2nd Chance: Let's discuss these issues properly.

We keep it private to protect the sensibilities of the average regular user.

I'm so glad, as a regular user, I am spared the horrifying truths that go on in that god-awful place

The private nature of the MS inherently creates mistrust between regular users and mods. This will always be unless absolutely everything is done out in the open. I know that will never happen, but it's just something I had to get off my chest.

 

Before I was a mod, I always thought there needed to be a separate board that was kept private so matters could be discussed. It's not a matter of trust, or keeping secrets, or anything else. The same is true of governments. We get the results of discussion, the outcomes - not every little thought that went into it. I probably wouldn't want to know. We'll never get rid of the distrust, ever. The best we can do is to be honest, provide thorough updates, participate in here, and minimize the distrust via our actions.

 

Well said as always, DS. It's always good to see an example of what all mods should try to live up to with your thoughtful posts.

(this is not an attempt to "kiss up" )

 

solojones - For the record, I was the one who complained about the Shrek thread and inadvertently got you and Obi-Wan-Jedi-Girl banned. Why? Because you had hijacked it - not because you didn't like Shrek. When a movie's appreciation thread is derailed with two users alternating posts of "SHREK SUX!", then IMHO a spank is in order.

WHAT? I didn't hijack anything! I started the thread, and it was about how I hated Shrek... how is that hijacking?

-sj loves kevin spacey

 

Russ and Indecent have both been asking for their Admin files to be released to them, and both have been submitting unban requests that are being ignored. Could we please get some action on this front? Thank you.

 

I'm taking this up with the Mod Squad.

 

Thanks, KW. I appreciate it.

 

Sorry about my lateness in replying. Being sick is no fun. Also forgive my short answers. I'm still pretty new at this.

Issue 1. Mods banning users based on matters of personal opinion, without consulting other administration. Also, bannings without clear explanations, and without warning.

This I agree with. There are posters I may not agree with or even like, but that alone is no grounds for banning. Violations of the TOS are grounds for warnings and bannings. In regards to the second part, I have also dealt with unban requests prompty, explaining why the user was banned. I will continue to do this.

Issue 2. Locking of threads/banning users due to "spamming" "trolling" "flaming" "abusing" "harrassing" or "derailing" when these terms are not generally agreed upon by the staff. There are gross inconsistencies in what different moderators will call "spam," or what a certain moderator will allow from day to day, or from different posters.

I would agree the word "spam" is used too much. Unless a person is posting the same thing over and over, or the only one repling to a thread topic, I don't think I would close a topic for "spam."

I agree with Vertical on "fluff" posts (generally good natured 'non-sense'), are ok for the JCC and are not spam.

Issue 3. Detailed explanations should be given at the end of a locked thread, explaining why it was closed.

Again I agree. I think I have left an explanation in every thread I have closed and I will definitely do that in the future.

Issue 4. Moderators should be held accountable for their mistakes.

I would agree with this. Regular users are held accountable for what they post, and so too should the moderators. Personally speaking, I don't see myself as different from the regular JC posters. If I screw up and break the TOS, I would except to be called on it. Having said that, I am still new at this so I have no experience at past moderators who have been punished.

Issue 5. Moderators should read, actively pay attention, and respond to these discussions in Communications, as well as grievances expressed by anyone. By "respond" it is implied that they should post more than a simple "I'm here" or "You're wrong, end of story."

I do agree mods should be aware of what is happening in Communications, at least when it comes to the forums they mod. The thread in the MS is a great way to know what is going on so we can respond if our forum is involved.

Issue 6. "This belongs in a PM with X admin." If an issue affects more than just one member, it should be able to be discussed in Communications. PM with an admin is only one avenue of discussion, and sometimes outside opinions can help resolve an issue.

I agree and disagree with this. I think PMs should be the first response. If an issue is easily cleared up, there really isn't a need for a thread. PMs also might make mods feel more connected to the person sending it. A one-on-one audience if you will. If a PM doesn't work, or more discussion is necessary Comms is always an option.

Issue 7. When you are banned, the reasons and severity of the ban should be explained to you by the moderator who did it. Likewise, during the unbanning process- users should at all times know who is discussing the issue, as well as who is personally responding to the unban requests. The process should involve two way communication- not just filling the form, and waiting for a response that may not come.

I agree with this, and since this thread first popped up and I started reading it, I have done that. Now it is also policy for us mods to sign unban requests.

Issue 8. Both the "political correctness" and "protection of users feelings" need to be more relaxed. Neither of these will foster a healthy or mature community.

I'm not sure what I think on this one. I'll work on it later.

Issue 9. Threads should not be locked solely based on the active moderator's personal preferences or interests. Threads should be locked because of a

 

Yes, my admin file would be nice to see. Thank you.

 

14? An additional issue. I have noticed that lately a number of mods have been threatening bans (and possibly carrying them out?) against those who argue anti-administration points of view. They were not flaming or trolling, though in each case their posts were emotionally charged and had subjective content, with not much proof or evidence.

It seems as if one is only being allowed to criticize the administration, if one has enough evidence and a well-enough organized argument, to make banning counterproductive, and essentially make one too dangerous to ban. A user who does not make it this far is threatened with banning, and I have heard of some being banned.

15. Also, I have not yet heard satisfactory explanations of the bans of Wylding and GayLenKenobi, or why they were allowed to stand and no apology issued, etc. I could make a separate thread, but this directly connects to the issues here, and it would waste time and space.

 

Okay, I really am getting sick of seeing so many people leave the JC. Let me address some things I think are the most annoying:

1. Not surveying the problem at hand well enough

This is a problem all mods have. They never look everywhere before they lock or ban. They should get some second opinions, one from a mod, and one from an AC member. Some mods are worse than others at this, but I won't say any names. Instead of depending on nothing but yourself and your trusty ban&lock button, try looking around before you do anything. You will immediatly have 1/3 less complaints than before.

2. Trust

Instead of thinking that all members are brainless, lying fools until they become a mod, try learning which members can be trusted and which can't. Don't lie, a lot of you mods don't like it when regular members try to help you in the case of a banning or locking.

3. Color & Banner changes

instead of just changing the banners immediatly, leave the one you've choosen to put up on a website and ask people to vote if they like it or not. Changing it immediatly is only a problem, as you'll have complaints and annoyances pouring in. The only way you can lower stress is by avoiding it in the first place.

4. Games

This is where the mods have bad judgement. With the "only mod games can have VIPship prizes" rule, you're pretty much saying that regular members idea's for games are stupid, and only mods can create good games. This one needs total rethinking, as you're only looking for real trouble with this one.

I know many more people who are on the brink of leaving this place. Save the members; only way to keep the place running.

 

oh yeah, another thing:

5. Activity

Most mods don't really socialize in their forums. Sure, they create a few threads, clean out their forum, and make a new set of rules, but they need to interact more with the people who inhabit their forum.

 

NEWs FLASH NEWS FLASH! THINGS ARE NEVER GOING TO CHANGE HERE!

If you can except this and move on, you'll be very happy. These discussions about the mods have been going on for YEARS and nothing has ever changed. Sure they FINALLY got rid of PreacherBoy, something that was long overdue, but let's face it. A portion of the mods will always and forever be abusive of their power. And the fact that everyone sits here and worries about them and the forums is laughable. It's an internet forum ok? Go out and live life and let the mods sit here and have their reign of tyranny. These 200+ reply threads on "The Evil Administration" are quite old and overdone. We've established the fact that they are not fair, favor certain members, etc. Just MOVE on. Trust me, you'll be much happier when you do.

 

wow, a mod's sock.

 

Skua...
"These discussions about the mods have been going on for YEARS and nothing has ever changed."

Says the following person:

Skua
Registered: Nov 02

 

Is the concept of people re-registering really that foreign to you? Must I go parading around the fact that I've been here since '99? Um...no since it's really not that important.

 

I'm going to say what I feel again since it got shot down last time:


Contrary to popular belief, not everyone who disagrees with the administration is a "Slacker." I am sick of being lumped in with them just because I don't kiss up to the mods.

 

No one labels those who disagree with the administration as slackers. I certainly don't.

 

Iwishiwasajedi:

1. Not surveying the problem at hand well enough

This is a problem all mods have. They never look everywhere before they lock or ban. They should get some second opinions, one from a mod, and one from an AC member. Some mods are worse than others at this, but I won't say any names. Instead of depending on nothing but yourself and your trusty ban&lock button, try looking around before you do anything. You will immediatly have 1/3 less complaints than before.

So you are saying that everything that a mod does should be cleared by at least two other people? What does this then say about the judgement of all moderators if they are not deemed responsible enough to handle any situation on their own?

Also, there is the whole issue of the time it would take to deal with a matter. This would easily mean dealing with anything would take at least 5-10 times longer, and we'd then have people complaining that we are not doing things quickly enough.

That aside, all mods should think through a situation and the possibilities before doing anything. I would like to think that we do, but from this part: Instead of depending on nothing but yourself and your trusty ban&lock button, try looking around before you do anything., you seem to have something specific in mind. For the most part we do investigate things before taking any action, but in certain situations, there is a need to "ban first, ask questions later". This does mean that sometimes someone innocent gets banned for something that isn't their fault, but in all those cases, we reverse the action as soon as we realise the error, and apologise to the person.

2. Trust

Instead of thinking that all members are brainless, lying fools until they become a mod, try learning which members can be trusted and which can't. Don't lie, a lot of you mods don't like it when regular members try to help you in the case of a banning or locking.

I'm sorry, but I just have to say 'Huh?'. I can not recall the number of times it has been said here and in almost every forum that we actually appreciate the 'heads-up' that many members give us. This is a board for everyone, and if some people wish to help in cleaning up problems by PMing us the details and a link, we appreciate it.

The only thing that we discourage is people who constantly go into threads, and all they offer is comments like "This should be locked", "This is spam", or "You are going to be banned now".

3. Color & Banner changes

instead of just changing the banners immediatly, leave the one you've choosen to put up on a website and ask people to vote if they like it or not. Changing it immediatly is only a problem, as you'll have complaints and annoyances pouring in. The only way you can lower stress is by avoiding it in the first place.

But won't we get complaints when we give a page for people to look at anyway? The only difference will be that at the time, you will be looking at the old scheme when posting about it. I've read the majority of threads about the new banner and scheme, and all up it's been about 600 posts tops, from about 300-400 people, split fairly evenly between those that like it and dislike it. Is that a flood of complaints?

Besides which (and this is a card I hate to play, but it still does have to be said), while we like to have a large amount of user input into the boards, the final say still rests in the owners and staff of the site, represented here by the moderators. That's not to say we don't listen, if you have read the thread here in Comms, you'll see I'm still doing slight refinements on the colours, and if anyone has any suggestions, I'm still open to hearing them. I won't promise that they will be followed, but that doesn't mean I won't listen and consider them.

4. Games

This is where the mods have bad judgement. With the "only mod games can have VIPship prizes" rule, you're pretty much saying that regular members idea's for games are stupid, and only mods can create good games. This one n

 

Kadue covered my thoughts on this issue.

Vertical