Padme?
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Handmaiden_Azul
Registered:
Dec '05
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Date Posted:
1/2/06 10:32am
Subject:
RE: Did Lucas betray Padme?
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Thatis really cool! 
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Darth_Kermit
Registered:
Apr '03
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Date Posted:
1/2/06 4:35pm
Subject:
RE: Did Lucas betray Padme?
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What happened to the stone faced 14 year old in TPM. She stood up to anyone. What? She grows up and looses the will to live even though she has two children to take care off all for love?
I don't think Lucas followed through with Padme. That "lost the will to live thing" really trashes her character.
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darthvaderv
Registered:
May '05
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Date Posted:
1/3/06 1:59am
Subject:
RE: Did Lucas betray Padme?
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Major let down of EPI III. Padme was pushed to the side. Her brief screen time was wasted with combing her hair and weak dialogue. As for the Ive lost the will to live rubbish. What a joke. What an embarassment. 
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PMT99
Registered:
Nov '00
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Date Posted:
1/3/06 3:14am
Subject:
RE: Did Lucas betray Padme?
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Darth_Kermit posted:
What happened to the stone faced 14 year old in TPM. She stood up to anyone. What? She grows up and looses the will to live even though she has two children to take care off all for love?
I'll tell you what happened to Padme....she got pregnant and her husband turning evil is what happened. Even if she hadn't died, how can she possibly protect her children from 2 Sith Lords that are hunting them? Even when she was a stone faced 14 year old who stood up to anyone in TPM, she was spooked to see Darth Maul standing before her and her troops because she knew it would be suicide to attack him after she saw him attack Qui-Gon on Tatooine.
The shock of her own husband choking her is what finished her off.
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Lyvia
Registered:
Jun '05
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Date Posted:
1/3/06 8:32am
Subject:
RE: Did Lucas betray Padme?
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Oh pleas that's lame and you know it. THe woman just gives up without a fight because her husband is an bastard! She was completely pathetic in ROTS and Lucas needed her to die so he pulled a bogus death out of his butt. THere are a dozen better ways for that girl to have died besides....well that absolutely lack of reason in the movie. She could have suffered worse injuries from Anakin, could have died of natural childbirth because she wasn't on Coruscant, she could have had the decision to save her self or have a life threatening surgery to save her children but it would kill her. There are so many better ways for this to have been dealt with than she being a pathetic, selfish woman who abandons her children because her husband force chokes her. This woman is not the mother of Princess Leia who fights for every moment; even short and soft Luke has more fight than Padme. I dont think Lucas betrayed her I think he just got lazy.
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darth-sinister
Title: Manager Emeritus
Registered:
Jun '01
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Date Posted:
1/3/06 11:49am
Subject:
RE: Did Lucas betray Padme?
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Lucas wanted to highlight the tragic nature of their relationship's end. That she loved Anakin so much, that when he broke her heart, she simply gave up the will to live. It's tragic. Poetic. Being with Anakin changed her. Rather than just having her die of injuries, Lucas wanted their relationship to end as it began. With a Shakespearian (sp) type of feel to it.
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Lyvia
Registered:
Jun '05
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Date Posted:
1/3/06 9:53pm
Subject:
RE: Did Lucas betray Padme?
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So in conclusion, he made Padme put a man before her children? Padme's death is not Shakesperean, Shakespeare characters deaths have actual meaning and an actual cause. A tragedy is not just somebody dying, it is the way of the death, the reason of the death, and the way the death affects everybody else. When Romeo and Juliet, the greatest Shakespeare tragedy for many people, died they didnt just keel over for no reason when they discovered each other dead. Yes their suicides could be viewed as selfish but atleast there was a reason for them dying. Padme's death was not tragic it was stupid, it would have been just as tragic if she had died of actual reasons instead of just keeling over for no reason. It would have been just as tragic if she had lived for 2 years, hidden on Alderran, a broken woman, and then died of a broken heart(no one dies of a broken heart in 5minutes). It would have been more realistic than what happened to her. It is obvious by the way the death was dealt with, Anakin chokes her and Palpatine tells him he killed Padme, that GL wanted Anakin to be the direct cause of her death. He just copped out at the end and poured an overload of water into his Coke. The excuse that Lucas didnt want Anakin to kill Padme because it would have been far to "evil" is a weak excuse because Anakin did kill her because he caused her to loose the will to live.
No one expects Padme to be Buffy the Vampire Slayer, or as active as she was in AOTC at 7months pregnant, but we do expect her to die of an actual cause and not just give up.
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Darth_Kermit
Registered:
Apr '03
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Date Posted:
1/3/06 11:26pm
Subject:
RE: Did Lucas betray Padme?
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The only way I can understand it the way that it is, is that she knew that loving Anakin was wrong in AOTC, but by giving in to it, she undermined herself. She cut herself off at the knees. Her destruction took place right there before the arena when she decided to let herself be a teenager for the first time in her life, let herself be needy.
But then again, I shouldn't have to make a stretch like that unless Lucas really does it clearly and on purpose.
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darth-sinister
Title: Manager Emeritus
Registered:
Jun '01
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Date Posted:
1/3/06 11:41pm
Subject:
RE: Did Lucas betray Padme?
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Lucas has said that not only is Star Wars about the son redeeming the father, but is about the daughter redeeming the mother. It's fathers, sons, mothers & daughters. Family. Padme's death serves as the death of hope and liberty. She was one of the bright spots and now she is lost. Tragedy and darkness engulf the galaxy. Matters are worse.
Padme goes from being totally unselfish to totally selfish. She's too attached to Anakin, just as he was to her. They both die, only one is literal and one is a metaphysical/pyschological death. Padme cannot adapt to the idea of life without her husband. And as Lucas said in 1999, if you cannot adapt, you die.
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Stewie: "Oh, this is an even bigger jackpot than when the Emperor
came up with the formula for great Star Wars dialouge."
Palpatine: "Something, something, something. Dark side.
Something, something, something complete."
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Darth_Kermit
Registered:
Apr '03
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Date Posted:
1/3/06 11:50pm
Subject:
RE: Did Lucas betray Padme?
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I don't know about totally selfish, she's still a pretty virtuous politician, but I know what you mean in her personal life.
I like what you are saying Sinister, it gels well with my last post -But I really wish that Lucas would have supported this motif better in the movie if that is actually what he was getting at. Maybe a really needy/clingy scene with Padme, besides the "hold me" scene.
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darth-sinister
Title: Manager Emeritus
Registered:
Jun '01
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Date Posted:
1/4/06 12:05am
Subject:
RE: Did Lucas betray Padme?
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Yes, in her personal life, she's more selfish than her public one. But you must also consider that she has a lot of other things on her mind. Her husband has killed children for the second time in as many years. And this time, she cannot just write it off as being human. Her husband has killed and betrayed everyone. The Jedi, the Republic and even her. All in the name of power. Anakin's Force choke was the final straw. She couldn't take anymore. She may have been a fighter once, but people change. And she changed.
-----signature-----
Stewie: "Oh, this is an even bigger jackpot than when the Emperor
came up with the formula for great Star Wars dialouge."
Palpatine: "Something, something, something. Dark side.
Something, something, something complete."
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JediCouncilMember
Registered:
Jul '03
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Date Posted:
1/4/06 6:28am
Subject:
RE: Did Lucas betray Padme?
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I think a good scene that shows this is the reunion scene right after they save Palpatine.
Anakin sneaks away to see Padme and then eventually says he doesn't care who knows, and Padme is the one who says they must keep it secret.
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Greedo_forever
Registered:
May '05
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Date Posted:
1/4/06 7:09am
Subject:
RE: Did Lucas betray Padme?
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I agree with what Darth-Sinister says.
Just to add to the conversation, I think that girls are supposed to be upset about how Padme turned out in ROTS, compared to what she was. This film IS a tragedy, remember.
Anakin wasn't the ONLY character who fell in this movie. Padme did too. We're supposed to feel sorry for them to a degree, but we were all supposed to shake our heads and "tsk-tsk'd" her decision to "fall in love" with Anakin at the end of AOTC.
Tragic characters have MAJOR faults. Yes, it DOES suck that these once heroes became less than heroic. But that is what the film is all about.
We're NOT SUPPOSED TO ADMIRE their decisions.
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RamRed
Registered:
May '02
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Date Posted:
1/4/06 1:54pm
Subject:
RE: Did Lucas betray Padme?
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Lyvia posted:
Oh pleas that's lame and you know it. THe woman just gives up without a fight because her husband is an bastard! She was completely pathetic in ROTS and Lucas needed her to die so he pulled a bogus death out of his butt. THere are a dozen better ways for that girl to have died besides....well that absolutely lack of reason in the movie. She could have suffered worse injuries from Anakin, could have died of natural childbirth because she wasn't on Coruscant, she could have had the decision to save her self or have a life threatening surgery to save her children but it would kill her. There are so many better ways for this to have been dealt with than she being a pathetic, selfish woman who abandons her children because her husband force chokes her. This woman is not the mother of Princess Leia who fights for every moment; even short and soft Luke has more fight than Padme. I dont think Lucas betrayed her I think he just got lazy.
No, I think that the complaints about Padme in Episode III are lame. It really astounds me that many had expected her to be some kind of female Action Jackson when she was in her last trimester. What were you expecting? For her to die while fighting?
And who in the hell are you to judge her as being selfish? Good grief! I hate it when people expect a writer to project their own morals and expectations in a character! What the **** did you expect? Trust me, I have committed this sin myself and it's not worth it.
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G-FETT
Registered:
Aug '01
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Date Posted:
1/4/06 2:35pm
Subject:
RE: Did Lucas betray Padme?
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darth-sinister posted:
Lucas has said that not only is Star Wars about the son redeeming the father, but is about the daughter redeeming the mother. It's fathers, sons, mothers & daughters. Family. Padme's death serves as the death of hope and liberty. She was one of the bright spots and now she is lost. Tragedy and darkness engulf the galaxy. Matters are worse.
Padme goes from being totally unselfish to totally selfish. She's too attached to Anakin, just as he was to her. They both die, only one is literal and one is a metaphysical/pyschological death. Padme cannot adapt to the idea of life without her husband. And as Lucas said in 1999, if you cannot adapt, you die.
Thats right Sinister, you've it nailed what Lucas was saying with Padme's death. For me, after seeing her demise several times now, it's actually the thing about that gets MORE tragic the more times you see. 
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