2 Jedi vs. 2 Sith

Discussion in 'Revenge of the Sith (Non-Spoilers)' started by beedubew, Jun 8, 2005.

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  1. beedubew Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jun 25, 2002
    star 2
    We saw what one Sith did against 4 Jedi. I was wondering what would have happened had Yoda not had such good relations with the Wookies and let another Jedi lead the armies on Kashyyyk - I mean, Yoda didn't do anything other than stand there and perhaps motivate. So, Yoda and Mace along with Plo and the two "dead men walking" Jedi go to arrest Palpatine with Anakin being told to wait in the Jedi Temple. For the sake of argument, Palpatine still kills off the same three Jedi leaving Yoda and Mace to fight him.

    Anakin shows up and....what? Opinions? Comments on my opinion listed below?




    My opinion is that Yoda and Mace kill Palpatine and Anakin (assuming Anakin still has chosen to turn to the dark side).

    Here is what we do know: 1) Mace fights Palps to a stalemate at least (arguably he beats him). 2) Yoda fights Palpatine to a draw under different circumstances. 3) Yoda says to Obi-wan that he isn't strong enough to fight the Emperor but, Obi-wan defeats Ani-Vader. This implies that Yoda and Mace are stronger than Obi-wan (most of us would probably agree) and could therefore defeat Anakin one on one.

    That all said, and utilizing the transitive property of Jedi fighting (it is in most 9th grade text books ;) ), Mace and Yoda defeat Palps and Ani-Vader. The only flaw in this logic I see at this point is that Anakin was much more emotional fighting Obi-wan and may not have made the same emotional mistakes against Mace and Yoda.
  2. RurouniKJS Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 4, 2005
    star 2
    Against both Mace and Yoda, Palpatine is disarmed and arrested in less than 30 seconds, well before Anakin arrives. Even the lightning would only floor one of those two Jedi at a time, and neither if he had to spread it to hit both. And Yoda doesn't even need his saber to handle Sith lightning. If Sidious tries the lightning trick on these two Masters, they'd execute him on the spot.

    Anakin, then, would arrive to see a headless ex-Chancellor. Is he now freed from his inSidious flirtation with the dark side, or does his despair of saving Padmé push him into an immediate rage against two of the greatest Jedi in the Order? The latter probably means his death; he might overcome one, but the remaining Master would take him down.
  3. Ghost_Jedi Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 27, 2003
    star 5
    RurouniKJS is correct. If Yoda was not on Kashyyk, there would be no ot. Yoda and Mace would have been like, all your bases belong to me.
  4. Garth Maul Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    May 18, 2002
    star 6
    ha ha ha

    "to us, all your base are belong" [face_laugh]

    I still think Obi-Wan is the only one in ROTS that could defeat Anakin - because he trained him.
  5. beedubew Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jun 25, 2002
    star 2
    Ghost, doesn't that make me correct too? ;) hypothetically, if Yoda and Mace confronted Sidious and Anakin, who do you think would win? I still say Yoda and Mace.

    Garth, you point out what I said was the main hole in my theory. Only Obi-wan could arose enough emotion to blind Anakin to his hasty actions.
  6. Garth Maul Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    May 18, 2002
    star 6
    It's not just the emotion (well, that's how the battle ends, obviously), but the fact that Obi-Wan knows how Anakin moves.

    If Anakin can take care of Dooku, I think he has a chance against Mace - maybe not Yoda, though. Anakin IS still young in ROTS.

    I was actually hoping we'd get to see Anakin vs. Mace, or Anakin and Sidious vs. Mace. Oh well, that scene worked out not too bad the way it is.:p

    In some ways, I think the OSB fight with Obi-Wan/Anakin/Dooku is meant to demonstrate that Jedi are supposed to fight Sith 2 vs. 1.

    Obi-Wan and Anakin are the perfect team early in the movie, and because of the increased strength and aggression the Dark Side gives, the Jedi would have a disadvantage vis-a-vis the Sith in a one-on-one battle.
  7. Darth-Seldon Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 17, 2003
    star 6
    We have to keep in mind that when Sidious was fighting Mace, he wanted to lose. He knew Anakin would be there, and he wanted to appear unarmed and act as though he was the victim. So we're not sure who would win between Mace and Palpatine if they were both fighting and intending to win.

    It is an interesting idea. Together, Yoda and Mace would probably be able to defeat Sidious. I agree with Garth that only Obi-Wan could defeat Anakin. It is only because Obi-Wan knows the boy so well, he knows the next move, parry, and attack. They complete each other--they know exactly what will happen. That is why Kenobi was able to beat Skywalker.

    -Seldon
  8. Obi_Frans Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 31, 2003
    star 4
    "The Jedi Master is winning when Anakin arrives, but Palpatine, as the scene has been rethought, now seizes the occasion to exaggerate his weakness. You have to be either Mace or Yoda to compete with the Emperor," Lucas says. "If Anakin hadn't got all beat up, he could've beat the Emperor."

    --George Lucas, The Making Of Revenge Of The Sith; page 204


    Mace was winning the fight, nobody can fake getting a boot straight to the face next to a open ledge in Coruscant.

    - O_F
  9. beedubew Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jun 25, 2002
    star 2
    I am not sure Obi-wan knowing Anakin's moves makes any difference. Knowing the moves and being able to defend against them aren't the same thing. If I know some guy is going to shoot me - and I am not Neo - I can't dodge the bullet. I think the fact that Anakin was blinded (or at least impaired) by the emotion of fighting his master is the primary reason for his defeat. He was still the Learner and Obi-wan the Master. In ANH, he wouldn't make the same mistakes again.
  10. Obi_Frans Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 31, 2003
    star 4
    He was still the Learner and Obi-wan the Master. In ANH, he wouldn't make the same mistakes again.

    Technically, he does make the same mistake.

    Obi-Wan, again, goats him into attacking - which, as Obi-Wan, again, Vader was warned against. In doing so he, again, dooms himself because Obi-Wan now becomes more powerful than he could possibly imagine.

    - O_F
  11. beedubew Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jun 25, 2002
    star 2
    Fair point. Obi-wan defeats him essentially by allowing Luke to escape and confront him later...

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