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Topic:
People Who Are Screwing Up America: Scott Harshbarger/Myron Magnet/Peter Singer/Marvin Olasky
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Ender_Sai
Title: Manager Emeritus
Registered:
Feb '01
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Date Posted:
5/1/07 2:56pm
Subject:
RE: 100 People Who Are Screwing Up America: Howard Stern/Pryor/Michael Savage/Myers
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Savage seems uniquely American, in that whilst conservative, everyman commentators exist on radio everywhere, none seem to really abuse the concept of free speech for their own philistine ends.
That is to say, Savage is an unpleasant biproduct of American society. Some biproducts can be used (Vegemite  ); others are just repellant waste. Savage is the latter.
E_S
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Lowbacca_1977
Title: Senate Moderator
Registered:
Jun '06
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Date Posted:
5/1/07 4:02pm
Subject:
RE: 100 People Who Are Screwing Up America: Howard Stern/Pryor/Michael Savage/Myers
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ok, first of all, Vegemite is not a use, its a punishment.
on to the list:
Stern... I don't like, but I don't think he's messing anything up terribly much. Especially now that he's on satellite radio.
Savage, I've never listened to or otherwise familiar with, so can't say much there.
Mayers and Pryor, I see clear disagreements with, but I'd nto say they live up to the screwing up America thing. Lack power.
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Rogue1-and-a-half
Title: Manager: Amphitheatre
Registered:
Nov '00
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Date Posted:
5/13/07 9:30pm
Subject:
RE: 100 People Who Are Screwing Up America: Howard Stern/Pryor/Michael Savage/Myers
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Goldberg's 60:
Ludacris
Hip hop artist; Goldberg calls him misogynistic, profane and claims that he incites violence. If Huberman's bias is against country music, Goldberg's is agaisnt hip hop. "Is Ludacris the worst? No. They're all the worst."
Huberman's 60:
James Baker & the Carlyle Group
White House Chief of Staff under Reagan; served in same post under Bush the elder as well as Secretary of State. Huberman tracks back the Florida recount to James Baker, who he claims played an instrumental role in cooking the results. Baker is connected to the Carlyle Group, a private equity firm in Washington, with connections to lots of high ranking political figures, such as G.H.W.Bush; It also owns controlling shares in many military contractors and has also had business dealings with the Saudi Arabian relatives of Osama Bin Ladin. Huberman blasts it for having too much influence on defense contracting and for also having financial dirty dealings.
Goldberg's 59:
Shirley Franklin
First African American female mayor of Atlanta; Goldberg blasts her for giving honors from the city to Ludacris (still on that?) when he claims that, as a black woman, she should be one of the people most vehemently decrying his misogynistic and stereotypical music. Goldberg calls her representative of respected people who legitimize morally bankrupt art, like hip hop, by honoring it.
Huberman's 59:
John Bolton
Now the ex-ambassador to the UN; Huberman calls him a dogmatic and arrogant Republican stooge. Huberman states that his temper, his ignorance and his disregard for reasoned debate make him the last person who should be labelled a diplomat.
My thoughts:
Ludacris, I beg off on; he calls himself an artist and I'm not familiar with his music at all. And misogyny and violence in and of themselves don't make something negative, believe it or not.
Likewise, I can't comment on Franklin.
As for Baker, I don't know much about him.
Bolton, I think we were all glad to see gone. The man was many things, but he seemed to have a chip on his shoulder and was not, in my opinion, the best voice for America at the UN.
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Ender_Sai
Title: Manager Emeritus
Registered:
Feb '01
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Date Posted:
5/13/07 9:42pm
Subject:
RE: 100 People Who Are Screwing Up America: Ludacris/James Baker/Shirley Franklin/John Bolton
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Bolton's a twit, and his "proud, strong" stance was a way of dressing up the whore of stubbornness and an inability to learn as a proper lady. The man damaged America at the UN, not helped it. I dislike extreme minded individuals; make them dogmatic, and we have issues. 
E_S
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Rogue1-and-a-half
Title: Manager: Amphitheatre
Registered:
Nov '00
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Date Posted:
5/24/07 9:37am
Subject:
RE: 100 People Who Are Screwing Up America: Ludacris/James Baker/Shirley Franklin/John Bolton
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Goldberg's 58:
Eminem
Goldberg continues to flog the hip hop horse to death; he claims Eminem is misogynistic, profane and encouraging of violence.
Huberman's 58:
Senator Tom Coburn
Senator from the state of Oklahoma; Huberman blasts him for being not much more or less than an idiot. He argued against the unedited airing of Schindler's List on broadcast television, has made statements indicating that he supports the death penalty for abortion doctors, is extremely anti-homosexual and, just today, made news by blocking an honor to the late Rachel Carson because, in his opinion, she unfairly demonized DDT.
Goldberg's 57:
Ted Field
Movie producer and record company producer. Goldberg blasts him for his work in popularizing, what else, hip hop music.
Huberman's 57:
The Average American
Huberman attacks the average American for, among other things, 'believing in angels,' 'voting for Bush,' 'being uninformed,' and basically just being an idiot. Huberman's obviously been reading How to Win Friends and Influence People.
My thoughts:
Goldberg basically riding the hip hop horse to death; Eminem I happen to think is quite the consummate artist (don't laugh, I'm serious), so I disagree with placing him here. Field I disagree with also.
On to Tom Coburn (and I can't tell you how honored I am to have not one, but two Senators from my home state of Oklahoma make Huberman's list). Coburn I've considered pretty well a dimwit for quite some time now. I agree with his stances on some things; I am anti-abortion, but even I think the death penalty for abortion doctors is perhaps a bit of a logical leap to make at this point in time. His remarks about homosexuality have been nothing but damaging and it's gotten to the point where I literally cringe when I see his name in the local newspaper . . . what's he said now? He has an incredible tendency to say unbearably stupid things; at the confirmation hearings for John Roberts, Coburn asked him if he agreed that the "opposite of being dead was being alive." Roberts, shockingly, agreed. I also found his pot stirring about Schindler's List to be offensive and stupid in the extreme.
In short, Tom Coburn is an embarrasment to the state of Oklahoma; not particularly for his views, but for his utterly ignorant ways of expressing them . . . he is the consummate 'stupid conservative,' the example the liberals always hold up as exemplary of the average conservative, which he isn't, but still, I don't like him. 
And then Huberman crosses another line; the 'average American' is screwing up America? One wonders if Huberman quite grasps the idea of 'democracy.' While I certainly wish that all Americans were better informed and even *gasp* more intellectual, I think this article in Huberman's book smacks of utterly, ugly condescension and no other article in his book made me want to smack him in the face quite as much.
A bad showing; I disagree with three out of the four . . .
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Fluke_Groundrunner
Registered:
Jun '01
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Date Posted:
5/24/07 11:25am
Subject:
RE: 100 People Who Are Screwing Up America: Eminem/Tom Coburn/Ted Field/The Average American
- Date Edited:
5/24/07 11:28am (1 edits total)
Edited By:
Fluke_Groundrunner
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Rogue1-and-a-half posted:
Goldberg's 58:
On to Tom Coburn (and I can't tell you how honored I am to have not one, but two Senators from my home state of Oklahoma make Huberman's list). Coburn I've considered pretty well a dimwit for quite some time now. I agree with his stances on some things; I am anti-abortion, but even I think the death penalty for abortion doctors is perhaps a bit of a logical leap to make at this point in time. His remarks about homosexuality have been nothing but damaging and it's gotten to the point where I literally cringe when I see his name in the local newspaper . . . what's he said now? He has an incredible tendency to say unbearably stupid things; at the confirmation hearings for John Roberts, Coburn asked him if he agreed that the "opposite of being dead was being alive." Roberts, shockingly, agreed. I also found his pot stirring about Schindler's List to be offensive and stupid in the extreme.
In short, Tom Coburn is an embarrasment to the state of Oklahoma; not particularly for his views, but for his utterly ignorant ways of expressing them . . . he is the consummate 'stupid conservative,' the example the liberals always hold up as exemplary of the average conservative, which he isn't, but still, I don't like him.
I read his book "Breach of Trust" and he really does not like Newt Gingrich. He seems to believe that the Contract With America was a sham by Newt to give the Republicans the majority, and that once it happened, Newt gave up on the Contract and went back to politics as usual. I tend to agree with Coburn and I think that Gingrich must be really good at predicting the political landscape and then tailoring himself to take advantage ahead of time. Sort of liek he is doing now.
With that being said, I would not vote for Coburn. I don't agree with his views on many fo the issues. It was nice to see someone self limiting the term, as he did with promising only 6 years in the House. But then he had to go and run for Senator, promising to limit himself to 'only' two terms. That's 12 more years and 18 total. Please.
I am all for cuting out the pork spending, but I wonder how much funding Coburn has denied Oklahoma because he refuses to give in to other spending projects?
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Rogue1-and-a-half
Title: Manager: Amphitheatre
Registered:
Nov '00
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Date Posted:
5/27/07 8:41pm
Subject:
RE: 100 People Who Are Screwing Up America: Eminem/Tom Coburn/Ted Field/The Average American
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This thread seems to be losing steam . . .
Goldberg's 56:
Diane Sawyer
Goldberg blasts Sawyer for contributing to the dumbing down of television news. He calls her journalism thinly masked entertainment pandering.
Huberman's 56:
Ralph Reed
Republican political activist; Executive Director of the Christian Coalition in the early nineties. He resigned after allegations of corruption. Currently under investigation for his role in the Abramoff scandal.
Goldberg's 55:
David Westin
Producer of television news shows like World News Tonight, Nightline, 20/20, Good Morning America, etc. Goldberg attacks him for turning the once hard hitting world of television journalism into a wasteland of entertainment and style over substance.
Huberman's 55:
Pat Robertson
Christian media personality; host of the 700 Club and connected with the Christian Coalition and other like minded organizations. Has made potentially inflammatory remarks about homosexuals and Christian groups outside his denomination.
My thoughts:
I don't know about Sawyer and Westin; television news has somewhat lost steam in the last few years. Not entirely sure if Sawyer and Westin are part of the cause or just symptoms. Not entirely sure they're either, frankly.
Robertson seems to not have a tactful bone in his body. Don't know too much about him though.
Reed I know even less about.
I am, in short, singularly uninformed about this group.
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Ender_Sai
Title: Manager Emeritus
Registered:
Feb '01
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Date Posted:
5/27/07 10:10pm
Subject:
RE: 100 People Who Are Screwing Up America: Diane Sawyer/Ralph Reed/David Westin/Pat Robertson
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I agree that television news has "lost steam" as you put it; but can you blame one person or two people?
E_S
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In this truth he knew himself to be.
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Jedi Merkurian
Title: Games: RPG d20 GM
Registered:
May '00
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Date Posted:
5/28/07 7:55am
Subject:
RE: 100 People Who Are Screwing Up America: Diane Sawyer/Ralph Reed/David Westin/Pat Robertson
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I'll definately shake my fist in the direction of Red & Robertson.
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Jansons_Funny_Twin
Registered:
Jul '02
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Date Posted:
5/28/07 8:51am
Subject:
RE: 100 People Who Are Screwing Up America: Diane Sawyer/Ralph Reed/David Westin/Pat Robertson
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The only problem I had with Falwell dying was thet it wasn't Pat Robertson.
Hopefully once all these charletons die, the Republican Party will become a true conservative party again.
You are virran! VIRRAN!
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TrueJedi
Registered:
Jun '00
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Date Posted:
5/29/07 4:58pm
Subject:
RE: 100 People Who Are Screwing Up America: Diane Sawyer/Ralph Reed/David Westin/Pat Robertson
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The people that are screwing up America are those that control and are controlled by AIPAC. AIPAC calls the shots in Washington D.C. when it comes to foreign policy. The U.S. is being led down a road of destruction because of this organization.
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I'm the originator of the title, "EP III: Revenge of the Sith", so give me my accolades.
1977: May The Force Be With You
1999: May You Have Enough Midichlorians To Use The Force
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Rogue1-and-a-half
Title: Manager: Amphitheatre
Registered:
Nov '00
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Date Posted:
5/30/07 10:38am
Subject:
RE: 100 People Who Are Screwing Up America: Diane Sawyer/Ralph Reed/David Westin/Pat Robertson
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Goldberg's 54:
Neal Shapiro
Goldberg tends to get an idea and ride it to death; the former president of NBC News. Goldberg blasts him for destroying the place of 'serious' journalism on television.
Huberman's 54:
Sun Myung Moon
Huberman attacks him for being, of course, a complete lunatic (pun intended, thanks). He supports the religious right, is anti-homosexual and has spent time in prison for tax fraud.
Goldberg's 53:
Anna Nicole Smith
Things have significantly changed for Smith since Goldberg wrote this book; he'd probably argue that she's still screwing up America. He says she contributes to the glamorizing of stupidity.
Huberman's 53:
The Coors Family
Huberman accuses the Coors 'dynasty' of being corrupt, crooked and, of course, supporting conservative agendas.
My thoughts:
Moon's pretty goofy; I find it hard to believe there are enough people who take him seriously to make him an actual threat. Then again, those mass weddings are certainly huge, so perhaps there are.
Shapiro is, of the three people Goldberg mentioned in regards to the dumbing down of the media, probably the only one with significant power to make him worthy of placement on this list. President of NBC News certainly has some cachet and so, if we have to pick someone to blame, I guess he's as good a choice as any.
Anna Nicole Smith I have always found irritating in the extreme; felt sympathy for her during the aftermath of her son's death when the cameras wouldn't leave her alone. Doubt she ever had sufficient influence to actively hurt America.
As for the Coors family, frankly, I quite dislike them, but for a completely different reason; they're actively involved in manufacturing one of the most dangerous drugs in the world today. My thoughts on alcohol aren't popular; all Prohibition proved, in my opinion, was how necessary Prohibition really was. I could care less about what political causes they support; I just wish they'd get out of the death merchant business, you know?
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Fire_Ice_Death
Registered:
Feb '01
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Date Posted:
5/30/07 12:38pm
Subject:
RE: 100 People Who Are Screwing Up America: Neal Shapiro/Sun Myung Moon/Anna Nicole Smith/Coors Fam
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I think he sees Anna Nicole as a symptom of a larger issue. And since she really was the first of her kind she's partially responsible for it. Think about Paris Hilton and the like.
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Rogue1-and-a-half
Title: Manager: Amphitheatre
Registered:
Nov '00
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Date Posted:
6/7/07 10:12am
Subject:
RE: 100 People Who Are Screwing Up America: Neal Shapiro/Sun Myung Moon/Anna Nicole Smith/Coors Fam
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Goldberg's 52:
Markos Moulitsas
Founder and main author of Daily Kos, a progressively liberal weblog. Somewhat infamous for saying he did not mourn the death of 'mercenaries' in Iraq, speaking of the men killed at Fallujah.
Huberman's 52:
Jack Oliver
Republican who worked with several campaigns as a fundraiser. Lead the G.W. Bush campaign to break all previous records by raising $37 million in 120 days.
Goldberg's 51:
Ann Pelo
Author of "That's Not Fair: A Teacher's Guide to Activism with Young Children." She gained a small amount of bad press after she blasted the Blue Angels to her class of young children because they represented the military establishment and flew planes that could be used as weapons. She argues for teaching children (Goldberg argues that she means 'indoctrinating' them) at a young age about the evils of things like the military and the government.
Huberman's 51:
Mark Hyman
Vice President of Corporate Relations for Sinclair Broadcasting Group, the largest chain of local television stations in the US. Most famous for coining the phrase 'Cheese eating surrender monkeys' in reference to the French; he also accused the New York Times, NPR and CNN of 'treason' because they reported on civilians killed during US actions in Afghanistan.
My thoughts:
Got to give mad props to Hyman for being utterly annoying and idiotic. Not that familiar with his counterpart on Goldberg's list, Moulitsas.
Oliver is a great fundraiser, probably unethical as most fundraisers are; whether you think he's screwing up America depends entirely on your politics, I would guess.
Ann Pelo is an idiot but I doubt she has sufficient influence to screw up the country.
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Lowbacca_1977
Title: Senate Moderator
Registered:
Jun '06
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Date Posted:
6/7/07 1:26pm
Subject:
RE: 100 People Who Are Screwing Up America: Markos Moulitsas/Jack Oliver/Ann Pelo/Mark Hyman
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Kos.... that site is just utterly vile. And from my perspective, what that website has done to political dialog is disasterous.
Oliver... um, is the only reason he's on here that he raised money for Bush?
Pelo.... I don't like teachers using their position to teach political views such as that on any level... though younger makes it worse. Its something I definitly disagree with though.
Hyman.... not terribly familiar with him. While I don't think its terribly mature, I'll admit I do find "cheese eating surrender monkeys" to be funny... granted much of that is just funny that someone actually would use something that ridiculous. The rest of his stuff... some intriguing stances, but he generally seems just another annoying exec.
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