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Topic:
The Ultimate Editions: Discussing Changes to Possible Upcoming Releases of the Saga
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Juan-King
Registered:
Jul '04
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Date Posted:
6/20 4:57am
Subject:
RE: The Ultimate Editions: Discussing Changes to Possible Upcoming Releases of the Saga
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obi-rob-kenobi4 posted:
THANK YOU. Thats what i have been trying to say. If it was removed than the audience wont be left with this question. But people feel so comfortable with the excuses made up for the kiss that they dont want the kiss to even be removed anymore. No matter what way you choose to look at it the fact is that it has always been an infamous imperfection on the saga so if it was removed than this would at long last go away.
interesting idea .
Could we also remove TPM ? it's an infamous imperfection , and my friends always ask me why it's so bad , it's embarassing , if it was removed then the audience won't be left with this question .
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evenstarr
Registered:
Jun '03
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Date Posted:
6/20 5:15am
Subject:
RE: The Ultimate Editions: Discussing Changes to Possible Upcoming Releases of the Saga
- Date Edited:
6/20 5:19am (1 edits total)
Edited By:
evenstarr
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In the first trilogy, i would love to see parts of "return of the jedi" revamped. Some find it the worst out of the six films or second worst, i like the film heaps but probably find it the at the bottom too. It was my first star wars film and i still think its a great film however.
In particular, where it lags is the first act excluding the vader stuff. I would like to see an realistic cgi Jabba, and i would like to see the innards of his palace slightly revamped as well as some of the less stellar puppets given makeovers. It would also be great if they could incorporate some of Ralph Macquiries(u know who i mean) drawings of the palace somehow.
The big problem is that Jabba's a notoriously feared galatic crime slug but he lives in a pretty cramped space nailed to a slab! Jabba's set up just needs to be more impressive, i'm pretty sure in the two towers LOTR's dvd's they enlarged the hall in the special edition with cgi although i would like to see alot more than that. Now that i think about it, even the rancour sequence could be revamped, a bigger dungeon, cgiéd rancour monster, included the footage of luke force jumping up to the ceiling etc
The life forms in jabba's place could be re-vamped abit too or have more added to their number, it's just all abit too small and cramped for the reputation that's been established, more pig guards would be cool. they are cool!
All in all, more establishing shots both inside and outside combined with the above would give the payoff deserved to Jabba, rather than the get on with it and get out to the barge!
The barge stuff is cool by and large, lukes lightsabering in particular looks fantastic and it's a pity there's not more of luke cleaning house on the barges, which i think has great dramatic impact since for the first time we see Luke the Jedi. ANother cool thing about the barges is that they have alot more bounty hunter types about, compared to the puppets in jabba's dig.
Apart from that, mayby animate the ewoks in some way and tweak some of the physics of the battle on endor so things have better weight etc and you have an awesome conclusion and new fan favourite.
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DARTH_BELO
Registered:
Nov '03
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Date Posted:
6/23 12:52am
Subject:
RE: The Ultimate Editions: Discussing Changes to Possible Upcoming Releases of the Saga
- Date Edited:
6/23 12:54am (1 edits total)
Edited By:
DARTH_BELO
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I think those would be nice, but I think the endor space battle could use some enhancement as well...more color added to the ships, instead of all white/gray all the time, maybe change some laser colors (someone mentioned the Mon Calamari cruisers having PURPLE lasers-I think that's a great Idea!) but really the only things I think need fixing in that battle for sure are explosions...they're a bit-dull...at least redo the Executor crash into the death star! There's real opportunity there for that to look magnificent!
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There are NO trilogies - only ONE SAGA...
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Darth-Stryphe
Title: Saga Manager
Registered:
Apr '01
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Date Posted:
6/23 10:13am
Subject:
RE: The Ultimate Editions: Discussing Changes to Possible Upcoming Releases of the Saga
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They still have the hots for each other though. The love triangle is still there, its just toned down. I mean if it were Lando in place of Luke do you think she still would have gone through with the kiss?
It's obvious Luke is interested in Leia (from ANH), but there's no indication Leia is hot for Luke. If you remove the kiss then its not the love triangle you remove, but the tension between Han and Leia, which is the point of their romance in ESB. They have a love\hate thing going on. Both are really arrogant, but in different ways. It takes gloom and doom, and a little charm from Han, to break the bareers.
In the "kiss" scene Leia one-ups Han by giving some false indication she's into Luke, and this is a 1980 interpretion, we don't need ROTJ or the PT added on to tell us this. Since she's not really into Luke, and since there is no knowledge of being siblings at that point, there's nothing really gross or inappropriate about that.
Could we also remove TPM ? it's an infamous imperfection , and my friends always ask me why it's so bad , it's embarassing , if it was removed then the audience won't be left with this question.
LOL!!!! If we make it AOTC, then you've got a deal!
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drg4
Registered:
Jul '05
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Date Posted:
6/23 12:23pm
Subject:
RE: The Ultimate Editions: Discussing Changes to Possible Upcoming Releases of the Saga
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My suggestions for the Bottom Three:
Return of the Jedi
Ditch it—the Saga deserves a better send-off. Supplant it with an animated remake that has the operatic sweep of Empire. Emphasize the intrafamily conflict between Anakin, Padme, Luke and Leia Skywalker, and consign everything else to the periphery.
The Phantom Menace
Insert crowd and detention camp scenes, allowing us to witness the plight of the Naboo.
Mold the Gungans into a noble, primitivist race. Let us see the destruction of Gungan City, and rein in some of the nonsense of the field battle.
Excise much of Anakin's cockpit dialogue.
Attack of the Clones
Reedit several of Christensen's scenes, shearing off his unbearable petulance.
Use alternate Portman takes, or hire a voice actress to replace that monotone voice.
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StoneRiver
Registered:
Oct '04
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Date Posted:
6/24 5:30am
Subject:
RE: The Ultimate Editions: Discussing Changes to Possible Upcoming Releases of the Saga
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Zombie posted - ESB's ending pretty much leaves the audience with the question--"will Luke and Leia become an item finally?"
C'mon Zombie, you're normally spot on, level headed, get the whole thing etc BUT
Just before Han goes into Carbonite
Leia (to Han): I love you
Han: I know
Where does that leave anyone with the feeling that Leia will end up with Luke?
Sorry, on subject, sort the sabres and matte boxes, sort R5-D4 from behind R2 when he shouldn't be there, CG Yoda in TPM, and (shields himself from the barrage), do a little something to the Vader/Obi fight and CG the facial movements on ESB Yoda (and sort out the distance shot when the puppet is in Lukes backpack, too obvious a puppet and why not change it, it's not one of the great "acting" parts that Frank Oz did).
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obi-rob-kenobi4
Registered:
Apr '07
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Date Posted:
6/25 12:40am
Subject:
RE: The Ultimate Editions: Discussing Changes to Possible Upcoming Releases of the Saga
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Does lucas know that the fans want the OT lightsabers fixed? becouse if we dont let him know than he might not ever fix it! 
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who am i,where am i going?
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Emperor_Dantius
Registered:
Feb '05
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Date Posted:
6/25 3:24am
Subject:
RE: The Ultimate Editions: Discussing Changes to Possible Upcoming Releases of the Saga
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There's no way that LFL doesn't notice the shot that's bothering everyone on the DVD. You know, the one with Luke vs. Vader in the Emperor's throne room.
And the lightsaber on the Falcon in ANH. And they can also go back and fix any that we or they may not be satisfied with.
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My ranking of the saga:
III VI II V I IV
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zombie
Registered:
Aug '99
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Date Posted:
6/25 7:07am
Subject:
RE: The Ultimate Editions: Discussing Changes to Possible Upcoming Releases of the Saga
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StoneRiver posted:
Zombie posted - ESB's ending pretty much leaves the audience with the question--"will Luke and Leia become an item finally?"
C'mon Zombie, you're normally spot on, level headed, get the whole thing etc BUT
Just before Han goes into Carbonite
Leia (to Han): I love you
Han: I know
Where does that leave anyone with the feeling that Leia will end up with Luke?
Because Luke has been in love with Leia the entire time, Leia has had some level of affection for Luke, they just had that "love across the galaxy" psychic connection scene where Leia rescues him, and now in the final scene of the film Han is good as dead and Luke and Leia have their arms around each other wondering where the future will go. Its not super-sexual the way the Leia-Han thing is, its more of an emotional type of love subtext, a much more profound one IMO (you know, she dates Han but marries Luke), but its definitely there, and audiences definitely wondered what would happen to the triangle in film three.
As for the lightsabers, I have to believe Lucas is just extremely incompetant, and either doesn't notice them or else thinks its somehow a flaw in the viewing system he is watching the films on. I'm leaning towards the first possibility. If he had noticed them, with all this talk about finally realising his vision and making the SE the version he wants everyone to see and going on about all the money they spent to remaster and make the SE look so good, if he actually thought there were pink and green sabers in ANH he would rush out and correct them immediately. If he didn't then he either doesn't care, cares more about money, or both. But I believe he's actually so clueless that he's never even noticed in the first place, and no one cares enough to bring it to his attention.
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Darth-Stryphe
Title: Saga Manager
Registered:
Apr '01
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Date Posted:
6/25 10:08am
Subject:
RE: The Ultimate Editions: Discussing Changes to Possible Upcoming Releases of the Saga
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Because Luke has been in love with Leia the entire time, Leia has had some level of affection for Luke
This is true, but having two guys interesting in the same girl does not make for a love triangle unless the girl has some feelings towards both guys. In ANH there is plenty of evidence that Leia had, or would have, feelings for Luke, but nothing to point towards Han. Taking this one step further in ESB, the idea of a love triangle was going to be interjected, was filmed, but then edited out. As the theatrical ESB there is no evidence that Leia has any kind of romantic or sexual affection for Luke, and the hints of a possible future for those two as indicated in ANH was forgotten. In a sense, the way ESB was edited in 1980 was a perfect setup for Leia regarding Luke has a brother.
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BaronLandoCalrissian
Registered:
Jun '06
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Date Posted:
6/25 10:38am
Subject:
RE: The Ultimate Editions: Discussing Changes to Possible Upcoming Releases of the Saga
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There was a HUGE, very real possibility that Ford was not going to be in Jedi, and Empire's ending was designed to allow for it, that's just a fact, so Luke was just as likely as Han at that point, even though the audience was clearly for Han by then. Ford's reluctance is also pretty much the reason Lando Calrissian exists at all, wearing han's exact clothes and flying his ship, no less.
Although now, if Lucas is gonna go all the way with this revised one-saga thing, maybe he should cut the kiss, it seems to throw the movie out of whack for a minute to "regular people". "Wait what the hell was that?"
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zombie
Registered:
Aug '99
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Date Posted:
6/25 11:18am
Subject:
RE: The Ultimate Editions: Discussing Changes to Possible Upcoming Releases of the Saga
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Darth-Stryphe posted:
Because Luke has been in love with Leia the entire time, Leia has had some level of affection for Luke
This is true, but having two guys interesting in the same girl does not make for a love triangle unless the girl has some feelings towards both guys. In ANH there is plenty of evidence that Leia had, or would have, feelings for Luke, but nothing to point towards Han. Taking this one step further in ESB, the idea of a love triangle was going to be interjected, was filmed, but then edited out. As the theatrical ESB there is no evidence that Leia has any kind of romantic or sexual affection for Luke, and the hints of a possible future for those two as indicated in ANH was forgotten. In a sense, the way ESB was edited in 1980 was a perfect setup for Leia regarding Luke has a brother.
Um, in practically the ONLY scene Luke and Leia had together in ESB they open mouth kiss! I know there is that playing-mind-games-with-Han element to it, but the subtext of that action is that she does indeed have some level of affection for Luke.
Then at the end they are together and Luke has his arm around her.
Its subtle, but its there. It wasn't as played up as ANH may have hinted it would be, but its definitely not on the cutting room floor.
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I'll swallow your soul! --------------------------------- If you're gonna die, die with your boots on! -------------------------------- author of The Secret History of Star Wars http://secrethistoryofstarwars.com
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StoneRiver
Registered:
Oct '04
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Date Posted:
6/26 6:01am
Subject:
RE: The Ultimate Editions: Discussing Changes to Possible Upcoming Releases of the Saga
- Date Edited:
6/26 6:02am (1 edits total)
Edited By:
StoneRiver
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zombie posted:
Then at the end they are together and Luke has his arm around her.
I'm not convinced, I've always seen this "cuddle" as a comforting action because her true love Han's fate was unsure.
And the kiss is most definately for Han's benefit. Hell, I've known both women and men that are quite happy to kiss someone they don't care about to wind someone else up. I just can't see it, even in an underlying sense, that she had romantic feelings for Luke.
So no, that scene does not need cutting. (IMO of course).
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Tactic_Thrawn
Registered:
Jul '06
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Date Posted:
6/26 9:21am
Subject:
RE: The Ultimate Editions: Discussing Changes to Possible Upcoming Releases of the Saga
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TPM: Remove the pseudo-Judeo-Christian influence, and keep the Jedi religion 'Eastern' oriented. Put in a new Yoda.
AotC: A new name for starters, ATTACK OF THE CLONES sounds similar to some 1950s movie.
RotS: This could use a LOT. Make a new, more impressive Yoda-Emperor fight scene, but keep the symbolic parts (Spielberg did a great job on that scene in the symbolic area). Remove that tasteless comment about wiping Threepio's memory. Maybe put in a closing scene where Beru notes that a sun has set and it's night now, and then a comment by Owen that dawn (and a new sunrise because of Tatooine's twin suns) and a new day is just around the corner--though this would mess with Lucas' apparent goal of making Threepio and Artoo have starting and ending lines of the episodes in Earth chronology, and having them have the middle lines in Star Wars chronology. (Threepio and Artoo started off ANH, and ended RotS). Also, include more of the formation of the Rebellion stuff. When Amidala asks, apparently out of the blue whether they are on the [proper] side, as is, it seems as though she's being hormonally influenced by pregnancy. The movie should show more how Palpatine is amassing power and how a few Senators are plotting to counter him.
ANH: Put in Han shooting Greedo first. Remove the ring from the exploding Death Star.
ESB: You could replace Janson-as-an-Imperial for some picky people, but the episode is fairly great as is.
RotJ: Change the Jabba dance song thing. Make the space battle more impressive and dramatic (such as showing a Mon Calamari Cruiser that is about to be destroyed ramming a Star Destroyer to at least take another ship down with it).
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What's Christianity? John 3:16. Simple as that. Personally happen to be a Christian. That's not remotely the same as a *perfect* Christian. http://scifi4.blogspot.com/
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Darth-Stryphe
Title: Saga Manager
Registered:
Apr '01
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Date Posted:
6/26 10:10am
Subject:
RE: The Ultimate Editions: Discussing Changes to Possible Upcoming Releases of the Saga
- Date Edited:
6/26 10:13am (1 edits total)
Edited By:
Darth-Stryphe
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Um, in practically the ONLY scene Luke and Leia had together in ESB they open mouth kiss! I know there is that playing-mind-games-with-Han element to it, but the subtext of that action is that she does indeed have some level of affection for Luke.
Well, I guess its up to interpretation. I see Leia expression no interest in Luke (romantic interest) at any point in the Saga, although ANH did setup that possiblity. She kisses Luke to cheese Han off. There's no indication she kisses him for any other reason than I can see. It's not correct to say a woman will only kiss a guy that they have interested in. Other motivations can factor in, such as, in this case, messing with one's mind (Han's mind, in this case). And its my personal believe that if GL wanted us to believe Leia was struggling with feelings for Luke then he would have left the cut scene in. It's removal is an admission in-and-of-itself, as I see it.
Then at the end they are together and Luke has his arm around her.
What Stoneriver said. A good guess says that if GL had revealed them to be siblings already, or already in some other way elimenated romantic possiblities between the two that they would still have their arms around each other in that scene.
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