main
side
curve
  1. Welcome to the new boards! Details here!

Lit A Cynical Walk Through the NJO

Discussion in 'Literature' started by Cynical_Ben, Aug 17, 2013.

  1. Jedi Ben

    Jedi Ben Chosen One star 7

    Registered:
    Jul 19, 1999
    Yet DM, you're one of the most frequent people to say the book isn't understood - so what I was suggesting was a probable reason for that. If it is so clear how come there is the amount of confusion and misunderstanding around it? How come it wasn't understood by other EU authors easily?

    I'm not suggesting what I've posted is the answer, merely an attempt at one.
     
  2. DigitalMessiah

    DigitalMessiah Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Feb 17, 2004
    When did I say it wasn't misunderstood? Point out my hypocrisies!

    I'm kinda of curious where I contradicted myself on this one. I know I have on other stuff in the past.
     
  3. Jedi Ben

    Jedi Ben Chosen One star 7

    Registered:
    Jul 19, 1999
    Pretty certain I wasn't accusing you of anything.
     
  4. DigitalMessiah

    DigitalMessiah Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Feb 17, 2004
    I know , I'm accusing myself. I don't know where I contradicted myself in this particular instance, but I know I have in the past. I don't remember saying the novel was well understood but I wouldn't be surprised if I did somewhere sometime.
     
  5. Gamiel

    Gamiel Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Dec 16, 2012
    I should have worded this differently. What I was trying to say was that in Cynical_Ben 's original post he described Jacon in a way that I thought would have fitted better if Jacon was older and more mature. He is not even out of his teens and to say that he has been "kept ... blind for a long while" feels unfair since he has, metaphorical, just begun to truly develop his eyes.



    Do we know what Vergere's plan was if she had failed to enlighten Jacon was
     
  6. Revanfan1

    Revanfan1 Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Jun 3, 2013
    No, she probably didn't have one. She was hanging everything on Jacen.
     
  7. Gamiel

    Gamiel Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Dec 16, 2012
    If some body tells you that everything they tell you is a lie, do you believe they are telling the truth?


    Wonder how many failed "students" she has left behind
     
  8. Revanfan1

    Revanfan1 Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Jun 3, 2013
    C'baoth seemed to have a connection to her. [face_dunno]
     
  9. Rew

    Rew Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 22, 2008
    A certain former Tusken Raider comes to mind. :)
     
  10. DigitalMessiah

    DigitalMessiah Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Feb 17, 2004
    Ask yourself. Where else can one look?
     
  11. Gamiel

    Gamiel Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Dec 16, 2012
    But then they would be lying since everything they say is a lie
    http://owmysanity.comicgenesis.com/d/20110118.html
     
  12. Force Smuggler

    Force Smuggler Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Sep 2, 2012
    Who here thinks that Kyp should have been the one to find Jacen and not Ganner?
     
  13. DigitalMessiah

    DigitalMessiah Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Feb 17, 2004
    Kyp isn't a dashing, swashbuckling, puckish rogue of the holodramas, so no.
     
  14. Gamiel

    Gamiel Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Dec 16, 2012
    He could have been...
     
  15. Force Smuggler

    Force Smuggler Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Sep 2, 2012
    Well I was reading an article on 1138 about best deaths in the EU and it mentioned Kyp being used instead of Ganner and that got me thinking. We would still have Ganner and a fitting story end for Kyp. Sacrificing himself for Jacen who he didn't agree with on the Force and the only one to believe he was alive. Also atonement for Cardia and Sernpidal.
     
  16. DigitalMessiah

    DigitalMessiah Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Feb 17, 2004
    Ganner went out on top and the whole point to the novel is encapsulated in Ganner's last stand.

    Who is Ganner Rhysode? The dashing, swashbuckling, puckish rogue of the holodramas. He stopped trying to be a Jedi, and simply was. "Greatness -- true greatness of any kind -- requires the surrender of control. Passion that is guided, not walled away. Leave your limits behind."

    "Letting slip the bonds of control, leaving aside conscious thought, answering only the surge of his passion and his joy, he finds power undreamed of."


    "He was born to be a legend."

    It wouldn't work with Kyp. And swapping the two characters, Ganner would be another character in the background that does nothing. Ganner is a much more interesting character in death than Kyp is in life, and swapping the two would be the same difference as swapping the names of Anakin and Jacen in the NJO.
     
    Revanfan1 likes this.
  17. Gamiel

    Gamiel Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Dec 16, 2012
    My bold
    I am certain that Palpatine was feeling great when he surrendered the control of his Force storm
    [​IMG]
     
  18. Jedi Ben

    Jedi Ben Chosen One star 7

    Registered:
    Jul 19, 1999
    Wouldn't really class that as surrendering.
     
  19. Gamiel

    Gamiel Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Dec 16, 2012
    True but he still lost his control when using "the raw, unrestrained Force itself"
     
  20. Jedi Ben

    Jedi Ben Chosen One star 7

    Registered:
    Jul 19, 1999
    Yes, but I'd see a difference between the two.

    If you're pulling on a kite then let it go then that's different from me cutting the line with a sword unexpectedly - with Sidious in DE, it's the latter.

    Plus, Sidious didn't lose control until Luke and Leia went and severed it! Previously he had directed Force Storms, such as the one that hits Coruscant at the start.
     
  21. DigitalMessiah

    DigitalMessiah Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Feb 17, 2004
    There's a difference between taking language literally and understanding that all language is metaphor and gleaning the meaning behind the words.
     
  22. Force Smuggler

    Force Smuggler Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Sep 2, 2012
    Kyp might not have been as epic as Ganner but it would be just as fitting imo.
     
  23. DigitalMessiah

    DigitalMessiah Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Feb 17, 2004
    It isn't about how epic it is, it is about demonstrating what Vergere's point was. Ganner's last stand fed directly into who Ganner was as a person. Kyp wasn't a flashy wannabe hero.
     
  24. Force Smuggler

    Force Smuggler Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Sep 2, 2012
    Your harshest critic (the leader of of the proactive section of the Jedi Order) not believing that you were dead and came after you, realizing his path might not be the best way to beat the Vong, sacrifices himself so that the one he didn't agree with on the Force may live and make one last atonement for Cardia and Sernpidal.

    I guess I like it since the Jedi Academy trilogy was my first foray into the novels and grew attached to the characters in the story like Kyp and feel like it would be the best end for Kyp.
     
    darth fluffy likes this.
  25. Gamiel

    Gamiel Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Dec 16, 2012
    my bold
    I am certain that Palpatine was feeling great when he surrendered the control of his Force storm
    [​IMG]

    Better?