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Author	Topic: The Game Designers Guild
NickLitYouAFlame Registered: Feb '07	Date Posted: 2/17 10:39pm Subject: RE: The Game Designers Guild
	Fantastic, Sephy. Thanks for the ideas. I am going to wait a few days, let this OP be seen by all and then, hopefully, start it up. -----signature----- I love Matt's "As Father And Son." I've written my best in that game.
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Imperial_Hammer Title: Manager: • SWRPF • NSWRPF • RPR Registered: Sep '04	Date Posted: 2/23 1:06am Subject: RE: The Game Designers Guild
	Hey alls.... I'm going to be doing a round of updates this weekend, so look for one here pretty soon. Get any points you want to get in out before this ship sails for her next port. Thanks! -I_H -----signature----- Guildmaster of the GDG Now looking for a new RPF Adoptee NaboosPrincess The Jedi Way is something found within, not in the dead walls of any Order
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Imperial_Hammer Title: Manager: • SWRPF • NSWRPF • RPR Registered: Sep '04	Date Posted: 2/24 8:26pm Subject: RE: The Game Designers Guild - Date Edited: 2/24 8:27pm (1 edits total) Edited By: Imperial_Hammer
	*Game Designers Guild News* Volume 16: Number 2 *Full Roster* Full Members - Reynar_Tedros - SephyCloneNo15 - Winged_Jedi - Darth_Vaders_cousin - Penguinator-176 - ObiWan21 - greyjedi125 - GraySaberFreque - DarthIntegral - dontlookatmethatway - Rayson - Prj1 - Mango_Salsa - Pheonix_Rising - jedi_withouta_clue77 - Trimaj - Jango10 - HandofSkywalker86 - DarthValorous - darth_nemisis - Arclite - Sinrebirth - Star_Rocker - JEDI_TEEGIRLOO - Evil_King_Wiggins - Hammurabi - Saintheart - Burning_Hatred - Ikaika2884 - BLemelisk - Blubeast1237 - RebellionSoldier - Blade_Of_Silver - DarkLordoftheFins - RZion - KIRA-SHAY - DarthCemeroX - LordTroepfchen - Sentinel001 - TheSithGirly - _fragout_ - -Remi- - Darth_Brutus666 - Phantasmagoria Partial Members (Add the GDG to your Sig or Bio!) - Checked 6/22/07 - Darth_Walters - Despised1 - YoungAngus - agap_afima - CT-13438 - DarthSeti5 - StarwarsFreak444 - ewok_jedi - MASTERPRENN - Zandoran_Celix - Master_Kast7 - Beta-Commando - SwordofRaditz - Nicklityouaflame Always Accepting Membership!!! *News* -One more Operation Table for Winged Jedi's new game! *Agenda* Now - The Operation Table: ECHO Next - Genre Discussion: Society Builder Games Later - Formative Discussion: Society Builder Games - GDG Contest: Topic to Be Announced Always Accepting Agenda Items!!! * The Operating Table * A large round of applause for Winged_Jedi for putting the newest version of his legendary ECHO game for discussion! He had nice HTML to it, but as it was PMed, I couldn't copy-paste it. ECHO Let me tell you an old myth that the storytellers used to tell me, when I would sit and ask to hear them. A long, long time ago, when the galaxy was still young, fantastic creatures of wonder and majesty inhabited the infant worlds. Lords of all they surveyed were the archangels, luminous beings of unparalled grace and godlike power. Their rule was both just and fair. But power, even when justly used, attracts hate and jealousy. A craven band of sorcerors gathered in unholy conspiracy, united in their envy of their masters. These cowardly alchemists secretly crafted a vicious poison that would rob the noble archangels of their divinity. When their evil creation was prepared and ready, the alchemists invited the archangels to a magnificent banquet. The wine at the banquet had been laced with the foul poison, and as the archangels drank, their strength faded away into nothingness. They became weak, fragile…mortal. The alchemists rejoiced and sneered at their fallen foes, but their wicked actions would have terrible consquences. The planets began to decay without the archangels to watch over them. Creatures began to turn upon each other instead of living in harmony. The galaxy slipped into chaos and anarchy. The gods had been maimed, and everyone suffered the consequences. My son, all things move in circles. The year is 400 ABY. The Fourth Galactic Republic (also known as The Restored Republic) controls most of the known galaxy. On Zonama Sekot, a team of researchers have discovered a strange plant known as Echo. From this plant they have extracted a chemical, which in turn has led to the development of a very special serum. The Echo serum, when injected into a subject, permanently prevents use of the Force. This momentous discovery has led to a shocking outcome. The Jedi Order, long the protectors of peace and justice, have been betrayed. A daring coalition of Republican Senators have begun the Equality Through Echo campaign, a mission to use the new serum on every sentient in the galaxy. Too many times, they argue, the peace has been torn apart by rogue darksiders or by Jedi civil wars. Not only will Echo end that threat forever, it would remove the 'monstrous inequality of the Force'. Opinion polls across the Republic show an overwhelming support for Echo, and an extraordinary wave of propaganda and hate has built up against the Jedi, who find themselves despised by the very beings they served. This is a turning point for the galaxy. The Jedi and their few remaining allies are making one final attempt to stop or at least stall the Project before the Senators make their decision. But the temple on Coruscant is being voluntarily abandoned even as the Senate assembles, and the outcome seems inevitable. The year is 500 ABY. The Fourth Galactic Republic appears to have entered a new golden age after an era of much turmoil. The Jedi Order is long dead, having been crushed in the bloody and prolonged Echo Purge one hundred years ago. On the edges of the Outer Rim, a young and violent group of marauders has begun wreaking havoc on world after world. They are an exceptional danger even by the standards of the Outer Rim, but there are whispers that these youths are even more dangerous than anyone can yet comprehend. These young criminals are calling themselves Sith Lords. They are as talented in the Force as anyone the galaxy has ever seen. Most importantly, they are naturally immune to Echo. The Republic have acted immediately to quiet these rumours, fully aware of the panic that would sweep through the galaxy. The Echo Project is their crowning glory- to see it consigned to history by these new Sith is something they cannot contemplate, and they are hurriedly preparing for war. It may be too late for the Republic, and too late for Echo. The Force itself has been wounded, and now it is fighting back. It has forged the tools for its revenge- these young Sith are an entire breed of Chosen Ones, and their wrath will tear the galaxy apart. The year is 600 ABY. And the events of the past two centuries have left their legacy… Welcome to ECHO. This game will span three eras simultaneously. In effect, three distinct but interconnected games will be going on within one overall frame. Era One is the 400 ABY setting. Here events will revolve around the start of the Echo project and the ensuing Echo Purge. Era Two is the 500 ABY setting. Here events will revolve around the rise of the Echo-immune Sith and the response of the Republic. Era Three is the 600 ABY setting. Here things are rather…mysterious. This era is closed off to players at the start of the game. Gameplay There is a maximum of two characters per player. These characters may be active in the same era or in different ones. If you wish to play in Era One: The ultimate events of this era are largely predetermined. Your character will be randomly assigned a Fate. Your Fate is a brief and fairly vague description of what your character will eventually become. Some Fates may be interpreted in different ways. It up to you to decide how you wish to bring your Fate about. It is a restriction of sorts, but with a certain amount of freedom. Your destination is set, but you choose the journey. If you wish to play in Era Two: The ultimate events of this era are entirely up to you. Players in this era will NOT be assigned Fates. This era will also be influenced by events in Era One (exactly what this means will become apparent as we play). If you wish to play in Era Three: Patience. wink The New Sith This faction consists of the Echo-immune youths referred to in Era Two. The reason I have reserved a special section for them within this opening post is because they are very, very unique characters. If you wish to play as one of them (and I think it will be a lot of fun to do so) then you must read this section. In this era, the Force has created a whole bunch of Chosen Ones, all of whom are immune to Echo and all of whom are at Skywalker levels of power. These are the new Sith. However, the power comes at a price. The new Sith are highly, highly unstable, both physically and mentally. Their bodies and minds simply cannot cope with the load. Physical effects: They are prone to sudden bouts of utter exhaustion and have a much shorter lifespan than the norm for their respective species. I warn you now that some of the Sith will die from sheer burnout as the game progresses. Mental effects: Here’s where it gets interesting. Each of the new Sith is mentally fractured. Each one has two distinct personalities inside their head. Therefore, if you wish to play as one of the new Sith, you will be paired up with another player, and together you will play a single character with two personalities. Let me explain how this will work in practice: Start off by PMing a sheet to me as if this were a normal character. I will then pair you up with another player. A spot of collaboration is then needed. You will have to change your sheet’s physical details such as gender, appearance and species so that they match your partner’s. You can work this out between you. The name and bio in your sheet DO NOT need to be changed. After that, no further collaboration is needed. None whatsoever. Say I have one player as Darth Dastardly and another as Darth Dangerous: two personalities within the same mind. The single character will be referred to by myself and others as Dastardly/Dangerous. We will always tag both personalities. Whichever personality responds to the tag is simply down to whichever player replies first. So if Dastardly’s player responds, then the character will speak and act as if the Dastardly personality is in control. Next time there’s a tag, Dangerous might respond first, reflecting an IC handover of power within the mind of the character. You do not have to split the character equally between you. If Dastardly’s player is away on holiday then Dangerous will naturally do all the responding. If Dangerous only posts every few days but Dastardly posts every hour then obviously Dastardly will be the more dominant personality. Note, however, that you should not be too dominant. If you feel you are unfairly hogging all the responses for the character then let your partner respond to a few. In IC terms, this will allow for some interestingly inconsistent and complex characters. Their may be a few hiccups while people get used to things, but I’m sure it will work out. Character Sheet Era: (One or Two) Name: Species: Gender: Allegiance: * Age: Appearance: Personality: Bio: No Sith allowed in Era One. No Jedi allowed in Era Two. If you wish to play in Era Two as one of the Sith , note that you can be no older than 25. And Finally Though this game is centered around galactic conflict there will be plenty of times when war will merely provide the backdrop for other subplots. There are many activities to pursue in a galaxy this big. From podracing to theatre to music, anything you want you can go for. On a purely personal note, this game means a lot to me as it is the culmination of a lot of planning. It has not simply been thrown together in a hurry- the first draft was written about a year ago. Since then I have incorporated several new ideas. I’ve been at the RPF a long time, but I sincerely hope that this is will be one of the most successful games I am associated with. Rules 1. Obey the TOS. No swearing, no flaming, no baiting, no trolling. 2. GM is law 3. Please read this opening post carefully 4. PM me your sheets before you post them As usual, some points to think about... The Story Do you like the idea of Echo? Is it appealing for players? Is the story clear enough? The Split Minds and Fates System Is this split-minds thing good or bad? Is it a smart-idea to have players working together so closely? Is the pre-set destiny system attractive to players? Dual Track History Is this a smart thing? Will it be too confusing for gameplay? Will tying a simultaneous past and future prove impossible? Technicals Are the rules done well? Is the sheet done well? Overview Is the aim of the game a good one? Is it an attractive subject manner? What are the strengths and weaknesses to this game? And a final reminder to keep things civil, polite, and TOS friendly in the review process! Props! -I_H -----signature----- Guildmaster of the GDG Now looking for a new RPF Adoptee* NaboosPrincess The Jedi Way is something found within, not in the dead walls of any Order
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Saintheart Title: Manager and Wandering Swordsman of the RPF Registered: Dec '00	Date Posted: 2/24 9:24pm Subject: RE: The Game Designers Guild
	Do you like the idea of Echo? Is it appealing for players? I do like the idea. Only aspect that slightly turns me off is the "Fourth Galactic Republic" aspect -- greatest respect to Wings, but that sounds like a Legacy retread to me. The Old Republic lasted for a thousand generations, and I'd always had the impression that the Empire was a really unlikely aberration in its history. Why would it be the Fourth? Is there something really significant in the title other than to add a bit of icing on the cake? What happened to the Third Republic? Why can't it still be the New Republic, albeit having evolved over another 500-odd years or more? Is the story clear enough? Yes. This is the refined version of Wings' "Archangels and Alchemists" game, which I understood was pretty well-received though I didn't get to play it myself. Even knowing nothing of that story, this one is clear enough to follow, with no Barry Sue characters wandering through the script unnecessarily. Is this split-minds thing good or bad? Just like Janus: good and bad, and I think you can only weigh up the pros and cons. Pros: hugely innovative for these boards, where two people get to play the one character. Would be, I think, a joy to play for some of our "married" couples on the boards, since it allows for cooperation and teamwork with one other person. Cons: I've noticed a sad tendency for a number of roleplayers to go "lone wolf" with their characters, so this aspect would be one heck of a challenge for them. Secondly, there's the permanent risk of winding up with half a mind when one player decides Battlefront II is more interesting. Thirdly, whilst I've no doubt this will intrigue and attract our "serious" players, I'm a bit worried about the Chosen One level of power put into the hands of two "wilful n00bs", as I coin the phrase. Is it a smart-idea to have players working together so closely? I think this is actually really good, and the RPGs need more of it. I think the risks are actually semi-low of a major falling-out between couples over something like this. On the other hand, Wings explicitly stating that there doesn't need to be consistency between players might cause some aggravation...? Is the pre-set destiny system attractive to players? It'll work for some, but not for others. I'm assuming that its inclusion here was the result of a positive response to the concept on Wings' "Orphans of Ossus" RPG, so it'll appeal. Having said that these characters are going to need some major roleplaying ability all round, I think. Dual Track History: Is this a smart thing? Will it be too confusing for gameplay? I remember there was once a similar attempt to do something like this in the Lord of the Rings milieu, with (in the same thread) an RPG of the Last Battle between the elves and Sauron, and an RPG at the end of the Third Age. That foundered (IMHHO) because it was difficult to separate the two eras for players; the main problem to watch for here will be posts getting thrown in without a reference to their era. I suspect making players put a colour-coded header at the top of a post might assist with that aspect, so people can skip over the ones that don't apply, but if you've got players with characters in both eras you'll have them posting for both. It's post-hunting that will be the biggest problem if this RPG proves wildly popular. It's also hugely taxing for Wings, but if he wants the level of work involved, all power to him. Will tying a simultaneous past and future prove impossible? No. There's time enough between the two eras that even huge galaxy-altering events will have time to peter out between eras. It'll be exquisite if players really buy into the concept and start referencing events from the old era in the new one (provided the "old" events are sufficiently significant.) Are the rules done well? A bit of formatty goodness might assist with the breakup, but otherwise the cylinders all seem to be firing. Is the sheet done well? It's a sheet from the LS_A school of character sheets: little detail so you can develop your character as you go. Which, given the scale of this thing, is probably appropriate. Is the aim of the game a good one? It's a bloody solid attempt at creating a more innovative RPG on the boards, and full power to Wings for bringing it on. In particular the unrevealed "third act" is a good inclusion; it gives people something to be intrigued about and hang in there to play it longer. Is it an attractive subject manner? So here we're talking about the Echo virus here, huh? Well, how is it any less attractive than the X-Men thing of "curing" mutants? Why not? It's been done many times before, and the moral questions are still excellent regardless of who's asking. The Act Two "Age of Darkness" thing has the capacity to get dark and depressing, but hopefully not morbidly so. What are the strengths and weaknesses to this game? Innovative but complex. Experienced roleplayers will love it but newbies might get confused. I love the idea, but I'm way too busy to be in it. -----signature----- Michelle: my Italian queen, my angel, my reason, my wife. Jessica: my little princess, my daughter, born 10 August 2007 Director -- Star Wars: Knighthood
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Jango10 Registered: Sep '02	Date Posted: 2/25 3:54pm Subject: RE: The Game Designers Guild
	I love the idea of two different eras being played at once. That way, even the players playing in era two can react to the events of era one. I also like the idea of fates. I like RPs that work toward a climax instead of being open ended. I think it is a cool concept that you know the ending to the story of your character, but it is up to you to decide how it gets there. It is kinda like in Lost, we know several of the castaways make it off the island, and they eventually begin regretting it. But how did they get off? How did they get into the condition they are in now? The same in this RP, they know how their character ends up, but we don't know how they get to that place and why. -----signature----- "I love the smell of Napalm in the morning." McCain/Palin '08
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Winged_Jedi Registered: Feb '03	Date Posted: 2/25 6:07pm Subject: RE: The Game Designers Guild
	Thanks very much for the feedback Saint- that sort of insight and analysis was exactly why I wanted to submit this to the GDG in the first place, helps me iron out the creases. Let's see if I can answer some of this stuff. Only aspect that slightly turns me off is the "Fourth Galactic Republic" aspect -- greatest respect to Wings, but that sounds like a Legacy retread to me. The Old Republic lasted for a thousand generations, and I'd always had the impression that the Empire was a really unlikely aberration in its history. Why would it be the Fourth? In all fairness, the Fourth Republic is a remnant from an earlier incarnation of this idea which I had before Legacy even existed. I guess there's no particular need for it to be the Fourth...I suppose I wanted to imply that not only have 400 years passed but a lot of stuff has been happening in that 400 years- a lot of war, a lot of power struggles, a lot of change in galactic governance. As will be revealed in game, the galaxy has not really known lasting peace for a long, long time, and people are really waking up to the fact that Force Users are at the heart of pretty much every major conflict the galaxy has ever known. And then Echo comes along. As an aside, I think after the Empire happened once, the chances of it happening again increased exponentially. The Post-ROTJ galaxy is probably not going to know more than two centuries of one government for a long time. Heck, only 130 years on from Endor and we have the Empire back in charge for the foreseeable future. We had the GFFA before that. And the New Republic before that. And who knows what we'll end up with after Krayt's Empire finally falls. I've noticed a sad tendency for a number of roleplayers to go "lone wolf" with their characters, so this aspect would be one heck of a challenge for them. Very true, but hopefully such players won't take the challenge on in the first place. This was part of the reason I kept this mechanic to a single faction rather than basing an entire game around it. If players are unsure about it, they are strongly advised to play other characters instead. I should make this more clear in the opening post. Secondly, there's the permanent risk of winding up with half a mind when one player decides Battlefront II is more interesting. Well, any prolonged absence could be explained IC by one personality simply becoming very dominant for a while. If it becomes permanent I will simply advertise for any interested players to fill the role, or fill it myself if necessary (in which case the character will be played a lot more like a normal character, with occasional GM intervention as the other personality). Thirdly, whilst I've no doubt this will intrigue and attract our "serious" players, I'm a bit worried about the Chosen One level of power put into the hands of two "wilful n00bs", as I coin the phrase. Well, such rookies will hopefully be weeded out during the approval phase. But if not, then the physical deterioration that comes with being a Sith in this game will be emphasized. Players who abuse their Sith's power will find themselves having exhaustion and burnout forced upon them. I think this is actually really good, and the RPGs need more of it. I think the risks are actually semi-low of a major falling-out between couples over something like this. On the other hand, Wings explicitly stating that there doesn't need to be consistency between players might cause some aggravation...? I think I phrased it too strongly. I just didn't want people to worry that they are needed to be constantly PMing or combining with their partner. There is a need for a basic level of co-operation, but it's more about courtesy and sharing the character than any active teamwork. It'll work for some, but not for others. I'm assuming that its inclusion here was the result of a positive response to the concept on Wings' "Orphans of Ossus" RPG, so it'll appeal. Having said that these characters are going to need some major roleplaying ability all round, I think. It will indeed need some good play, but hopefully I can guide anybody who finds it difficult to meet their destiny, so to speak. This feature was really included as a necessity to make the era thing work, as I wanted to know the ultimate events of Era One to include certain references in Era Two. I suspect making players put a colour-coded header at the top of a post might assist with that aspect, so people can skip over the ones that don't apply, but if you've got players with characters in both eras you'll have them posting for both. It's post-hunting that will be the biggest problem if this RPG proves wildly popular. Colour-coding will indeed be enforced, and very strictly. The only post-hunting problem I can foresee is if players are in the same location (say, Coruscant) in different eras. But the events in the two eras should be distinct enough to avoid confusion anyway. It's also hugely taxing for Wings, but if he wants the level of work involved, all power to him. I'm not going to rush into it, certainly, but I'm not sure it's as much work as it first appears. GMing two different time eras at once should not be much more difficult than GMing two different scenarios at once. The player roster will likely be kept small in any case (say a maximum of six per era). The Act Two "Age of Darkness" thing has the capacity to get dark and depressing, but hopefully not morbidly so. Yes, I did consider this, but upon reflection I actually think this will be more of a danger for Era One (what with the guaranteed destruction of the Jedi). Era Two sounds quite dark now, but I have a few surprises in store for it. I love the idea, but I'm way too busy to be in it. A great shame, but I understand and thanks for the feedback! Jango, thanks for your comments. The current situation in Lost is a perfect way of looking at the situation. We know a great deal about how some characters end up, and yet we're still completely in the dark as to how they got there. There's still a lot of freedom for the writers, as there will be for the players in this game. I also think Era One players will derive a certain satisfaction from seeing events they are yet to play out being subtly referenced in Era Two. -----signature----- "The noblest prospect which a Scotchman ever sees, is the high road that leads him to England!" -Samuel Johnson
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MASTERPRENN Title: JCC Man. Awesome Registered: Dec '05	Date Posted: 2/26 12:13pm Subject: RE: The Game Designers Guild
	Winged, it looks like a great game. I might get around to giving you some more feedback if I get done with school work sometime today, but for the most part, Saint brought up what I was going to. I'd be interested in playing. -----signature----- "When you see me, what do you see? I see a big bushy beard and hair." - Stephen Colbert discussing his inabilit to "see" race, with Cornel West
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Sinrebirth Registered: Nov '04	Date Posted: 2/26 12:22pm Subject: RE: The Game Designers Guild
	Winged, is this going to relate anything to the Archangels & Alchemists game? That was set in 600 ABY, I recall, correct? remembers it as his first RP very fondly -----signature----- Sey's Sinre The First Canon Apologist The Missing Chapters of LotF: Invincible http://boards.theforce.net/Message.aspx?topic=28933751&brd=10477&replies=10 Chapter 4.5 is up! Now Featuring: Niathal, Daala, Syal, Wedge, Winter & Tycho!
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Trimaj Registered: Jun '05	Date Posted: 2/27 11:53am Subject: RE: The Game Designers Guild
	now that looks like an amazing game. if i were to actually give it a rundown, i find that my sentiments would echo those of saintheart pretty thoroughly, so i'll just say that i agree with him, and the responses you gave to those comments clear things up well. looking forward to playing this one. :snoopy -----signature----- I'm just a figment of your imagination.
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JEDI_TEEGIRLOO Registered: May '05	Date Posted: 3/2 4:10pm Subject: RE: The Game Designers Guild
	drops in Winged, It looks great and I remember A & A being one of my first rp's as well. It helped me become a better rper. I also want to know what connections to A & A does Echo have? I may have some time to be in it. -----signature----- ~Darth Mystique~Dark Lady of the Sith~/Matriarch of the Witches of Dathomir "The Darkside is like a drug that i just cant get enough of." ~Mesh'la Par'jila ~ Prudii Verd - "Oya Manda! "
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Penguinator-176 Registered: May '05	Date Posted: 3/2 5:05pm Subject: RE: The Game Designers Guild
	This reminds me of the Seven Orphans of Ossus - and I like that fact very much. -----signature----- "Sweet, soft and low, I will poison you all - canary in a gilded cage." "Everything burns." . . GDG
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Hammurabi Registered: Jan '07	Date Posted: 3/10 1:25pm Subject: RE: The Game Designers Guild
	Oh, Winged, this looks like another jaw-droppingly awesome RP idea. I'll have to look it over in detail later, because I really haven't time for more than a quick read right now. But I'd just like to say that that's the coolest RP idea I've seen since Ossus. -----signature----- and i know no one can sing the blues like blind willie mctell
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darth_nemisis Registered: May '04	Date Posted: 3/10 5:14pm Subject: RE: The Game Designers Guild
	I don't think I am officially a member, but I would like to chime and say that I read that post for Winged_Jedi's RPG and I must say, that is why his games have always been among my favorites, if not my favorite games, that I've played while I've been around. This is very innovative, and I think it could work. I don't really have much to add onto what Saintheart said, especially since you countered his points. Though, I do think the two era aspect could get kind of confusing... I will definitely be playing this one, but I find myself trying to decide if I would want to play in Era 1 or Era 2...We all know I like Sith, but I wouldn't want to ruin anyone elses experience if I were to drop out for some reason. And I like the fates aspect of Era 1...Hmmm... The reason I came into this thread is because I have an idea for an RPG that I would like to see, but I am not sure if I want to run the RPG. I've never been much of a GM, and would rather have someone with more GM experience take it on. Has this been done before? Would anyone be interested in taking on an RPG from another member? -----signature----- ~Dark Lord - Acolytes of Darkness (SWC)~ My new homepage! http://www.aaronnemisis.com !~!~stormBoards now available~!~! http://stormboards.aaronnemisis.com/
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Saintheart Title: Manager and Wandering Swordsman of the RPF Registered: Dec '00	Date Posted: 3/10 5:19pm Subject: RE: The Game Designers Guild
	I think that pretty much amounts to universal Designers' Acclaim for Echo, Wings. On a semi-related note, I'd like to add a further item to the GDG agenda, if not hijack the thread to discuss a topic that at least partially sits within the game design area: Player numbers and Waiting Lists. Speaking for myself, one of the main reasons my RPGs tend not to finish is because I'll get overwhelmed by Darth RL issues -- but I've also come to realise recently that those problems are often heavily exacerbated by trying to post updates for an RPG which has way too many players for me to handle. I acknowledge it's entirely my own fault for taking on huge undertakings like I sometimes do, but I'm interested to see, from the Guild, some discussion on these topics: How many players is too many for your RPG? Do you design your RPG with a certain capacity in mind? Is there an optimal number of players to manage in a freeform RPG? Is this an important element of game design? How do you deal with people who want to join where you've got enough players already? I raise the topic mostly because for the first time in my GM career I've had to seriously restrict player numbers on one of my games. This is in the context of "A Tide of Flames" over on NSWRPG, which is a Dungeons and Dragons campaign. The campaign I'm running was originally designed to carry 4 characters comfortably, and I've decided (on LightWarden's well-reasoned advice) to cap the player numbers at 8. That's because, at least on the D&D GM'ing experience, when you start going over 8 player characters you start getting (a) truly massive battles with people having to wait quite a while before it's their turn; (b) credulity issues with a "small band of adventurers" of, say, 15 trying to sneak into enemy camps; and (c) having to seriously redesign encounters so your monsters aren't taken out by one salvo from the party's back line of archers. The idea of a waiting list I actually stole off Phantasmagoria's aborted "Titanomachy" game, where he mentioned the idea. I suspect strongly that he kept his player numbers capped for much the same reasons as I did: to keep it from spiralling wildly out of control. So now the question becomes: should we consider capping player numbers in our games -- especially if we're pressed for time? -----signature----- Michelle: my Italian queen, my angel, my reason, my wife. Jessica: my little princess, my daughter, born 10 August 2007 Director -- Star Wars: Knighthood
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NickLitYouAFlame Registered: Feb '07	Date Posted: 3/10 5:25pm Subject: RE: The Game Designers Guild
	I think that it is a good idea. Some games need to be capped. It is easier to please and work a smaller crowd. Plus, if you can handle it, you could always up the limit. -----signature----- I love Matt's "As Father And Son." I've written my best in that game.
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