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  1. In Memory of LAJ_FETT: Please share your remembrances and condolences HERE

JCC A critical analysis of socio-cultural tropes as presented by Disney characters

Discussion in 'Community' started by GrandAdmiralJello , May 28, 2009.

  1. Aytee-Aytee

    Aytee-Aytee Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 20, 2008
    What is really scary is the fact that all of the furniture is really just the palace court under a curse.

    So when that one chest eats the baker and then belches.....and then later turns back into a human.....

    Yessirree, Disney Cannibalism!
     
  2. QueenMother_LK

    QueenMother_LK Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Feb 17, 2009
    errghh :mad: You know I hate the cold!!!

    too late. lol. And I meant that it scared me when I was little. Like 4 years old.
     
  3. Aytee-Aytee

    Aytee-Aytee Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 20, 2008
    Lee: And Jasmine would be Paris Hilton.

    No. So what if she's an heiress? She's got more morals than Paris Hilton ever had.

    Plus a really big tiger. That mauls people.

    Belle showed remarkable self-awareness. She was able to manuever through a chaotic city whilst reading, and avoided numerous obstacles and pitfalls like the drainage water. She's clearly very possessed of her wits.

    At the same time, she is singing a song about just how predictable and stale her town is. For her to maneuver around a "chaotic" city is equivalent to Bill Murray maneuvering around in Groundhog Day.

     
  4. GrandAdmiralJello

    GrandAdmiralJello Comms Admin ❉ Moderator Communitatis Litterarumque star 10 Staff Member Administrator

    Registered:
    Nov 28, 2000
    Ah, but to the town, they think that life is exciting. She's merely exhibiting her own mastery of circumstance.




    with permission etc:

    SonofCtesiphon: WHAT
    SonofCtesiphon: Paris Hilton?
    SonofCtesiphon: You go too far, sir
    SonofCtesiphon: Also, it turns out I do not have a good memory of Disney films
    Admiral Jello: I, as always, keep the primary source foremost in mind.
    Admiral Jello: it's what a good philologist does
    SonofCtesiphon: Does Nala count as Disney princess?
    Admiral Jello: hm.
    Admiral Jello: not officially
    SonofCtesiphon: Because she's probably better than both, realistically
    Admiral Jello: mostly because they don't sell dresses of her :p
    Admiral Jello: also, she is Simba's half-sister
    Admiral Jello: do we really want to go there?
    SonofCtesiphon: lolol
    SonofCtesiphon: Oh, oops
    SonofCtesiphon: Not nala
    SonofCtesiphon: Sarabi, was it?
    Admiral Jello: the mother?
    SonofCtesiphon: Yes
    SonofCtesiphon: Sarabi was not in a position to refuse
    Admiral Jello: so you advocate submission and cowardice?
    Admiral Jello: just like a Persian
    Admiral Jello: always kneeling before your "Great King"
    SonofCtesiphon: As Musical pointed out
    SonofCtesiphon: She held her people together
    SonofCtesiphon: At immeasurable personal cost to herself
    SonofCtesiphon: This sort of self-sacrifice is the very epitome
    SonofCtesiphon: Of leadership
    Admiral Jello: she lead them to death and decay
    SonofCtesiphon: She didn't lead them anywhere
    SonofCtesiphon: She prevented a complete collapse of civilization
    Admiral Jello: you are just a misogynist
    SonofCtesiphon: In fact, this is all very much like
    SonofCtesiphon: What
    Admiral Jello: Sarabi and Jasmine
    Admiral Jello: and Jafar and Scar are like the same person
    SonofCtesiphon: How Constantine should not have tried to reconquer Rome
    SonofCtesiphon: Because even though barbarians were nominally in charge
    SonofCtesiphon: Romans were still actually running things and maintaing society
    SonofCtesiphon: Exactly the same thing is true of Sarabi
    Admiral Jello: Justinian
    Admiral Jello: and society wasn't maintained
    Admiral Jello: it was being destroyed
    Admiral Jello: the food was gone, remember?
    Admiral Jello: the pride lands were all burnt and destroyed
    SonofCtesiphon: YEs, but much more slowly than it began to be destroyed
    Admiral Jello: all the animals, gone
    Admiral Jello: the circle of life was vanished
    Admiral Jello: *vanquished
    Admiral Jello: :p
    SonofCtesiphon: She was doing the best she could in an extremely difficult situation
    SonofCtesiphon: And you are showing no respect for that
    SonofCtesiphon: Though your complete refusal to consider nuance or context
    SonofCtesiphon: Does mark you as a Republican
    SonofCtesiphon: :p
    SonofCtesiphon: I'm just waiting for you to get to the part about her bootstraps
    Admiral Jello: that would work better for Cinderella though
    Admiral Jello: Belle pulled herself by her bootstraps, while the bootstraps saved Cinderella
    Admiral Jello: :p
    SonofCtesiphon: hahaha
     
  5. Jabba-wocky

    Jabba-wocky Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    May 4, 2003
    You ought to notice how she does absolutely nothing but prance around town, chase after luxury, and whine about her unfulfilling life. Meanwhile contributing absolutely nothing to society, while the rest of the town is left to grinding labor of surviving in medieval Europe. What's noble about being a free-loader?
     
  6. PrincessKenobi

    PrincessKenobi Manager Emeritus star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Aug 12, 2000
    While the town maybe slow and stale at most times, morning in most European cities at this time were full of hustle and bustle. It's amazing she didn't get hurt while walking and reading.

    ~PK~
     
  7. GrandAdmiralJello

    GrandAdmiralJello Comms Admin ❉ Moderator Communitatis Litterarumque star 10 Staff Member Administrator

    Registered:
    Nov 28, 2000
    Wocky, you don't understand medieval society, do you? Her very emphasis on the life of the mind--or of luxury--above a life of toil proves her inner nobility. Leisure is for the better sort.
     
  8. QueenMother_LK

    QueenMother_LK Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Feb 17, 2009
    [image=http://www.freewebs.com/thedisneyclassics/pocahontas4.jpg]

    [image=http://www.hollywoodstandups.com/images/641%20Ariel.jpg]

    these two were my favorite, hands down. And, honestly, I liked Jasmine a lot too.
     
  9. Aytee-Aytee

    Aytee-Aytee Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 20, 2008
    It is not. And all she is exhibiting is how bored she is with life in general.
     
  10. GrandAdmiralJello

    GrandAdmiralJello Comms Admin ❉ Moderator Communitatis Litterarumque star 10 Staff Member Administrator

    Registered:
    Nov 28, 2000
    Superior individuals are often bored with mediocrity, and those who excel are likewise so.
     
  11. PrincessKenobi

    PrincessKenobi Manager Emeritus star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Aug 12, 2000
    Jasmine, leaves castle because her father is forcing her to get married. While a good reason to leave. It's all in self-interest.

    Belle, leaves her normal life to save her father. Heroine


    Comparing Jasmine to Belle is like comparing Snow White to Belle. Both Jasmine and Snow White were only interested in themselves and what helped them along the way.

    ~PK~
     
  12. Aytee-Aytee

    Aytee-Aytee Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 20, 2008
    Superiority to one's surroundings does not necessarily mean superior in the grand scheme of things.

    Its like saying someone is superior for having syph while everyone else has AIDS.
     
  13. GrandAdmiralJello

    GrandAdmiralJello Comms Admin ❉ Moderator Communitatis Litterarumque star 10 Staff Member Administrator

    Registered:
    Nov 28, 2000
  14. Jabba-wocky

    Jabba-wocky Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    May 4, 2003
    With permission:


    The Xenocide441: hell, belle is a classic battered woman
    SonofCtesiphon: LOLOLOL
    The Xenocide441: the guy KIDNAPPED her and almost BEAT her and she not only wanted to help his vinegar fresh session ass, she fell in love
    The Xenocide441: that's what rihanna watched when she was younger
     
  15. QueenMother_LK

    QueenMother_LK Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Feb 17, 2009
    she was in France...
     
  16. Aytee-Aytee

    Aytee-Aytee Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 20, 2008
    True enough.

    Belle would be the woman on COPS saying "Naw, Jim-Bob didn't do nuthin'..."
     
  17. GrandAdmiralJello

    GrandAdmiralJello Comms Admin ❉ Moderator Communitatis Litterarumque star 10 Staff Member Administrator

    Registered:
    Nov 28, 2000
    That is so far from the truth it's not even funny.

    She RESISTED the one who was violent and horrible: Gaston.

    And she was not kidnapped, she was arrested. The Beast is a feudal prince: not only does he own the castle, but all of the land. And she trespassed.

    But while the Beast did not behave himself, she absolutely refused to have anything to do with him. He tried to bribe her with expensive things, and she still refused. She, in fact, ran away. It was only after the Beast saved her and became a decent person that she decided to be with him.

    How could you get it so wrong, Even?
     
  18. The Musical Jedi

    The Musical Jedi Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Dec 13, 1999
    But her behavior proves her superiority throughout the movie - she goes back to help the Beast even when she doesn't have to and has set her free (after the wolf attack). She knows she did him wrong and tries to redeem that behavior. She also tries to save him from the townspeople at great risk to herself, when the Beast himself would have preferred to curl up and die.

    She proves she is superior in multiple surroundings, not just her provincial town.
     
  19. PrincessKenobi

    PrincessKenobi Manager Emeritus star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Aug 12, 2000
    Oh, so you would rather Belle end up with Gaston.....



    ~PK~
     
  20. QueenMother_LK

    QueenMother_LK Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Feb 17, 2009
    okay, yeah, I don't remember this movie.
     
  21. Darth Guy

    Darth Guy Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Aug 16, 2002
    Why must female Disney characters always "end up" with someone? Poor Quasimodo didn't get ****.
     
  22. Aytee-Aytee

    Aytee-Aytee Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 20, 2008
    Like there was any real choice. His possessed furniture killed every other townsman. What was she going to do? Pull a Lot's daughter surprise?


    Which sucks royally because he was the one doing all the work. Phoebus just showed up and looked pretty.
     
  23. Bacon164

    Bacon164 Chosen One star 8

    Registered:
    Mar 22, 2005
    WATCH THE SECOND ONE
     
  24. QueenMother_LK

    QueenMother_LK Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Feb 17, 2009
    he was *ugly.
     
  25. PrincessKenobi

    PrincessKenobi Manager Emeritus star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Aug 12, 2000
    He let her go. In the end he said you can leave. He didn't care if she came back to him and be with him. But she did. And that takes a real strength to go against the status quo and not care what others think.

    ~PK~