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Topic:
The 101 Most Influential People Who Never Lived: 44. Buffy the Vampire Slayer
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Forcefire
Registered:
Jul '00
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Date Posted:
11/17/06 9:59am
Subject:
The 101 Most Influential People Who Never Lived: 44. Buffy the Vampire Slayer
- Date Edited:
11/29 10:56pm (57 edits total)
Edited By:
Zaz
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A few weeks ago I discovered the existence of this book, The 101 Most Influential People Who Never Lived, by Allan Lazar, Dan Karlan & Jeremy Salter. This is a list of characters from theater, literature, movies, and more that the authors feel have had an impact on our world.
I'd have to say that it's a bit fluffier than I would've liked, with more summary of the character than discussion of their influence. Some of the choices are a bit strange, as well, with characters that don't seem to so much influence people as sum up existing attitudes. We'll be getting to those.
Some things to keep in mind are that these guys have written this largely with a focus on American culture (there's an entire category of Americana). They also say they've tried to focus on influence over popularity (so no Darth Vader). Some people on the list are real, but we have more stories about them than solid facts.
So, let's get started.
Name: Paul Bunyan
Rank: 101
Category:Americana
In a nutshell: Giant lumberjack logs across America.
What the book says: "Paul Bunyan's can-do 'what's the next problem to solve' approach set the standard attitude for generations of Americans, in particular those who built the assembly line, carved Mount Rushmore, and created Hoover Dam."
What I say: I don't understand this choice. Certainly he sums up a certain American tendency toward big things and is a great example of a tall tale, but has anyone really changed their actions or way of thinking because of Paul Bunyan? I doubt it.
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"Dear Diary, today I was pompous and my sister was crazy.
Today we were kidnapped by hillfolk, never to be seen again.
It was the best day ever."
Jayne Cobb, the Hero of Canton
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Zaz
Title: Manager, The Ampitheatre
Registered:
Oct '98
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Date Posted:
11/17/06 12:18pm
Subject:
RE: The 101 Most Influential People Who Never Lived (101: Paul Bunyan)
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I suppose they think of him as an iconic figure, but I agree; it's an odd choice. Perhaps as a representative of the Protestant Work Ethic.
Bit out of style now, as chopping down forests is no longer seen as progressive.
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Zaz
Title: Manager, The Ampitheatre
Registered:
Oct '98
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Date Posted:
11/17/06 5:59pm
Subject:
RE: The 101 Most Influential People Who Never Lived (101: Paul Bunyan)
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Here's Wikipedia's take on it, which I found very interesting:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Bunyan_(lumberjack)
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dizfactor
Registered:
Aug '02
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Date Posted:
11/17/06 6:36pm
Subject:
RE: The 101 Most Influential People Who Never Lived (101: Paul Bunyan)
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Is Jesus #1 on the list? He should be.
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"Play is going to be for the 21st century what steam was to the 19th century."
Julian Dibbell
"You gotta love an elite killing force that you can fool by putting on a hat."
Gryph
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Rogue1-and-a-half
Title: Manager: Amphitheatre
Registered:
Nov '00
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Date Posted:
11/17/06 7:51pm
Subject:
RE: The 101 Most Influential People Who Never Lived (101: Paul Bunyan)
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dizfactor posted:
Is Jesus #1 on the list? He should be.
This ain't the Senate. 
Bunyan . . . well without him we maybe wouldn't have Fargo. That's about the extent of it.
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I never saw a wild thing sorry for itself.
A small bird will drop frozen dead from a bough
Without having ever felt sorry for itself.
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SeventhAngelicSlayer
Registered:
Jul '05
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Date Posted:
11/17/06 8:58pm
Subject:
RE: The 101 Most Influential People Who Never Lived (101: Paul Bunyan)
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Well I wouldn't say he's an influencial figure to me, but I just wanted to say that I've had a fondness Paul Bunyan and his best friend, Babe the Blue Ox, ever since I was little and my family and I would go on vacation each year to Bemidji, Minnesota; where the legend is huge (no pun intended). They have a couple of giant stautes of them, they have a theme park named after Bunyan, and yes, they sell lots of merchandise. So, maybe Paul Bunyan's had an influence on the people of Bemidji, and while it wasn't the reason my family and I used to go there, their love of Paul and Babe is certainly a part of the town we all think of fondly.
And also, Paul Bunyan's probably had an indirect influnce on the members of my favorite college football team, the Wisconsin Badgers, and their arch-rivals, the Minnesota Golden Gophers. Each year the two team's play for a trophy called Paul Bunyan's Ax. Basically, it's a giant ax, and the winner of the game keeps the trophy for the year, until they meet again to see who gets it. People who follow college football know that there are all sorts of these rivalries who play for funny trophies like this all across the country.
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Another happy landing!
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NYCitygurl
Title: Manager of SFFBC, C&G, and NSWFF
Registered:
Jul '02
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Date Posted:
11/18/06 3:59am
Subject:
RE: The 101 Most Influential People Who Never Lived (101: Paul Bunyan)
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I was really excited to see this thread 
Paul Bunyan does seem like an odd choice, though a good myth.
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"Not till the moon falls. Not till the world ends."
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Zaz
Title: Manager, The Ampitheatre
Registered:
Oct '98
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Date Posted:
11/18/06 8:23am
Subject:
RE: The 101 Most Influential People Who Never Lived (101: Paul Bunyan)
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I've seen the statues at Bemidiji; you can see them in the movie "Fargo."
Odd that he small as a small French-Canadian lumberjack, and when he became an American myth he metamorphised into a giant.
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Dal--Intrepid
Title: Former CR, Greenville, NC US
Registered:
Mar '02
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Date Posted:
11/18/06 10:37am
Subject:
RE: The 101 Most Influential People Who Never Lived (101: Paul Bunyan)
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Paul Bunyan's stories were always entertaining when I was a kid, but ultimately John Henry seemed a deeper character. I was saddened by John Henry's death; I'm not even sure if I've ever heard how Paul Bunyan died, or if he even did.
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Forcefire
Registered:
Jul '00
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Date Posted:
11/21/06 10:55am
Subject:
RE: The 101 Most Influential People Who Never Lived (101: Paul Bunyan)
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Glad to see so much activity here!
Name: John Doe
Rank: 100
Category: Americana
In a nutshell: Any unidentified male.
What the book says: "John Doe is an undisputed American celebrity, whose name appears on official documents, in works of fiction, and even in movie titles. But all of our research about him came to naught. We couldn't learn a thing about him."
What I say: At first I was concerned that they were putting Kevin Spacey's character from Se7en on the list. But frankly, this is almost as much of a head scratcher. How do you claim a person who, by definition, has no personality or defining traits as among the 101 most influential characters in history? The entry doesn't provide much help; it's the shortest of the book at about a third of a page and mostly consists of lame jokes.
-----signature-----
"Dear Diary, today I was pompous and my sister was crazy.
Today we were kidnapped by hillfolk, never to be seen again.
It was the best day ever."
Jayne Cobb, the Hero of Canton
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soitscometothis
Registered:
Jul '03
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Date Posted:
11/21/06 11:24am
Subject:
RE: The 101 Most Influential People Who Never Lived (100: John Doe)
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There is little I can think to say about John Doe, other than he has done a lot less damage than Alan Smithee.
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I am not an eel popsicle. Art: http://boards.theforce.net/Fan_Art/b10020/17816752/?21 Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity
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Zaz
Title: Manager, The Ampitheatre
Registered:
Oct '98
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Date Posted:
11/21/06 12:00pm
Subject:
RE: The 101 Most Influential People Who Never Lived (100: John Doe)
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Well, there's a Capra movie: "Meet John Doe"; and "John Doe" is designated in lawsuits when you don't know the defendant but think you will be able to ID them. And John or Jane Doe is the name given to unidentified corpses.
It's used quite a bit.
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SeventhAngelicSlayer
Registered:
Jul '05
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Date Posted:
11/21/06 1:05pm
Subject:
RE: The 101 Most Influential People Who Never Lived (100: John Doe)
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Well, the names are used quite a bit, but John and Jane Doe aren't two actual people. I guess you could say the name itself has some sort of influence (which is still arguable), but I don't really know about it being an influential person.
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The_Face
Title: Fan Fic Manager, now with more real butter flavor
Registered:
Feb '03
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Date Posted:
11/21/06 1:25pm
Subject:
RE: The 101 Most Influential People Who Never Lived (100: John Doe)
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Aha! Nice threadage, brother. 
Hmm, not all that impressed with the first two.
Paul Bunyan's a good go-to example for a tall tale, but influential? I tend to agree with Dal--Intrepid that John Henry was more interesting. And Babe I found slightly spooky as a kid. I dunno.
Is John Doe really "Americana"? I realize it's an American term in origin and use, but... I suppose the concept of John Doe has made its way into quite a lot of culture.
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Yes, what if Vader vanity surfs?
-Mon Mothma on the dangers of Luke keeping the Skywalker name
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KissMeImARebel
Registered:
Nov '03
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Date Posted:
11/21/06 1:35pm
Subject:
RE: The 101 Most Influential People Who Never Lived (100: John Doe)
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Doe is definately an 'outside the box' inclusion. I admit I like it. There is sort of a standard persona I have in my mind.
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RebelMollom of The Kind
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NYCitygurl
Title: Manager of SFFBC, C&G, and NSWFF
Registered:
Jul '02
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Date Posted:
11/21/06 2:13pm
Subject:
RE: The 101 Most Influential People Who Never Lived (100: John Doe)
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I like this much more than Paul Bunyan. John and Jane Doe are so commonly used for various things that it makes sense that it's included.
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"Not till the moon falls. Not till the world ends."
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