king_alvarez posted:So let me see if I got this straight according to LDS doctrine. Sin causes death (both physical and spiritual separation from God). This type of death is not a restitution but a consequence. It can't be used to buy back or exchange for a pure condition, it is merely a cause and effect type of reaction. Therefore, even after this death, a person would still be in an impure, sinful state except through Christ.
ObiWan506 posted:It might be an easier view to accept, but it doesn't appear to be what the Bible is talking about. The Bible seems very clear on a literal Hell.
Jabba-wocky posted:KK, very briefly (because I have to go) the argument you just made relies on the proposition that all prophets must necessarily have been called to make canonical level writings. That is pretty demonstrably not the case, as throughout the Old Testament there is frequent mention of prophets and people prophesying where no attempt was made to record it for posterity. The debate between the LDS and the everyone else is not whether there could ever possibly be "more prophets." It is whether there are extant, any writings produced since the time of the New Testament that are divinely inspired and deserve to be elevated to their status.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- A few months after starting this book, I attended a conference on the relation between the brain and the soul, sponsored by (fittingly enough) the Vatican. The specific topic was “Neuroscience and Divine Action,” and the theologians who organized this meeting were trying to reconceptualize Church teachings in a way that would make sense in light of current scientific understanding of how the world works. In particular, they were attempting to determine how it is possible for God to influence people’s lives without violating the laws of physics. I can’t present the full range of views expressed, but one that stood out was the notion that God interacts but doesn’t intervene. … Our concern here is not with the theological arguments for and against a noninterventionist view of God but rather with the possibility (or impossibility) of a scientific view of interaction…. If you believe in the existence of a nonmaterial soul, then all you need to assume is that when God was creating the universe, he worked out some way of interacting with the soul. Since both God and the soul are nonmaterial, that interaction would also be nonmaterial, and the laws of physics would therefore be unviolated when interactions occur. Much to my surprise, however, many of the theologians attending this meeting didn’t believe in a classic nonmaterial soul (this would probably be an even bigger surprise to the faithful they represent). Instead, they seemed to accept the principle that the mind is inexorably tied to the brain, and they consequently believed in a soul that is pretty much one and the same as the neurally mediated mind, a part of the physical world that must by its nature obey the laws of physics. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Kimball_Kinnison posted: Personally, I'd rather avoid getting into a debate here over what the Bible "clearly" says or not, because if the Bible said something as clearly as people claim, there wouldn't be so many differing interpretations. Kimball Kinnison
Bravo posted:Now, however, that also raises another question. Were the people before Christ came spiritual beings? If there's confirmed ghost sightings, maybe, but my knowledge in that area is lacking, so nay argument I make on that subject would be guessing at best.
Jango10 posted:Bravo posted:Now, however, that also raises another question. Were the people before Christ came spiritual beings? If there's confirmed ghost sightings, maybe, but my knowledge in that area is lacking, so nay argument I make on that subject would be guessing at best. Saul went to the witch of Endor, and she called the ghost of Samuel. So I would say that people before Christ were also spiritual beings just as we are today. This question comes to me: What about Enoch and Elijah? They did not die, and their physical bodies were taken from this earth. Upon entering heaven, were they given new bodies as well?
