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Topic:
The 101 Most Influential People Who Never Lived: 44. Buffy the Vampire Slayer
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Gobi-1
Title: Manager: LFL Projects / Indiana Jones 4
Registered:
Dec '02
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Date Posted:
9/3/07 10:09pm
Subject:
RE: The 101 Most Influential People Who Never Lived: 77: Dick Tracy
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Since some of you guys don't seem to really know a whole lot about Dick Tracy I'll try and explain why he's an influential characters.
Dick Tracy brought a realism to comic strips that had not been seen up to that time. Chester Gould, Tracy's creator, was extremely detailed in his explanation of police procedures and crime solving techniques. Gould never shied away from violence either. Bullets going through a criminal's head was a common sight in "Dick Tracy." The influence of Tracy can be still be felt in the Law and Orders and CSIs of today.
"Dick Tracy" has also had a very strong influence on Batman and to a lesser degree James Bond. Batman when he debuted eight years after Dick Tracy was more a pulp detective like Tracy then the caped crusader he would become. The criminals of Dick Tracy's Rouges Gallery would also be right at home in Gotham City. Pruneface, The Brow, Mumbles, The Mole, Shaky, Itchy and the best of all Flattop. All of Gould's villains were grotesque creations and were aptly named based on their deformity or criminal personas. However many of Gould's famous villains debuted after Batman so Chester Could and Bob Kane could have very well be influencing each other. The villain with physical deformities would latter become a large part of the James Bond mythos.
Dick Tracy also had gadgets that would make James Bond's Q Branch envious. The 2-Way Wrist Radio, 2-Way Wrist TV and during the "Moon Period" of the 1960s Chester Gould literally took Dick Tracy out of this world into outer space with space age technology to back him up. Before Roger Moore blasted off in Moonraker Dick Tracy was flying high with the Space Coupe. (I kid you not!) Tracy has gone from the stark realism of Prohibition Chicago to the outrageousness of 1960s and back to realism again. Not unlike the cinematic journey of Mr. Bond.
One more influence is in the pop art movement of the 1950s and 60s. One only needs to look at a few of Gould's Tracy panels to see that he could be considered a master of the style.
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In 1977 George Lucas created the Star Wars Trilogy and changed the way we look at movies.
In 1999 George Lucas created the Prequel Trilogy and changed the way we look at Star Wars.
Frasier, Lost, and Whose Line Is It Anyway? are the best tv shows ever.
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Zaz
Title: Manager, The Ampitheatre
Registered:
Oct '98
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Date Posted:
9/4/07 4:19pm
Subject:
RE: The 101 Most Influential People Who Never Lived: 77: Dick Tracy
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Okay, that's a help, thanks. 
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Ender_Sai
Title: Manager Emeritus
Registered:
Feb '01
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Date Posted:
9/4/07 4:59pm
Subject:
RE: The 101 Most Influential People Who Never Lived: 77: Dick Tracy
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I think, with due respect, you're utterly stretching any correlation between Dick Tracy and James Bond. I think you're looking for the correlation and thus it's there, in much the same way people see shapes in Rorschadt tests or the Virgin Mary in a burrito. That's not to say some of the comparisons are not apt, but I believe to suggest any lineage is without foundation. None of the interviews or other documents with Ken Adams or the other design or writing crew indicates any support for your claims that the "villain with physical deformities would latter become a large part of the James Bond mythos."
In law, this is called a false hoc correlation; post hoc ergo propter hoc.
I quite like Dick Tracy comics and I agree about the realism and characterisations, but I cannot accept your idea that it inspired Bond when it did not.
E_S
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In this truth he knew himself to be.
From sinking sands he stepped into light's embrace.
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Gobi-1
Title: Manager: LFL Projects / Indiana Jones 4
Registered:
Dec '02
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Date Posted:
9/4/07 10:31pm
Subject:
RE: The 101 Most Influential People Who Never Lived: 77: Dick Tracy
- Date Edited:
9/5/07 9:23pm (1 edits total)
Edited By:
Gobi-1
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I said to a lesser degree. Dick Tracy was certianly more influential to other characters and genres but you can't deny that there are similarities that appear in both as well as in the Batman comics. There is a Dick Tracy reference in Casino Royale (1967) when Q gives Peter Sellers his new wrist watch with the two-way tv. "It's an American idea, they got it from one of their comic strips." Funny how both the tv wrist watch and the posion pen both latter reappeared in Octopussy. Anyway if there isn't a direct influence on Bond then Dick Tracy can be describe as a forefather much like Sherlock Holmes, who was a major influence on Tracy.
By the way Ender you and I are Oil and Water and I just leave it at that.
-----signature-----
In 1977 George Lucas created the Star Wars Trilogy and changed the way we look at movies.
In 1999 George Lucas created the Prequel Trilogy and changed the way we look at Star Wars.
Frasier, Lost, and Whose Line Is It Anyway? are the best tv shows ever.
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Ender_Sai
Title: Manager Emeritus
Registered:
Feb '01
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Date Posted:
9/4/07 10:44pm
Subject:
RE: The 101 Most Influential People Who Never Lived: 77: Dick Tracy
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Well if you say so.
E_S
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In this truth he knew himself to be.
From sinking sands he stepped into light's embrace.
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Zaz
Title: Manager, The Ampitheatre
Registered:
Oct '98
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Date Posted:
9/5/07 1:06pm
Subject:
RE: The 101 Most Influential People Who Never Lived: 77: Dick Tracy
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Where I live, oil and water is salad dressing... 
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Master_SweetPea
Registered:
Nov '02
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Date Posted:
9/7/07 2:33pm
Subject:
RE: The 101 Most Influential People Who Never Lived: 77: Dick Tracy
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Oil and Water
...
Windows and Bricks
...
Ender and Gobi
...
Some things don't mix
...
Burma Shave
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I don't like the donkeys and I don't like the Elephants http://www.lp.org "Some people never have anything except ideas Go Do it! Lucky Numbers 3, 11, 21, 31, 41, 43"
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Forcefire
Registered:
Jul '00
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Date Posted:
9/13/07 11:00am
Subject:
RE: The 101 Most Influential People Who Never Lived: 77: Dick Tracy
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76: Hercules
Category: Greek and Roman Myths
In a nutshell: Demigod who is strong.
What the book says: They try to be clever again and write it from Hercules' point of view. They give absolutely no reason to include him on the list, and instead decide to just list off some of the myths focusing on Hercules. Thanks, guys.
What I say: Hercules isn't a bad choice for inclusion on the list. Certainly a well-known character.
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"Dear Diary, today I was pompous and my sister was crazy.
Today we were kidnapped by hillfolk, never to be seen again.
It was the best day ever."
Jayne Cobb, the Hero of Canton
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Zaz
Title: Manager, The Ampitheatre
Registered:
Oct '98
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Date Posted:
9/13/07 12:43pm
Subject:
RE: The 101 Most Influential People Who Never Lived: 76: Hercules
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Certainly this is one mythical figure that most people know...
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21st
Registered:
Aug '07
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Date Posted:
9/13/07 4:27pm
Subject:
RE: The 101 Most Influential People Who Never Lived: 76: Hercules
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He just has to many stories about him and way to many bad interpretations of those stories (that's you Disney).
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Zaz
Title: Manager, The Ampitheatre
Registered:
Oct '98
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Date Posted:
9/16/07 11:28am
Subject:
RE: The 101 Most Influential People Who Never Lived: 76: Hercules
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Oh, yeah. But Disney isn't the worst offender, vide "The Sons of Hercules" movies.
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Forcefire
Registered:
Jul '00
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Date Posted:
9/25/07 8:27pm
Subject:
RE: The 101 Most Influential People Who Never Lived: 76: Hercules
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76: Norman Bates
Category: Movies
In a nutshell: Motel owner a bit off in the head.
What the book says: They talk about the groundbreaking nature of the movie, claiming in particular that it was first or maybe among the first to feature a murderer with no rational motive.
What I say: Sometimes I feel like these guys have no rational motives. Psycho influenced a lot of movies, to be sure. But can we say it, and particularly Norman, had enough impact beyond that for inclusion in the list? I'm not convinced. But then, I haven't gotten to Psycho yet.
Yes, I know I should.
-----signature-----
"Dear Diary, today I was pompous and my sister was crazy.
Today we were kidnapped by hillfolk, never to be seen again.
It was the best day ever."
Jayne Cobb, the Hero of Canton
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Zaz
Title: Manager, The Ampitheatre
Registered:
Oct '98
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Date Posted:
9/25/07 9:32pm
Subject:
RE: The 101 Most Influential People Who Never Lived: 76: Norman Bates
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You may be disappointed, but it's still a good movie.
I suspect Norman is the first serial-killer-as-hero...
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Forcefire
Registered:
Jul '00
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Date Posted:
10/6/07 8:30am
Subject:
RE: The 101 Most Influential People Who Never Lived: 76: Norman Bates
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So now I notice that Norman was actually number 75. We didn't skip anyone, I just can't read, apparently.
74: King Kong
Category: Monsters
In a nutshell: Big ape, world wonder number eight.
What the book says: "King Kong is a story that white audiences saw as a scary-beast movie with overtones of the Beauty and the Beast fable. But some black people saw a story frighteningly similar to that of their own ancestors: kidnapped from the tropics, brought to America in chains, exploited, emancipated, and killed for trying to rise in society."
What I say: That's really the most interesting part of this particular entry. I think they could have stood to follow up on that, because it's as close as they get to a real justification of King Kong's inclusion.
Also, he's another not-person.
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"Dear Diary, today I was pompous and my sister was crazy.
Today we were kidnapped by hillfolk, never to be seen again.
It was the best day ever."
Jayne Cobb, the Hero of Canton
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Zaz
Title: Manager, The Ampitheatre
Registered:
Oct '98
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Date Posted:
10/6/07 6:57pm
Subject:
RE: The 101 Most Influential People Who Never Lived: 74: King Kong
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It *is* interesting, and made much more explicit in the first remake, I think.
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