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  1. In Memory of LAJ_FETT: Please share your remembrances and condolences HERE

Lit Comics A Look Back at Dark Horse Star Wars, Year By Year: Now Discussing 1998 [WARNING: IMAGE INTENSE]

Discussion in 'Literature' started by The2ndQuest , Jan 13, 2014.

Page 3 of 7
  1. Lt.Cmdr.Thrawn

    Lt.Cmdr.Thrawn Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Sep 23, 1999
    It's complicated. In Brackett's draft, plus the early notes, Luke has a sister being trained as a Jedi across the galaxy at the same time he's on Dagobah. Nellith is the name Brackett used. Then the whole sequence was dropped. And in the next draft, when Luke leaves, Yoda says something like "now we must search for another." With each successive draft it got more definite, until "there is another." Even though Lucas said it was inserted just to say that Luke could be in danger, it would seem to convey more than that.

    However, Kurtz's recollections don't seem to match any of the versions of the story unearthed in Rinzler's Making Of books, which are quite extensive. If I recall, when they were making ESB, the Emperor would appear in the next film and be dethroned. Obviously by that point there wouldn't have been time to find the sister, so it's jumbled. It's possible he was thinking of an earlier conception where the saga would have twelve or more chapters, and the Emperor would appear in the last of those, and combining that with the notion of the sister across the galaxy. All of that is pre-9-film-saga stuff (or so it seems), so he'd have to be combining Emperor dies in last film + sister across the galaxy + only nine films, of which the last three are a self-organized trilogy.

    Finally, unfortunately there doesn't seem to be any concept of the sister, or any other Other, being a hook inserted for the sequel trilogy, no matter how cool the idea is. In Making of Return of the Jedi, there's barely any mention of this at all. Zero discussion is presented on how it occurred to Lucas to merge the characters. In one of the earliest outlines, he simply appends a note, "sister!", to a mention of Leia's name during the scene when Luke, Han, and Leia meet up on the sanctuary moon after the climax.
     
    Lt.Cmdr.Thrawn, Jan 15, 2014
    #51
  2. _Catherine_

    _Catherine_ Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jun 16, 2007
    That sounds like George all right.
     
    _Catherine_, Jan 15, 2014
    #52
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  3. The2ndQuest

    The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Jan 27, 2000
    And onto the last two "slow" years for DHC SW comics. Subsequent updates will focus on single years.


    1993- 1994​
    January 1993
    Classic Star Wars #6 / Cover

    February 1993
    Classic Star Wars #7 / Cover

    April 1993
    Classic Star Wars #8 / Cover

    May 1993
    Classic Star Wars #9 / Cover
    Dark Empire TPB / Cover

    June 1993
    Classic Star Wars #10 / Cover

    July 1993
    Classic Star Wars #11 / Cover

    September 1993
    Classic Star Wars #12 / Cover

    October 1993
    Classic Star Wars #13 / Cover
    Tales of the Jedi #1: Ulic Qel-Droma and the Beast Wars of Onderon, part 1 (of 2) / Cover

    November 1993
    Classic Star Wars #14 / Cover
    Tales of the Jedi #2: Ulic Qel-Droma and the Beast Wars of Onderon, part 2 (of 2) / Cover

    December 1993
    Classic Star Wars #15 / Cover
    Tales of the Jedi #3: The Saga of Nomi Sunrider, part 1 (of 3) / Cover

    January 1994
    Tales of the Jedi #4: The Saga of Nomi Sunrider, part 2 (of 3) / Cover

    February 1994
    Classic Star Wars #16 / Cover
    Tales of the Jedi #5: The Saga of Nomi Sunrider, part 3 (of 3) / Cover

    March 1994
    Classic Star Wars #17 / Cover

    April 1994
    Classic Star Wars #18 / Cover
    Droids #1 (of 6): The Kalarba Adventures / Cover

    May 1994
    Classic Star Wars #19 / Cover
    Droids #2 (of 6): The Kalarba Adventures / Cover

    June 1994
    Classic Star Wars: A New Hope #1 (of 2) / Cover
    Classic Star Wars #20 / Cover
    Droids #3 (of 6): The Kalarba Adventures / Cover

    July 1994
    Classic Star Wars: A New Hope #2 (of 2) / Cover
    Droids #4 (of 6): The Kalarba Adventures / Cover

    August 1994
    Classic Star Wars: The Empire Strikes Back #1 (of 2) / Cover
    Classic Star Wars: The Early Adventures #1 / Cover
    Droids #5 (of 6): The Kalarba Adventures / Cover
    Tales of the Jedi: The Freedon Nadd Uprising, part 1 (of 2) / Cover
    Tales of the Jedi: Knights of the Old Republic TPB / Cover

    September 1994
    Classic Star Wars: The Empire Strikes Back #2 (of 2) / Cover
    Classic Star Wars: The Early Adventures #2 / Cover
    Droids #6 (of 6): The Kalarba Adventures / Cover
    Tales of the Jedi: Dark Lords of the Sith: Special Ashcan Edition / Cover
    Tales of the Jedi: The Freedon Nadd Uprising, part 2 (of 2): Initiates of the Sith / Cover

    October 1994
    Classic Star Wars: Return of the Jedi #1 (of 2) / Cover
    Classic Star Wars: The Early Adventures #3 / Cover
    Droids: Artoo's Day Out (Topps Magazine)
    Tales of the Jedi: Dark Lords of the Sith, part 1 (of 6): Masters and Students of the Force / Cover

    November 1994
    Classic Star Wars: Return of the Jedi #2 (of 2) / Cover
    Classic Star Wars: The Early Adventures #4 / Cover
    Tales of the Jedi: Dark Lords of the Sith, part 2 (of 6): The Quest for the Sith / Cover

    December 1994
    Classic Star Wars: The Early Adventures #5 / Cover
    Dark Empire II #1 (of 6): Operation Shadow Hand / Cover
    Tales of the Jedi: Dark Lords of the Sith, part 3 (of 6): Descent to the Dark Side / Cover


    So, we see DHC going rapidly through the remaining Classic SW content, and into the film adaptations (with the 1995 THX rereleases on the horizon, makes sense).

    This cover makes me want to caption the Squid in a Batvoice:

    [​IMG]

    "WHERE IS NICK?! WHERE IS HE?!?!"
    "I swim-"
    "SWIM TO ME!!!"

    That is one angry-lookin' octo
    I find it interesting that the ANH covers are polar opposites of one another: the first is really super-busy, the second is very simple and kinda dull (in that its basically a movie still in a way).

    I'm not going to include the release date of every TPB in this thread- just want to list some of the notable ones.

    In this case, DE1's TPB with a new Dorman piece reworking the classic Luke/Vader pic into an action pose. And also TOTJ's first TPB, which would eventually get reprinted with the subtitle "Knights of the Old Republic"- the first time that title would be used. However, it would obviously not be the last.

    And speaking of Dorman, he's really dominating things in these two years between the various TOTJ and DE titles.

    TOTJ #1's cover is still one of my favorite and, IMO, one of the handful of Dorman covers that have become iconic pieces of SW art:

    [​IMG]

    It was also the supposed basis for the original "Darth Vader was the 13th Dark Lord of the Sith" backstory they were going with: each of those lightsabers were supposed to represent a Dark Lord of the Sith, with Ulic's being #11- and the yet-to-come Exar and Vader being unpictured.

    And then... ENTER THE QUEST!

    [​IMG]

    This was the first Star Wars comic I purchased- my second or third ever (following Uncanny X-Men #300 & Detective Comics #500- the latter of which was purchased alongside this issue). I bought it off a comics/magazine shelf in a Teacher's Store my mom was buying some supplies from.

    Turned out to be perfect timing- it may not have been the first issue of the series/collection, but it was the first issue of a story arc- and that also implied an anthology series, which was very appealing as a concept to me (and still is). Obviously the success of the series steered them away from that anthology approach, but the impression of the intention was nonetheless effective on me.

    I think it's also worth noting that this is the first SW series, not counting the Marvel Droids/Ewoks, to get it's own title logo as opposed to normal lettering under the SW logo (albeit it one mostly copied from the pre-95 Return of the Jedi font). I think that's a pretty significant statement for a series.

    They really did go through the TOTJ at a quick pace though, didn't they? It was almost an ongoing. Also, I miss ashcans.

    I was also rather fond of this DLOTS cover:

    [​IMG]

    Then again, I've also been fond of this cover:

    [​IMG]

    So maybe I just like cliches.

    By contrast, I hated this cover:

    [​IMG]

    Not because it was a bad cover (it's fine, just an average one amongst great ones), but because this was the issue I always saw on magazine racks in Toys R Us or in stores for what seems like forever and I quickly became tired of seeing it and that impression has stayed with me for twenty years.

    The Droids series was a quirky thing, wasn't it? i think it was meant to provide something more kid-friendly to offset the darker material being put out in their original titles while still being something modern to appeal beyond the reprinted content.

    Also, the way they decided to do the numbering between this at-the-time-untitled series and the subsequent "ongoing" series (these "x of 6" followed by a new #1 and beyond) confused the living **** out of me as a kid because I had some of each and had to reconcile having issues with the same # on their cover. Damn 90's numbering schemes.

    Their covers weren't particularly memorable, but this one stands out to me:

    [​IMG]

    You don't forget that one.

    I'm not sure of DHC was involved with the Artoo's Day Out, as it was published by Topps, but I assume they were. Couldn't find a pic for it, but I'm guesisng it didn't have a cover, given that it was in a magazine.

    And, lastly, we end '94 with a bang: Dark Empire II. Most of the covers in this series are so ingrained into my brain, but I'll go into that when we get the rest of them in the next update. But here is the sweet #1:

    [​IMG]

    Just loved the new tech they threw out there. Though someone a few posts back described Cam's art as making things seem post-apocalyptic, and seeing stuff from there and here makes me think "Warhammer" with the armor and tech designs that I start thinking that description becomes more and more accurate.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    It's also worth briefly mentioning Lightsider- which was meant to be a prologue to DE2 but was never published (the closest is in a scene added to the audio drama version of this story). I can't help but think the scuffle over that is what led to KJA taking over the reigns of TOTJ from Veitch and the true reason EE got the treatment it eventually did. Maybe not in whole, but I can't help but think it wasn't a significant factor.

    As I believe I brought up earlier in the thread, I recall DE2 ads in various comics at the time (no doubt many in other DHC SW titles). I really should dig through my issues and see if i can find the one I'm thinking of, but I'm pretty sure it used this panel as the basis for the ad's art, or an arrangement very similar to it:

    [​IMG]

    On the Wook, I found this special preview cover art, which I think uses the same tagline I recall being associated with the art above:

    [​IMG]

    Anyways, at this point I think DHC's SW line is basically firing on all cylinders with the core of what people tend to associate most with 1990's DHC SW comics (the DE & TOTJ series) in full swing. Once we can throw Rogue Squadron into the mix we'll basically have the core recipe cookin'.

    Now, as I said, 1993 & 1994 were the beginnings of my SW comics reading, and at the early days of the EU's formation and the precipice of SW coming back and exploding back onto the scene in a big way, it's literally impossible for me to not associate some of these titles with the foundation of my SW fandom beyond the films.

    Also, the more I look at pics from DE1 & DE2, the more I feel compelled to make a movie and/or video game that looks exactly like that art style's contrast and color scheme. And I will do so knowing full well that half of you will absolutely hate it because of that. ;)
     
    The2ndQuest , Jan 22, 2014
    #53
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  4. DigitalMessiah

    DigitalMessiah Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Feb 17, 2004
    This is pretty much the golden age of SW comics for me, though I suppose that's true of the whole decade.

    C-3PX ftw.

    Since I'm reliving my 90s SW glory days, I figure I'll point out that I own this shirt:
    [​IMG]

    Edit: Oh, and this was the epic Dark Empire II cover among me and my friends:
    [​IMG]
    But I guess I'm skipping ahead!
     
    DigitalMessiah, Jan 22, 2014
    #54
  5. The2ndQuest

    The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Jan 27, 2000
    You're free to talk about the rest of DE2 but I'm going to refrain until the next update, just to break things up a bit. Because, man, there's a story behind that cover and the preceding one for me.
     
    The2ndQuest , Jan 22, 2014
    #55
  6. DigitalMessiah

    DigitalMessiah Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Feb 17, 2004
    I really like the art design for Balmorra and the war droids and the like too. I've always liked the X-1 Vipers, but the SD ones are cool too.
     
    DigitalMessiah, Jan 22, 2014
    #56
  7. Nobody145

    Nobody145 Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Feb 9, 2007
    Yeah, they should have stopped with just Dark Empire I, but the opening battle of DE2 was just really, really cool. Too bad we rarely see that kind of droid battle anymore- even the Clone Wars was mostly droids against clones. The Viper was just an awesome design too. Not sure we ever see it again anywhere else, but if so, too bad. Though if it is ever mentioned again, they would probably just mention it as not doing so well against the Vong.

    I wasn't into comics much but I still remember seeing those Tales of the Jedi TPBs in bookstores. To this day, that image of the Jedi, Ulic and Cay out there trying to save planets, still stays with me. Not sure if that fit my idea of what the Jedi were like before the Dark Times or if TotJ just influenced my thinking that much.
     
    Nobody145, Jan 22, 2014
    #57
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  8. DigitalMessiah

    DigitalMessiah Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Feb 17, 2004
    Yeah, I feel like Tales of the Jedi really informed my view of what a Jedi is, and when the prequels didn't match up it was like an ontological shock for Star Wars. But now I don't really see much a disconnect between the Jedi in TOTJ and in the prequels, except that they became more institutionalized and dogmatic in their way of doing things.

    But I really miss the Star Wars aesthetic of the 90s. I feel like the recent EU has been emphasizing the wrong notes from the prequels.
     
    DigitalMessiah, Jan 22, 2014
    #58
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  9. Jeff_Ferguson

    Jeff_Ferguson Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    May 15, 2006
    As a diehard Artoo & Threepio fan, I love Dark Horse's Droids series. Characters like Dictator-Forever Craw are genuinely hilarious, and some of the storylines in the later arcs are real page-turners. The Kalarba Adventures was actually the least memorable of the series for me, probably due to its episodic format contrasted with the actual story arcs that followed it. Olag Greck is a better villain when he has one nefarious scheme, complete with intrigue and betrayals, running through an entire story arc, but in The Kalarba Adventures he's more like an eighties cartoon villain who hatches something new every issue and constantly has his plans foiled by the meddling droids. Maybe the various one-shot stories of Kalarba are more kid-friendly, but hey, I like story arcs.
     
    Jeff_Ferguson, Jan 22, 2014
    #59
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  10. SWpants

    SWpants Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Oct 28, 2004
    Wow. I didn't realize that "Tales" was written so long ago, that Nomi & Ulic & Nadd had their stories for 20 years.

    I just finished the first "Tales of the Jedi" Omnibus which includes the Sunrider & Qel-Droma arcs. There was SO MUCH ART. That sounds silly, but you could tell that the artists and inkers put time and effort into developing scenes that made the reader actually look at what's going on instead of glossing over things.


    I randomly clicked on the Droids #4 cover, and that just made me laugh.
     
    SWpants, Jan 23, 2014
    #60
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  11. The2ndQuest

    The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Jan 27, 2000
    Also, given my mixed memories of the content, I can't remember which Droids series it happened in (this or the subsequent one), but I think it's worth noting that, at least until they had to backtrack by the end of the series, that one of the stories actually seemed to explain the origin of 3PO's silver leg, which was kind of a big deal at the time (explaining a distinguishing character trait from the movies with an implied history).

    Even if the prequels ultimately decided to gloss over it for the most part, it was one of those small details like Anakin's scar that people assumed would have a story behind it in the prequels. It was the sort of detail people dwelled on the 90's since it's all you really had to go on as far as prequel speculation went.

    Now, again, the story undid the leg eventually, but it did draw a few more eyes toward the series.
     
    The2ndQuest , Jan 23, 2014
    #61
  12. The2ndQuest

    The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Jan 27, 2000
    One other thing I forgot to comment on was how TOTJ basically established the first era outside that of the films (one could argue that with all the new tech introduced, that Dark Empire was its own era but I think that was still more of an extension to the film era than a brand new one- especially compared to TOTJ).

    They managed to make the technology look older but still used (just more experimental) and the clothing feel \like Star Wars but slightly more medieval frontier-meets-a-dash-of-pirates-and-barbarians. And small touches like the larger lightsabers (which are still my favorite lightsaber hilt designs in the franchise- not to mention the way their blades seem to drip with energy) added to that.

    And, of course, a very significant piece of tech introduction...

    [​IMG]
     
    The2ndQuest , Jan 24, 2014
    #62
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  13. DigitalMessiah

    DigitalMessiah Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Feb 17, 2004
    Tott Doneeta had a curved hilt lightsaber too.
     
    DigitalMessiah, Jan 24, 2014
    #63
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  14. Lt.Cmdr.Thrawn

    Lt.Cmdr.Thrawn Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Sep 23, 1999
    Also I was just looking at Tales of the Jedi #2, and at one point Master Arca explains that Freedon Nadd apprenticed himself to the Dark Lord of the Sith. But as long as that Lord was alive, Nadd couldn't become a Dark Lord himself, because apparently there can only be one Dark Lord at a time. What's interesting to me about this (aside from the cover of the previous issue with the potential for twelve - thirteen? whatever - Dark Lords throughout history, including Darth Vader... but not Palpatine) is that some of the information for ToTJ came from Lucas, right? Wasn't it something like, the comics creators wanted to tell a story with ancient Jedi and ancient dark-siders, and Lucas was like, 'hey, check out these notes I had that relate to that general concept, with a group of dark-siders called the Sith!' And there was communication of some kind between Lucas and the comics guys. So I wonder if this 'one Dark Lord at a time' thing either is something that came from Lucas's notes (a sort of proto-conceptual-Rule of Two, which may even conceptually date from the days of the OT, even though it isn't in those films - the comics came out a year or two before he started really writing Episode I, but there seem to be a few yellow notepads, perhaps always accumulating) OR if perhaps this is something written into the comics that Lucas picked up, changed a little bit, and then used in the films (providing the inspiration for the Rule of Two, then).
     
    Lt.Cmdr.Thrawn, Jan 24, 2014
    #64
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  15. Iron_lord

    Iron_lord Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Sep 2, 2012
    I like the possibility, at least.
     
    Iron_lord, Jan 24, 2014
    #65
  16. DigitalMessiah

    DigitalMessiah Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Feb 17, 2004
    It is hard to figure if the early Rule of Two between Exar and Ulic is from Lucas, who was writing Episode I by this point, or simply emulating the OT with Palpatine and Vader.

    I actually favor the idea that it was from Lucas because Palpatine was not identified as a Sith until 1999.
     
    DigitalMessiah, Jan 24, 2014
    #66
  17. Lt.Cmdr.Thrawn

    Lt.Cmdr.Thrawn Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Sep 23, 1999
    That's what I mean. Lucas could have:

    -been thinking of ideas for Episode I (though I think the comics came out before he actually started writing a script, at least judging by the documentary I just watched on the TPM DVD) and the Rule of Two was part of that...

    -or he could have had something like the Rule of Two in his head and notes in the OT (similar to how the phrase 'chosen one' appears in some of his ESB concept-notes, but applies to Luke and possibly proto-Yoda, and is anyway not taken any farther than concept-speculation)

    In either of those cases, those ideas could have been included in whatever he shared with the TotJ guys.

    OR Lucas could have seen that effective 'Rule of ONE' in TotJ and taken that general concept and run with it, turning it into his Rule of Two.

    ...or it could just be a coincidence.
     
    Lt.Cmdr.Thrawn, Jan 24, 2014
    #67
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  18. DigitalMessiah

    DigitalMessiah Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Feb 17, 2004
    Lucas' description of the rule of two as a de facto thing in the Moyers' interview suggests that it might be an idea he had during VI, since he uses the situation of Palps, Ani, and Luke as why there can only ever be two.
     
    DigitalMessiah, Jan 24, 2014
    #68
  19. Lt.Cmdr.Thrawn

    Lt.Cmdr.Thrawn Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Sep 23, 1999
    I'm unfamiliar with this, could you detail?
     
    Lt.Cmdr.Thrawn, Jan 24, 2014
    #69
  20. DigitalMessiah

    DigitalMessiah Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Feb 17, 2004
    http://www.next-wave.org/may99/starwars.htm
     
    DigitalMessiah, Jan 24, 2014
    #70
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  21. Lt.Cmdr.Thrawn

    Lt.Cmdr.Thrawn Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Sep 23, 1999
    Ah. I'm leery of getting too tangential but regarding a 'de facto' rule of two in ROTJ... possible. I'll go back through Making of ROTJ to see if there are any notes that seem relevant. Obviously Palpatine and Vader are playing off one another as early as ESB. But it would have to be 'de facto' rule of two, or just something that Palpatine preferred, rather than a Sith construct because as you mention, Palpatine wasn't a Sith at the time.

    To take it back to the comics, do any of the comic creators communicate with fans, like on FB or Twitter? Perhaps someone could ask them about this type of thing.
     
    Lt.Cmdr.Thrawn, Jan 24, 2014
    #71
  22. Jedi Ben

    Jedi Ben Chosen One star 9

    Registered:
    Jul 19, 1999
    You can say a lot about DE2, but that art is spectacular!

    Classic Star Wars, TOTJ - DHC really kept pushing things and it paid off. It's a great shame we never got any more David Roach artwork beyond the 2-part TOTJ arc with Nomi - his visuals for that were wonderful. The Dorman covers were utterly superb too. Which only made the Freedon Nadd Uprising an even bigger artistic stinker! Fortunately that was followed by superb Gossett art on Dark Lords of the Sith that introduced one of my favourite EU locations - Korriban!

    I still like the central concept that KJA had, that in the absence of any info concerning the destroyed Jedi Order, Luke must go back further to the more ancient Jedi traditions to revive the order in new form. In training a set of students on Yavin IV, he is walking in the steps already trodden by Masters Arca and Thon.
     
    Jedi Ben, Jan 24, 2014
    #72
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  23. AdmiralWesJanson

    AdmiralWesJanson Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    May 23, 2005
    Kind of sad to see the obsessive love of Boba Fett starting so early- he made a comeback in Dark Empire for no real reason than the cool factor, and immediately after, in Dark Empire 2, he comes back again (and loses again).
     
    AdmiralWesJanson, Jan 24, 2014
    #73
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  24. DigitalMessiah

    DigitalMessiah Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Feb 17, 2004

    :(
     
    DigitalMessiah, Jan 24, 2014
    #74
  25. Force Smuggler

    Force Smuggler Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Sep 2, 2012
     
    Force Smuggler, Jan 24, 2014
    #75
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