5 Years From Now: Where do you see Star Wars within the realm of gaming?

Discussion in 'Games' started by Lord-Draco, Nov 7, 2005.

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  1. Psycho_Sith Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 3, 2003
    star 4
    Where in the hell are all these "Rushed" comments being thrown around from?
    The only SW game that I saw *verified* as "rushed" was KOTORII - that game had all sorts of storylines that went no where and open ended plots.

    Just because a person doesn't like a game doesn't mean it was automatically "rushed"...that's a load of crap.
    Also, a game release coinciding with something else - a DVD release per se - does not make it "rushed".
  2. Kish Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jul 12, 2004
    star 2

    I would say that a game that was completed in less then a year, such as Battlefront II, would be considered rushed.

    Granted, the gameplay is solid with little bugs. But then, it's really not any different then Battlefront I. Techincally its an expansion.(And it should have been priced as such)



    But because they had to crap out a game as quickly as possible they couldn't design an entire new Battlefront game that was actually significantly better or different then the first.



    Instead they added Jedi, a few ROTS levels, and tah dah! A brand new 50 dollar Star Wars game.
  3. Psycho_Sith Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 3, 2003
    star 4
    So tell me this then....where is, say, Metal Gear Solid 2 soooo much "different" than MGS in gameplay?
    It's no more "different" than BFII is from BFI.
    Or Spider-Man the Movie to Spider-Man 2?
    Or any of the RE games?
  4. Therren_Cragan Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Sep 25, 2005
    star 1
    Im pretty sure Pandemic and Lucas Arts worked on Battlefront 2 at the same time they were the first one, or started just a little bit afterwards. I think Capcom actually did the same thing with their Resident Evil: Outbreak games.
  5. Lord_IceMan Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Nov 9, 2005
    star 1
    my dream is to see the kotor game sbecome movies, that would be awesome.
  6. LANDO_ROCKS Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 28, 2002
    star 4
    More Battlefront games!
  7. vader1025 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 2, 2004
    star 1
    Well, according to George Lucas, we MAY just see that..depending how the cartoon and live action series does.
  8. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2000
    star 10
    >> Or Spider-Man the Movie to Spider-Man 2?<<

    Actually, Spiderman 2's game was much different than Spiderman 1's. Webslinging, environments, etc were totally different.
  9. Lord-Draco Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 26, 2002
    star 4
    When I or another individual says Rushed, we mean it in factual terms. Are you telling me that September 2004 was the best date possible for Battlefront 1? Let me pitch out a scenerio. Say the OT DVD never came out in 2004, hell, say that it would never come out. Just stay with me here. Say it will come out....in 2007 for the 30th Anniversary of Star Wars. Now lets rewind from 2007 to 2004, the year that Battlefront 1 was released. With all that in mind, the fact that the OT DVD won't come til 2007, do you still believe that LucasArts would have had Battlefront 1 come out in September? Battlefront was a good game for what it provided, but I bet you that if the OT DVD wasn't coming in September it would have came out later like January or Feb. I bet you that if the DVD were to come out in August or even July, BF1 would have came out in August or even July. With that being said, the game was rushed. Trials of Obi-Wan was rushed. KOTOR 2 was rushed.

    Now on to the topic of Star Wars fans being zombies with no clear idea of games. Thats not exactly what I meant. I mean that just because the name Star Wars is attached to it, there is that natural state of us to have great interest in it, no matter what. Example, KOTOR 2 was a highly rushed game with story plot holes and many bugs and glitches. However KOTOR 2 is praised and loved by the Star Wars community. They forget about the bugs and how the game has a plot hole story. All they see is a RPG that is Star Wars and they right there my friend is enough for them - the idea that its Star Wars. Had KOTOR 2 not been Star Wars but a normal made up brand, people would not praise it the way they do. People would actually bash it. The game would be considered the worst thing since Spiderman on the N64.

    And Plo-Koom, don't sit there and act like I'm the only one who believes that. As you can see there are others who sees these as proven in that LA thread. I brought it to their attention and now they understand. Hell, a guy, one of your fellow Star Wars gamers even came out and stated that we are biased towards Star Wars games. If the game is crappy, we will still somehow find some type of glory out of it just because its Star Wars. If it had been another game, we wouldn't do that but since its Star Wars we want to enjoy it.

    If Battlefront 1 would have been not Star Wars, then people won't praise it the way they do. But since it is Star Wars, we see past the bugs, glitches, sorry AI, and no direction. All we see is OMG! We can now relive Star Wars battles!

    I would bring you that quote when that indivdual stated that in the LA thread. But I don't fill like digging stuff. Just know that there are a whole legion of SW Gamers that sees how the situation is playing out. Attack me because I'm supposenly the leader of this all, but don't forget that leader also has followers that shares the same views.

    As for Star Wars in 5 years. I want to believe that it will be great. Hell, it will be great, but at what cost? A game can still be great with lack of innovation. A game can still be great with lack of direction. A game can still be great with no presented challenges/difficulty.

    I just want to go back to the good ole days, the days of Super Empire Strikes Back an extreme challenging game. The days of Shadows of the Empire, another challenging game with an unique outlook on behind the scenes of Empire Strikes Back. The days of Dark Forces, when storyline was intwined with character detail/development and gameplay. That is the era of Star Wars that truly shined and thats what I want in the next 5 years and even beyond. Not "Oh the Saga Set is coming out in May 2007 and its now December 2006, so we need to hurry and come out with something to coincide with that date."

    Had KOTOR 2 came out in 1995, it would probably be the best Star Wars game of all time. Had Battlefront 1 came out in 1996 it would have been not just the best Star Wars gaming experiences, but something that can sit with the Original Doom, Quake, and GoldenEye. If Reve
  10. Nona_Cad Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 27, 2004
    star 3
    If you're expecting all video games to be innovative... [face_laugh] Most games produced are just copycat games, but we still play and love them.

    On to Star Wars. Yes, I am one of those "zombified" fans that will buy or play anything with Star Wars on the cover, because I am just that lame. On the other hand, no matter how bad these games are they're still fun. They still give me an enjoyable experience, and in the end isn't that why we play games? Clone Wars the game might have been one of the worst designed Star Wars games, but I enjoyed every minute I played of it. I think we're going a little overboard on wanting "innovative" games, but maybe that's just me.

    I want to see another X-Wing game. Not Rogue Squadron, but true to spirit X-Wing. Hell, I don't even care if its set somewhere in EU where you can't fly X-wings, I just want a good flight simulator that didn't come out when I was in junior high.

    I personally think Star Wars games will continue to flourish, though it will be as it always has been. There will be a large number of games that will ultimately feel rushed, or just plain bad, but there will be enough gems in the series to keep people along for the ride. Just as long as there is never another Hoth mission...
  11. Lord-Draco Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 26, 2002
    star 4
    Let me just say this now before it gets too far. I don't want this to turn into the LucasArts = Weakest Publisher thread. Right now this thread is headed in that direction. I must say that I am to blame for that in many ways. Remember people, its okay to express your opinions whether it be positive or negative. Just remember that this thread isn't about LucasArts and how good/bad they are at doing games. Its about what is our personal perception of how/what Star Wars videogames will be like in 5 years from now in contrast to how it has been in the past 5 to 15 years.

    A lot of people says that Star Wars gaming will die in about 5 years. First off Star Wars in general will never die, I really can't explain why but just know that it won't. With that being said, Star Wars gaming won't die. Some people would say "Well Star Trek is much as a cutural icon as Star Wars and you don't see ST games around today." Thats true, but you also have to realise that there is no one company that makes or just makes Star Wars games. Star Wars has that advantage with LucasArts, a LucasFilm owned company. As long as LucasArts is around, Star Wars videogames will be around. LucasArts can and will create non Star Wars based games but Star Wars is their core, we all know that.

    Now with all of that out of the way, let me talk about not what I believe Star Wars gaming will be like in 5 years, but what I want it to be like.

    In 5 years I hope more effort in the innovation department kicks in. Star Wars in general is an expansive topic so why can't its gaming ideas be expansive? There were great Star Wars games in the last 5 years, but very very very few of them were innovative. The Battlefront series was great and is selling like chocolate candy on Valentine's Day. However they aren't innovative. They didn't do anything to....push the envelope. Not to take anything away from the games but they were just a Star Wars version of Battlefield: 1942. Republic Commando was a great game, but it was nothing different from any other Tactical Shooter....other than the idea that it was Star Wars. KOTOR is in my mind and a lot of other people's minds the best Star Wars game in the past 5 years. However nothing in it was innovative. Most of the stuff you did in that was stuff you could do in Baldur's Gate....other than the idea that it was Star Wars.

    However there is one innovative game that stuck out to me - KOTOR 2. Now before you rant on about how buggy the game was, how crappy the story was, how rushed it was, how inferior it is the BF2 and whatnot. Consider the idea that it has one of the more interesting innovations not in Star Wars gaming, but gaming in general. That innovation is party member influence. Correct me if I'm wrong but I have never played a RPG game or any game for that matter where you can literally influence your AI Teammates into doing good things or doing bad things. Most games has pre-set personalities for characters. If they're good, they're good. If they're bad, they're bad. Even though the influence system was flawed and rushed in KOTOR 2, it still presented a great idea, an idea that you could possibly see future developers take ahold of. Infact, I believe that in Mass Effect, Bioware's next Action RPG for the 360. I belive that game will have a character influence system.

    Now name me on Star Wars game in the past 5 years that created an innovative technology system that has been used by other developers/publishers. Non really. Star Wars in the past 5 years was only known to create a Star Wars version of an already create innovation. EA/DICE innovated the non-linear war game such as Battlefield: 1942. So LA/Pandemic decides to make a Star Wars version of that.

    It was so genius how Obsidian thought up the influence system. Because like I said before, in general Star Wars in a deep topic and can be explored on so many levels. Levels such as philosophy, religion, love, betrayal, and so on. KOTOR 2 presented the idea of manipulation, something that is all too common in Star Wars
  12. rogue_wookiee Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Apr 24, 2004
    star 6
    Quit insulting RE4. You are just making an idiot out of yourself.
  13. plo_koom Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 26, 2002
    star 5
    The rushed business came from over-analyzed comments in a magazine. The project lead stated he would have liked a few more weeks but they didn't use their alloted time wisely and the deadline came to soon. Since we aren't a part of the development team, we don't know which plots were left a mystery on purpose and which are broken remnants of the game. Frankly, there are only a few obscure side quests that are completely broken in that they are inexplorable at a strange point. Others are meant to create an aura of mystery in the storyline.

    Frankly, I enjoyed this game more then most other Star Wars games, I liked it a little bit more then KOTOR 1.
  14. Tay-Mar Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 4, 2005
    star 4
    Ok so using the phrase 'Rushed' was a bad idea, it implies that what was released isn't what the developers wanted to release and because all Star wars titles are published by LA they have the final say on what hits the shelves.

    I'm going to upset most of the console gamers here because I play all of my games on PC and can't really offer an opinion on any console games, so please forgive me. Half Life 2, the most anticipated game of 2003/04, a master piece, a PC gamers dream was delayed for over a year, yes Valve had problems with theft and publishing rights but it was delayed because the developers weren't happy with it, they still aren't and are still working to add bits and pieces to it, change how things work and look, that is what I want from a game and I'm happy that Valve took an extra year to get it right. That was the kind of commitment we used to get from LA when they developed 'in house', why as loyal fans should we accept anything less now that third parties are writing the games ?
  15. Kish Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jul 12, 2004
    star 2

    I don't really think that it would work with LucasArts.


    Half Life 2 was a next-generation game. It upped the bar, and so Valve made sure that it was going to come out right the first time. Valve was willing to spend the time and money on a game that was going to blow everything else out of the water.

    LucasArts doesn't have that sort of conviction behind it. Battlefront 1 was never suppose to be a next-gen game. It's only purpose was to be a Battlefield 1942 in Star Wars. If LucasArts decided to delay the release the game would not have gotten that much better, because there wasn't that much to improve in the first place. Only if LA had decided in the first place that Battlefront 1 was really going to push the limits of gaming would it have been worthwhile to give it a longer development time. The game should have waited a month or two perhaps. To get rid of any bugs, and maybey to make the AI smarter then cookie dough. But any longer would have been overkill.










    I should add, even though I seem to be badmouthing Star Wars games alot lately, i'm actually one of the Star Wars Zombie players. I go out and buy Star Wars games, even when they're not considered to be very good. And for the most part I find them fun, because they are Star Wars. But the novelty is starting to wear a little thing. In 5 years, I don't see myself putting up with it anymore unless LA actually starts doing something good with their games.
  16. plo_koom Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 26, 2002
    star 5
    I don't see what games inquestion everyone is complaining about; I haven't seen a bad game from them in a long-long while. They were all well recieved by the fans, sold very well and have even won awards.

    There just a few who can't except that someone can enjoy a game that was flawed in production and carry disdain for lucasarts because they are making great games, but they don't think they are giving enough effort to diserve any credit. Obviously enough effort was given because Battlefront 1 and 2 and KOTOR 1 and 2 and Republic Commando were all great games. I haven't played Galaxies and I know there are a few issues with that, but I know it's also widely loved.

    I can't see what the hell you're talking about when you say they half-ass a game because it has StarWars in the title. The ratio of bad to good games with the Star Wars title is about the same as video game titles without Star Wars. It's just a coincidence that some games with Star Wars in the title turn out crappy, I don't see this happening with enough frequency to suggest what you're saying.
  17. Lord-Draco Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 26, 2002
    star 4
    I don't believe you're badmouthing Star Wars. You have an opinion and you're expressing it.

    And as for your last sentence, LucasArts is doing somewhat good with their games, I mean look at BF2 and how much more of an improvement it was over BF1 which was a crappy game from all angles. Look at Republic Commando, a great tatical shooter game. I don't even have to mention KOTOR, just look at how successful that game has. The problem is, none of those games were innovative. As I stated in my last reply, Star Wars is so huge and deep as a topic, there is sooooooo much that can be explored. So many ideas, creations, and concepts that can come out of the Star Wars world. More than just a Star Wars Battlefield 1942 or Star Wars Baluder's Gate.
  18. Tay-Mar Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 4, 2005
    star 4
    The point I was trying to make is that Dark Forces and Jedi Knight were both next generation games when they were released, LA spent years sorting out the graphics and AI, read PC gamer's top 100 games of all time, five LA titles are in there, four of them Star Wars games.

    I'm not knocking Star Wars or LA, all that I'm saying is that nothing jaw dropping has come out of LA with a Star Wars theme since they stopped 'in house' development.
  19. CommanderSesfan Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 1, 2001
    star 4
    In five years: There will be more Star Wars games, some good, some bad. Most will spark intense discussion on the internet about their relative merits. People will take these discussions very seriously.

    Also, in five years, hopefully most of the people who whine and complain about Lucasarts/the Star Wars franchise will have moved on to hating something else. Because, you know, it won't be "cool" to hate on Star Wars anymore. Follow the trends, kids.

    In all seriousness, I hope to be playing Star Wars Galaxies II in five years. Not developed by SOE, and done correctly.
  20. Psycho_Sith Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 3, 2003
    star 4
    Maybe you should read things a bit more carefully. I was not "insulting" any RE game. I love the RE games. I was pointing out the fact their gameplay is simliar from one to the next - nothing more.

    ......call me an "idiot"?!
  21. RevantheJediMaster Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 12, 2005
    star 4
    I see video games with great graphics and to be more specific I see video games for the Star Wars Live Action TV Series set for release in 2008 and maybe the Clone Wars 3D Animated Series coming out in Fall 2007 but they have a laready made a Clone Wars video game so I don't know if that is going to happen. I think Star Wars games are going to look great on the New-Gen systems.
  22. Lord-Draco Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 26, 2002
    star 4
    Why is it that just because someone shares a opinion on something that just happens to be negative....we're labeled as whiners or haters? Just because we have negative opinions? I'm not whining or complaining about anything. I'm just telling it like it is or how I think it is. Call me whiner, complainer, or whatever you want but I'm just speaking my opinion. Part of the idea of internet discussion forums is discussion. That discussion could be positive or negative. As long as it is kept within mature and reasonable talk, there should be no problem with that. I think you're a moderator so you of all people should know that.


    You're 100% right. Battlefront 2 is going to become the best selling game of all time. However it isn't anything....thats pushing the limits. All it is, is a glorified version of BF1 and a Star Wars Battlefield game. KOTOR is probably the best Star Wars game ever made in the past 5 years, atleast to me. However it isn't anything....thats pushing the limits. All it is, is a Star Wars Baluder's Gate. Thats not Bioware's fault and it isn't Pandemic's fault. LucasArts just needs to come out and start coming up with creative ideas because like I keep saying, Star Wars is such an expansive topic and so many things can me done with it. LucasArts should understand this and come up with some innovative games instead of a Star Wars version of something else.

    Not all games they make can be innovative, but out of 10 games, atleast 3-6 of those should be pushing the limits. So far their last 10 games hasn't really did that.

    So in 5 years, more innovation needs to come.
  23. plo_koom Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 26, 2002
    star 5
    Why do you assume every game Lucasarts makes is a cover title for a more popular game? Just because it shares the same genre of RPG or Shooter or FPS doesn't mean it was a complete rip-off.
  24. Oissan Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Mar 9, 2001
    star 6
    Indeed...

    KOTOR, for example, has close to nothing to do with Baldur's gate, except that they share the same developer.
    As I said earlier on, if every game is considered to be a copy of an older game just because it is from the same genre, you might as well stop making games.
  25. Tay-Mar Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 4, 2005
    star 4
    Oissan, I can see where you're coming from but here's a counter argument. Quake 4, Doom 3 different storylines but the same basic premise, same engine, same genre, same game in all but name and yet people still buy and play them.

    Do you have a copy of Quake 3 in your games collection, I should hope so and if you have why do you also have a copy of Jedi Knight 2, Jedi Academy, Star Trek Voyager Elite Force . . . . . . . Do you have a copy of Quake 2, then why do you also have Half Life ? I'm not even going down the Unreal/Unreal Tournament road.

    It's all about what floats your boat and Star Wars floats mine, I just want something that stands out and in a good way for a change.
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