darth-sinister posted: darth_frared posted:if you only give respect when it's earned, how can people respect you in social conduct because they have to prove first how worthy they are of your respect. that's kind of gang mentality, isn't it? if i walk into a shop i want to be respected as a person and a customer, i know when this is being hurt, when people suddenly decide they could just invade my privacy and stuff. and likewise, others are asking the same of me. without me knowing them. it's basic. It's a result of trust and respect being given freely, only to turn around and be slapped in the face by betrayal. You have two ways to go. Either continue to do this or adapt by earning respect and trust. Besides and not to speak badly of you, but how do you know everyone respects you? I'm not talking about your family and friends or your co-workers. I'm talking about people in general. Total strangers. They may be polite to your face, but that doesn't mean that they respect you. Hell, you can fake respect.
darth_frared posted:if you only give respect when it's earned, how can people respect you in social conduct because they have to prove first how worthy they are of your respect. that's kind of gang mentality, isn't it? if i walk into a shop i want to be respected as a person and a customer, i know when this is being hurt, when people suddenly decide they could just invade my privacy and stuff. and likewise, others are asking the same of me. without me knowing them. it's basic.
darth-sinister posted:I'm talking about people in general. Total strangers. They may be polite to your face, but that doesn't mean that they respect you. Hell, you can fake respect.
PMT99 posted:Killing the Jedi was NOT part of the prophecy because just like what Hurricane Katrina did to the state of New Orleans, it threw the Force further off balance.
Dezdmona posted:My personal (and professional) philosophy is: “I will trust you...and I have faith in your abilities, This is our starting point - opportunity. ....unless you give me a reason not to.” If you violate my trust, there will be consequences. This does not mean I have lost faith in your abilities, but you will have to earn my trust again.
... posted: Call it a different POV, but I find that people who start from a position of having to earn their way to trust perceive themselves as being distrusted by others.
DT421 posted: I always love how people refer to Obi’s situation with Maul, as some sort of be-all, end-all template for how Luke should have handled his situation. Obi did what he had to do. He calmed his mind and followed his instincts. Guess what, so did Luke and it looks like the Force wanted Luke to do things differently than what Obi did.
DT421 posted:We know enough, seeing that Lucas tells us that he wasn’t equipped enough: "I think it is obvious that [Qui-Gon] was wrong in Episode I and made a dangerous decision, but ultimately this decision may be correct. The “phantom menace” refers to the force of the dark side of the universe. Anakin will be taken over by dark forces which in turn destroy the balance of the Galaxy, but the individual who kills the Emperor is Darth Vader—also Anakin. The tale meanders and both the prediction and Qui-Gon are correct—Anakin is the chosen one, and he did bring peace at last with his own sacrifice. Luke couldn't kill the Emperor himself, but he could make Anakin reflect on his life and kill the Emperor." -— George Lucas, Cut Magazine, 1999
DT421 posted:"In coming back to see Yoda, we have to figure out Luke’s training and the fact that he never finished his training, and that obviously now he’s got a big question he wants answered. There is a point where the hero has to be left alone on his own two feet without anybody there to help him. And you can sort of have him be in a different place or something, but at some point you have to say well now all the props have been taken away, and he has to face the evil monster alone. In this case, the scene establishes that the evil monster is actually his father, and he’s going to have to do it upon his own, and that he’s really not equipped to do it. That he was too impatient, he didn’t finish his studies, and now he’s going to be half trained to face a difficult physical and emotional challenge." -- George Lucas, DVD Commentary, Star Wars: Return of the Jedi, 2004 And seeing how the Emperor knew how to exploit and destroy the Jedi Order, it stands to reason that he also knows how Luke can destroy the Sith. He even tries to undercut Luke’s means for doing so, by telling Vader that “compassion” will be Luke’s “undoing”. Crafty manipulator, that Sidious.
DT421 posted:They trained Luke to do the Force’s Will – to listen to it, to have it as his ally and to trust his feeling and instincts. They weren’t worried about Luke’s power. Focusing on power seems to be something that a Sith would do.
DT421 posted:EMPEROR: You want this, don't you? The hate is swelling in you now. Take your Jedi weapon. Use it. I am unarmed. Strike me down with it. Give in to your anger. With each passing moment, you make yourself more my servant. [...] EMPEROR: Good. I can feel your anger. I am defenseless. Take your weapon! Strike me down with all your hatred, and your journey towards the dark side will be complete. Luke can resist no longer. The lightsaber flies into his hand. He ignites it in an instant and swings at the Emperor. Vader's lightsaber flashes into view, blocking Luke's blow before it can reach the Emperor. The two blades spark at contact. Luke turns to fight his father.
PMT99 posted:What Luke did had nothing to do with the Force telling him what to do, it was his choice not to kill Vader.
PMT99 posted:Luke couldn't kill the Emperor because he didn't want to be consumed by the Dark Side. He even showed the Emperor that he won't give in by throwing away his lightsaber. It has nothing to do with Luke not being equipped enough to defeat the Emperor.
PMT99 posted:Too bad Sidious underestimated both Luke's resolve and Vader's attachment to Luke.
PMT99 posted:There's a difference between listening to the Force and being controlled by it. Even as Obi-wan/Yoda wanted Luke to use the Force, they also want him to follow the oath as many Jedi before him have done...to be the defenders of peace and justice in the galaxy. In order for Luke to do that, they would want him to end the oppression of the Sith like Mace Windu tried to do in ROTS which is why Yoda tells Luke, "Only a fully trained Jedi Knight with the Force as his ally, will conquer Vader and his Emperor." If Obi-wan and Yoda weren't concerned about Luke's power, then they have no reason to believe that he can't destroy the Sith by himself.
PMT99 posted:According to the Return of the Jedi novelization, Darth Vader stops Luke from killing the Emperor because he felt that Luke hasn't fully embraced the Dark Side and he would want Luke to use the Dark Side so that they could kill the Emperor together just like he told him in ESB.
darth-sinister posted:The Jedi were going to be wiped out by Palpatine's machinations, unless they adapted. All Anakin did was betray Jedi and aided in the Purge. Balance is just getting rid of Sidious. As Lucas said of Palpatine's voice changes during the knighting scene, this is the first time the Dark Side is unbalanced and flowing through a Dark Lord of the Sith. It's free and unrestrained. Killing him and Anakin's own death restores the balance. Check the most recent issue of Star Wars Insider's "Ask The Master".
DT421 posted:He’s half trained and unable to kill the Emperor. What, he’s going to gain “magic points” by killing Vader, without anger, thereby giving him the power to kill the Emperor?
DT421 posted: It was Luke’s choice to be compassionate LUKE: Vader. Is the dark side stronger? YODA: No...no...no. Quicker, easier, more seductive. LUKE: But how am I to know the good side from the bad? YODA: You will know. When you are calm, at peace. Passive. A Jedi uses the Force for knowledge and defense, never for attack. Please tell me that this isn’t exactly what Luke does in that moment.
DT421 posted:The Emperor didn’t underestimate the Skywalker’s. He fears Luke greatly and even has to question Vader’s state of mind, to keep him in check. His weakness was being overconfident in thinking he could manipulate the situation.
DT421 posted:Follow an oath? It was the Jedi’s strict adherence to ‘oaths’, or Codes, the “Jedi Way” and the reluctance to change, that helped to get them purged. And the emphasis is on “with the Force as his ally”. The Force was not the ally of the Jedi in the PT. They stopped following Codes and started following the Living Force – making the Force their ally… again. And the Jedi are never shown to covet Luke’s power. Resisting the Dark Side, listening to the Force and having compassion for evil, takes self-discipline – not power. This is what Luke needed to “conquer” Vader. Compassion - not power. That seems more Jedi-like.
DT421 posted:Well, it’s a good thing that I went to the theater to see a movie and not a book reading, when I saw ROTJ, because the “hate” was “swelling” in Luke and he gave into it – not completely, but it IS why Luke tried to strike the Emperor down.
