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Topic:
Suicidal Obi-Wan?
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LeeKenobi
Registered:
Aug '02
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Date Posted:
1/19/06 8:06am
Subject:
Suicidal Obi-Wan?
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Mustafar. Obi-Wan has been tasked to destroy the Sith by taking down the kid he trained for 13 years. He knows he's outmatched, that Anakin is the better fighter (notice how throughout the duel, he gives ground to Anakin, taking a more defensive stance)
But what happens? He moves to the most dangerous place of all. Instead of continuing the fight inside the protected walls of the structures, he moves outside. And Anakin dumbly follows.
Here's how I see it---Obi-Wan in his heart doesn't want to take Anakin down, which is why throughout the duel, he keeps trying to turn Anakin away from the Sith. So he simply stops trying. He has Anakin follow him into the volcanic hot spots (such as going backwards across the narrow pipes) and let the environment destroy both of them.
That Kenobi survived Mustafar was a fluke--he was never expecting it. He didn't want to have the kid's death on his conscience, and he was wanting to die. However he survived and didn't want to--which, I believe, would help to explain why it was Vader who killed Anakin. He blamed himself for years.
a better treatment of this can be found here
http://www.stardestroyer.net/ROTS/Revelations-1.html
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Darth Nemesis
Registered:
May '99
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Date Posted:
1/19/06 8:12am
Subject:
RE: Suicidal Obi-Wan?
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I don't think he wanted to die, he just wasn't afraid of it. I think he knew that saber to saber, he was outmatched, so he used the enviornment to his advantage. And it worked. Obi Wan knew that his main task was to destroy Anakin, and that if it meant sacrificing himself to do so, he was OK with that. As evidenced by Obi Wan sacrificing himself on the DS in ANH so Luke and friends could escape.
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Pumpkin_King
Registered:
Oct '03
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Date Posted:
1/19/06 8:22am
Subject:
RE: Suicidal Obi-Wan?
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Obi-wan went to Mustafar for two reasons. Because it was his duty as a Jedi to stop the Sith if he could, and more importantly, because he owed it to his love for Anakin to be the one who puts him down.
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An emptiness began to grow
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Icestar63
Registered:
Nov '05
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Date Posted:
1/19/06 8:52am
Subject:
RE: Suicidal Obi-Wan?
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Obi-wan went to duel Anakin because he had to stop him and Obi-wan was not out matched they were equel. 
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Why so serious?
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LeeKenobi
Registered:
Aug '02
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Date Posted:
1/19/06 8:56am
Subject:
RE: Suicidal Obi-Wan?
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Icestar63 posted:
Obi-wan went to duel Anakin because he had to stop him and Obi-wan was not out matched they were equel.
THen why does Obi-Wan continually give ground and then go outside to where the lava bursts would give Anakin something to worry about?
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Icestar63
Registered:
Nov '05
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Date Posted:
1/19/06 9:03am
Subject:
RE: Suicidal Obi-Wan?
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LeeKenobi posted:
Icestar63 posted:
Obi-wan went to duel Anakin because he had to stop him and Obi-wan was not out matched they were equel.
THen why does Obi-Wan continually give ground and then go outside to where the lava bursts would give Anakin something to worry about?
Because he is a defensive fighter and he has to wait for the right moment to attack Anakin because a jedi defends
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Why so serious?
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LeeKenobi
Registered:
Aug '02
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Date Posted:
1/19/06 9:10am
Subject:
RE: Suicidal Obi-Wan?
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Icestar63 posted:
because a jedi defends
Yeah. Yoda was sure defensive when he knocked out Palps' guards by slamming them against the wall.
Or when he threw Palpy across the room and into his chair.
Then at the beginning---it was Obi-Wan who engaged Dooku, by being the first to ignite his saber.
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Icestar63
Registered:
Nov '05
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Date Posted:
1/19/06 9:24am
Subject:
RE: Suicidal Obi-Wan?
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LeeKenobi posted:
Icestar63 posted:
because a jedi defends
Yeah. Yoda was sure defensive when he knocked out Palps' guards by slamming them against the wall.
Or when he threw Palpy across the room and into his chair.
Then at the beginning---it was Obi-Wan who engaged Dooku, by being the first to ignite his saber.
igniting your lightsaber does not mean your are on the offensive. The battle was going to start anyway. Like I said a jedi waits to be on the offensive like Yoda did. There were times like the force push were Obi-wan chose to be on the offensive and then choose to go back to defensive.
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Why so serious?
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DUGGY
Registered:
Apr '05
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Date Posted:
1/19/06 9:35am
Subject:
RE: Suicidal Obi-Wan?
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That Kenobi survived Mustafar was a fluke--he was never expecting it. He didn't want to have the kid's death on his conscience, and he was wanting to die. However he survived and didn't want to--which, I believe, would help to explain why it was Vader who killed Anakin. He blamed himself for years.
It was Vader who killed Anakin. Vader has always been in Anakin. the Greedy, selfish , arrogant , lusting for power side of Anakin. that is Vader , and Palpatine set him free. and he killed Anakin Skywalker. metephorically it is 100% true. when given the opportunity and power he always wanted , Vader rules, and Anakin never had a chance. as for ObiWan, i Agree he does not want to kill Anakin. but he will Kill Anakin. he is a Jedi first and foremost. his duty is to the Force and Anakin represents a threat to everything ObiWan believes. " I will do what i must", Anakin made his choice. that does not mean that ObiWan does not feel responsible for Anakin's failure as a Jedi. what Mentor wouldn't. but he will do what must be done. but he never wanted to die. he likely never thought about that. he had " a Job to do " 
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Veloz
Registered:
Aug '04
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Date Posted:
1/19/06 9:42am
Subject:
RE: Suicidal Obi-Wan?
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Darth Nemesis posted:
I don't think he wanted to die, he just wasn't afraid of it. I think he knew that saber to saber, he was outmatched, so he used the enviornment to his advantage. And it worked. Obi Wan knew that his main task was to destroy Anakin, and that if it meant sacrificing himself to do so, he was OK with that. As evidenced by Obi Wan sacrificing himself on the DS in ANH so Luke and friends could escape.
I agree with u there 
It wasnt a "fluke" Obi Wan survived  . He was a smart jedi master who stayed more centered and focused on the duel, in contrast to Vader who let his emotions get the best of him. Obi Wan's fighting style is defensive.. he was naturally patient because of this so he just stayed with Vader until he saw an openning and took it. No "fluke" in that imo.
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"Remember the Force will be with you..always" - Obi Wan Kenobi, ANH
"Who's the more foolish...the fool or the fool who follows him?"- Obi Wan Kenobi, ANH
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Icestar63
Registered:
Nov '05
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Date Posted:
1/19/06 9:51am
Subject:
RE: Suicidal Obi-Wan?
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Veloz posted:
Darth Nemesis posted:
I don't think he wanted to die, he just wasn't afraid of it. I think he knew that saber to saber, he was outmatched, so he used the enviornment to his advantage. And it worked. Obi Wan knew that his main task was to destroy Anakin, and that if it meant sacrificing himself to do so, he was OK with that. As evidenced by Obi Wan sacrificing himself on the DS in ANH so Luke and friends could escape.
I agree with u there
It wasnt a "fluke" Obi Wan survived . He was a smart jedi master who stayed more centered and focused on the duel, in contrast to Vader who let his emotions get the best of him. Obi Wan's fighting style is defensive.. he was naturally patient because of this so he just stayed with Vader until he saw an openning and took it. No "fluke" in that imo.
I agree with you. It was not a "fluke" it was the will of the force.
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Why so serious?
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DarthJiangWei
Registered:
Nov '05
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Date Posted:
1/19/06 10:38am
Subject:
RE: Suicidal Obi-Wan?
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They were equals. Obi-Wan was giving ground because he truly did not want to kill Anakin. Anakin uses the Offensive Lightsaber Form: Shien while Obi-Wan uses the defensive style: Soresu. Dont you see that Obi-Wan only starts truly fighting Anakin after he thinks Anakin fell over the lavafall? He sees there that even though he came super close to dying there, Anakin still wasnt giving up and when Anakin says that he thinks the Jedi are evil thats when Obi-Wan (according to the novel) lets go of Anakin and the memories and truly starts fighting. They were equal and it is not true that Jedi are always on the defensive, look at Qui-Gon and Maul, YOda and Sidious as someone pointed out. The Jedi do what must be done. They dont care if theyre offensive or defensive, theyre doing it for the good of the Republic. He didnt choose to cut Anakin like he did. He intended to kill him there. He left because he did not want to blame himself for Anakin's death. He must have been thinking he wouldnt have it on his conscience because the fire would kill Anakin not him. Obi-Wan wasnt suicidal. If he was suiciadal he would tackled Anakin and they would have both fallen in. If he was suicidal he wouldnt have gone to the high ground because its safer there than on that droid platform. So no he wasnt intending on dying on Mustafar.
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"All who have power are afraid to lose it!"-Palpatine/Sidious
"You turned her against me!"-Darth Vader
"Rejoice for those who transform into the Force. Mourn them
Do not, miss them do not." Yoda
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dont_be_a_vaderhater
Registered:
Jan '06
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Date Posted:
1/19/06 10:52am
Subject:
RE: Suicidal Obi-Wan?
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At the very least, like Luke in ROTJ, he was'nt afraid to die....
if that is what his destiny was.
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the waterboy.... the boy with the bucket.... if ya did'nt want the job.... you should not a took it
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DUGGY
Registered:
Apr '05
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Date Posted:
1/19/06 10:55am
Subject:
RE: Suicidal Obi-Wan?
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dont_be_a_vaderhater posted:
At the very least, like Luke in ROTJ, he was'nt afraid to die....
if that is what his destiny was.
exactly. if Jedi are taught to " Rejoice for those around you that transform into the Force ", then i doubt fear for his own life was ever on Obi mind.
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darth-sinister
Title: Manager Emeritus
Registered:
Jun '01
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Date Posted:
1/19/06 11:07am
Subject:
RE: Suicidal Obi-Wan?
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Obi-wan went outside because he couldn't keep fighting in the limited space, not if he wanted to survive this fight. The tables and equipment were getting in the way. He didn't know that the sheilds were shut down by their blows, until they lava started to rain down on them from that burst.
Yoda used a Force push on the Imperial Guard because they moved into attack position. And he ignited his saber first on Palpatine, after the Dark Lord blasted him with Sith Lightning and a Force shove. With the exception of Luke, every Lightsaber usually starts with the Sith drawing their Lightsabers first and igniting them. If the Jedi have ignited their's first it's because they're going into arrest mode or have taken a defensive position.
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Luke_SW
Registered:
Apr '03
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Date Posted:
1/19/06 12:48pm
Subject:
RE: Suicidal Obi-Wan?
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your post sounds silly
Anakin was fighting very aggressively and Obi-Wan probably didn't have time to think about where to take the fight in a place he'd never been before
If he did CHOOSE to go outside it was probably to give himself more space
Obi-Wan took Anakin down as soon as he was able to
Remember how mercilessly he tried to strike down on him when Anakin was on his back inside the building when Anakin had dropped his saber?
Obi-Wan was a professional and a disciplined Jedi
"I will do what I must"
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