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Topic:
What plotline, character or scene in the entire Saga irritates you the most?
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Ziekfried
Registered:
Jun '08
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Date Posted:
7/5 12:14pm
Subject:
RE: What plotline, character or scene in the entire Saga irritates you the most?
- Date Edited:
7/5 12:16pm (1 edits total)
Edited By:
Ziekfried
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Eta-2 posted:
Yeah, I always thought the scene should have gone like this:
Obi Wan: Anakin, you betrayed the Jedi order and helped kill them all off, including the youngest children, mercilessly slaughtered separatists that should have had a formal trial, choked out your wife and tossed her aside trailer trash style, and tried to kill me...I gave you one last chance and you still attacked me...buuuuut...here, let me give you a hand.
Anakin: I hate you!
Obi-Wans situation with Anakin at the end of ROTS was pretty much the same as Anakin's with Count Dooku at the beginning. Bothe were given a chance to surrender, both were rendered incapable of defending themselves or attacking, and the right decision as Anakin knew at the beginning was not to kill him. I know technically Obi-Wan didn't kill Anakin though but it was just as bad in many ways, and what made it worse to me was Obi-Wan telling Anakin all these things like he cared but he didn't or he would have given him another chance not a last chance.
And you failed to address the fact that afterward he was training Luke to kill Vader when Luke didn't know Vader was his father, and Luke could see the light in him still and persuade him but the Jedi masters just said to heck with it lets kill him. Now I'm no fan of Luke but he makes a better Jedi than Obi-Wan hands down.
This ain't s'posed to be no battle of viewpoints anyway jus figured I'd clarify mine as to why I hate Obi-Wan and those scenes.
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Eta-2
Registered:
Jun '08
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Date Posted:
7/5 11:27pm
Subject:
RE: What plotline, character or scene in the entire Saga irritates you the most?
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Ziekfried posted:
And you failed to address the fact that afterward he was training Luke to kill Vader when Luke didn't know Vader was his father, and Luke could see the light in him still and persuade him but the Jedi masters just said to heck with it lets kill him. Now I'm no fan of Luke but he makes a better Jedi than Obi-Wan hands down.
This ain't s'posed to be no battle of viewpoints anyway jus figured I'd clarify mine as to why I hate Obi-Wan and those scenes.
I don't think telling Luke the entire truth of the situation right there and then would have been the right thing to do. I always figured the plan was to wait until Luke was further in his training and then tell him. It's not Obi Wan or Yoda's fault he didn't listen and rushed off to fight Vader and found out prematurely. When he did talk to Ben about it, he realized Ben was right. Honestly though, I can't imagine being a fan of these movies and hating Obi Wan and Luke. 
...To keep on the original topic, I was never a big fan of General Grievous, although he's starting to grow on me and he is a wonderful example of CGI...I loved ROTS, but they should have explained his character a bit better and not relied on the EU to convince us of his character.
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Flinging bodies would be more BA. The stormtroopers wouldn't just be like "oh it's a crate" They'd be like "That's Dave!".
-Sublime Skywalker on "The Force Unleashed"
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the_immolated_one
Registered:
Sep '06
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Date Posted:
7/6 10:06am
Subject:
RE: What plotline, character or scene in the entire Saga irritates you the most?
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Eta-2 posted:
I don't think telling Luke the entire truth of the situation right there and then would have been the right thing to do. I always figured the plan was to wait until Luke was further in his training and then tell him. It's not Obi Wan or Yoda's fault he didn't listen and rushed off to fight Vader and found out prematurely. When he did talk to Ben about it, he realized Ben was right. Honestly though, I can't imagine being a fan of these movies and hating Obi Wan and Luke.
No offense, but, as Ziekfried pointed out, if Obi-Wan is so righteous then why does he want a son to kill his father? What makes you think Luke was wrong for rushing off to Bespin? What went wrong?
Eta-2 posted:
...To keep on the original topic, I was never a big fan of General Grievous, although he's starting to grow on me and he is a wonderful example of CGI...I loved ROTS, but they should have explained his character a bit better and not relied on the EU to convince us of his character.
Grievous is just a bad guy. He just takes Dooku's place to keep the story moving. That's all. Did Tarkin or Piett have an in-depth back story?
I think General Grevious' character was kind of interesting because all the coughing showed that a person wasn't supposed to live like that. Which showed Vader wasn't supposed to live like that either.
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Eta-2
Registered:
Jun '08
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Date Posted:
7/6 1:58pm
Subject:
RE: What plotline, character or scene in the entire Saga irritates you the most?
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the_immolated_one posted:
No offense, but, as Ziekfried pointed out, if Obi-Wan is so righteous then why does he want a son to kill his father? What makes you think Luke was wrong for rushing off to Bespin? What went wrong?
Yoda and Obi Wan telling him he's not ready? Not managing to help the friends he went there for and having to be rescued by them? Getting toyed with and having his hand sliced off by a Dark Lord of the Sith that proves to be superior to him? Facing a truth they felt he wasn't ready for?
Vader was a ruthless tyrant who Obi Wan already gave too many chances...but I guess it was messed up of him to train Luke in the ways of the Jedi since Darth was such a good father to Luke and Leia all those years. Obi Wan's only fault in the situation was that he didn't think Vader could be turned back, which given the circumstance, that's not much of a fault.
the_immolated_one posted:
Grievous is just a bad guy. He just takes Dooku's place to keep the story moving. That's all. Did Tarkin or Piett have an in-depth back story?
I think General Grevious' character was kind of interesting because all the coughing showed that a person wasn't supposed to live like that. Which showed Vader wasn't supposed to live like that either.
What I mean by the Grievous complaint is a number of people I talked to were extremely confused and put off by the "coughing robot", since they didn't mention or show he was a cyborg until later.
-----signature-----
Flinging bodies would be more BA. The stormtroopers wouldn't just be like "oh it's a crate" They'd be like "That's Dave!".
-Sublime Skywalker on "The Force Unleashed"
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the_immolated_one
Registered:
Sep '06
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Date Posted:
7/6 3:14pm
Subject:
RE: What plotline, character or scene in the entire Saga irritates you the most?
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Eta-2 posted:
Yoda and Obi Wan telling him he's not ready?
Just because they say he's not ready doesn't mean they're correct. Or does it?
Eta-2 posted:
Not managing to help the friends he went there for and having to be rescued by them?
Doesn't R2 help them?
Maybe he never went there to save his friends. Maybe he only thought he was going there to save his friends.
Maybe he went there to save his father. Maybe he just didn't know he was going there to save his father.
Eta-2 posted:
Getting toyed with and having his hand sliced off by a Dark Lord of the Sith that proves to be superior to him?
I'm really not understanding why that makes Luke wrong for going.
Eta-2 posted:
Facing a truth they felt he wasn't ready for?
I say he was ready for the truth. The duel between Luke and Vader on Cloud City was Luke's trial by fire and he passed. He didn't turn to the darkside and that's exactly what Yoda's training was all about.
Eta-2 posted:
Vader was a ruthless tyrant who Obi Wan already gave too many chances...but I guess it was messed up of him to train Luke in the ways of the Jedi since Darth was such a good father to Luke and Leia all those years.
But defining ruthless tyranny is sometimes not as easy as it looks. I would define the cloning of innocent children who will be stripped of their free will and forced into warfare as ruthless tyranny and since the Jedi were part of such a practice then I would define the Jedi as ruthless tyrants. And on a side note: For all we know perhaps Anakin would have been a good father and son if the Jedi would have allowed him to even have a family in the first place.
Eta-2 posted:
Obi Wan's only fault in the situation was that he didn't think Vader could be turned back, which given the circumstance, that's not much of a fault.
Obi-Wan had a lot more faults than that but he just couldn't see them because he was brainwashed by a system that blinded him from birth.
Eta-2 posted:
What I mean by the Grievous complaint is a number of people I talked to were extremely confused and put off by the "coughing robot", since they didn't mention or show he was a cyborg until later.
Perhaps those people just needed to pay more attention because I feel it's obvious he's a cyborg. You can see he has organic eyes and an organic trachea when you're first introduced to him.
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Eta-2
Registered:
Jun '08
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Date Posted:
7/6 4:09pm
Subject:
RE: What plotline, character or scene in the entire Saga irritates you the most?
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the_immolated_one posted:
But defining ruthless tyranny is sometimes not as easy as it looks. I would define the cloning of innocent children who will be stripped of their free will and forced into warfare as ruthless tyranny and since the Jedi were part of such a practice then I would define the Jedi as ruthless tyrants. And on a side note: For all we know perhaps Anakin would have been a good father and son if the Jedi would have allowed him to even have a family in the first place.
I really don't want to debate this because I feel to illustrate the point I would have to draw on some uncomfortable modern analogies, and I don't think these boards are the place to do it since I come here to get away from heavily philosophical moral debates. I'm well aware of the fact that good and evil are not as simple as black and white, night and day...and I think George Lucas was well aware that the casualties of war are not just deaths and injuries.
-----signature-----
Flinging bodies would be more BA. The stormtroopers wouldn't just be like "oh it's a crate" They'd be like "That's Dave!".
-Sublime Skywalker on "The Force Unleashed"
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the_immolated_one
Registered:
Sep '06
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Date Posted:
7/6 4:41pm
Subject:
RE: What plotline, character or scene in the entire Saga irritates you the most?
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Eta-2 posted:
I really don't want to debate this because I feel to illustrate the point I would have to draw on some uncomfortable modern analogies, and I don't think these boards are the place to do it since I come here to get away from heavily philosophical moral debates.
We sometimes debate these things here. In fact, I sound like broken record around here.
Eta-2 posted:
I'm well aware of the fact that good and evil are not as simple as black and white, night and day...and I think George Lucas was well aware that the casualties of war are not just deaths and injuries.
Interesting.
Well, good day.
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Leonnie
Registered:
Jul '08
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Date Posted:
7/6 11:37pm
Subject:
RE: What plotline, character or scene in the entire Saga irritates you the most?
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I am not crazy about skipping the entire Clone Wars. It seemed kind of like a big thing to just gloss over.
I'm also not crazy about Padme's huge character deviation in ROTS. How did one of the youngest, most beloved queens of Naboo (not to mention respected Senator) just die because she lost the will to live? Come on... she had no will to live for her children?!? I really hated that. I would have preferred it if Anakin accidentally killed her and somehow they managed to save the babies.
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Manisphere
Registered:
Aug '07
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Date Posted:
7/8 5:40pm
Subject:
RE: What plotline, character or scene in the entire Saga irritates you the most?
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Basically any scene with Threepio in AOtC. His development, everything. He was so brilliant in the OT and so devastatingly awful in AoTC. "What a drag." What a drag indeed. Why was his whining and martyrdom so spot on in ANH?
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yodarulz12
Registered:
Mar '08
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Date Posted:
7/8 7:29pm
Subject:
RE: What plotline, character or scene in the entire Saga irritates you the most?
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I would have to agree about the character deviations of Padme...drives me nuts. Granted, some of it can be explained by her "double(s)" acting as her, but still...too many personality and character shifts to make her believable. I also think Anakin was to good for too long in ROTS...hard to make the jump to trying to kill his beloved wife just because he thought she brought Obi-wan to Mustafar to kill him. If Anakin was as powerful as he believed, and in love with Padme enough to switch to the dark side to save her, he wouldn't be so eager to try to kill her so quickly upon seeing Obi-wan...guess I've never been over to the dark side myself. I just can't make that leap. Also didn't care much for Jar-Jar. Funny that all my irritants are in the later movies...still LOVE the original 3. I can't even come up with an irritation for the first three.
-----signature-----
"Wars not make one great"
"All his life he has looked away...to the future, to
the horizon. Never his mind on where he was...
what he was doing."
"A jedi must have the deepest commitment, the most serious mind."
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Darkwish
Registered:
Apr '01
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Date Posted:
7/10 9:47pm
Subject:
RE: What plotline, character or scene in the entire Saga irritates you the most?
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There are so many things...do I have to pick just one?
-----signature-----
"Your feeble skills are no match for the power of the dark side. You have paid the price for your lack of vision."
We'll ride the spiral to the end and may just go where no one's been.
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deerslayer3710
Registered:
Jul '08
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Date Posted:
7/14 6:24am
Subject:
RE: What plotline, character or scene in the entire Saga irritates you the most?
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JAR JAR!!!! That screw-up of a character brought all the prequel movies down to the depths of the kessel spice mines!
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jedi_dude77
Registered:
Aug '08
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Date Posted:
8/18 4:06am
Subject:
RE: What plotline, character or scene in the entire Saga irritates you the most?
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I think I'm one of the .01% of fans that doesn't actually mind Jar Jar.
Not sure if this thread includes the new Clone Wars film, but I did get a bit annoyed with Obi-Wan's voice. It's a really bad fake British accent. Come Ewan, you do dodgy perfume adverts, why not Clone Wars. Great film otherwise though.
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That's no moon...
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David_Skywalker01
Registered:
Nov '06
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Date Posted:
8/18 4:46pm
Subject:
RE: What plotline, character or scene in the entire Saga irritates you the most?
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The entire Jabba's palace scene... wasted space in the movie, show more Endor space battle, like the Crix Madine thing.
-----signature-----
"A blind man should not lead a blind man or they will both fall into a hole." - Jesus IndyCar- One series, All the stars http://www.freewebs.com/therebelallianceofstarwarsgeeks - my website Worst EU people- Jacen Solo, ANY Yuuzhan Vong
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darthramza
Registered:
Jul '08
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Date Posted:
8/18 8:04pm
Subject:
RE: What plotline, character or scene in the entire Saga irritates you the most?
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jedi_dude77 posted:
Not sure if this thread includes the new Clone Wars film, but I did get a bit annoyed with Obi-Wan's voice. It's a really bad fake British accent. Come Ewan, you do dodgy perfume adverts, why not Clone Wars. Great film otherwise though.
Fairly certain it's not Ewan in The Clone Wars, just a guy doing an imitation of him.
As for me, it's most likely Anakin/Padme relationship arc in AotC. I was practically banging my head in frustration, and the fact that Leia and Han had been handled so well in ESB didn't help in the least bit.
"I hate sand." - Worst. Pick-Up. Ever. Seriously, it's like Lucas walked to his typewriter and said "I think I'm not going to write today" immediately before churning out that stuff.
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"But, it was so artistically done."
"darthramza may be the most insightful, witty, and intelligent person on these boards." - Myself
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