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  1. In Memory of LAJ_FETT: Please share your remembrances and condolences HERE

Amph A Song of Ice and Fire Discussion Thread

Discussion in 'Community' started by -RebelScum-, Jan 3, 2006.

  1. RC-1991

    RC-1991 Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 2, 2009
    That's why I didn't link them ;)

    On the subject of crushed dreams- Wow, I bet Dany is finally going to invade Westeros in this book-OHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH DAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARIOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

    I mean, I perfectly understand why Martin wrote Dany's ADWD chapters the way he did, and they actually do feed into her character development pretty well, but they still got pretty annoying at times.
     
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  2. GrandAdmiralJello

    GrandAdmiralJello Comms Admin ❉ Moderator Communitatis Litterarumque star 10 Staff Member Administrator

    Registered:
    Nov 28, 2000
    Yeah, with that title you'd think it would be a perfect book for her to go back, but noooo. Bloody Daario.
     
  3. Darth Guy

    Darth Guy Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Aug 16, 2002
    Unlike Renly and Loras's sexuality, I am skeptical of this one. It doesn't make sense for Margaery to be sleeping around from a political standpoint, for one. For another, the only viewpoint character that goes into any detail about the accusations is crazy, paranoid Cersei, who has every reason to make up some fantasy in her mind about Ms. Tyrell's infidelities. Yeah, Pycelle said he gave her moon tea, which is a contraceptive (morning-after pill equivalent? I don't know what if there was a real-world equivalent in the middle ages), but he was a Lannister loyalist (and had his own reasons to have control over Tommen) and for all we know moon tea could have other medicinal properties.
     
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  4. Rogue_Ten

    Rogue_Ten Chosen One star 7

    Registered:
    Aug 18, 2002
    yeah there's all sorts of herbs people use for that ish. greeks had silphium

    the show is clearly depicting maegary as a big ol lady ho and they have grrm on staff so im assuming this is in the same vein as renly and loras - making explicit something the book only heavily implied
     
  5. RC-1991

    RC-1991 Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 2, 2009
    It's also possible that Pycelle was simply lying. Granted, that makes it his word against Margaery's, but it's not hard for Pycelle to mess with his own stores of the substance to make it look like he had administered Moon Tea recently.
     
  6. Darth Guy

    Darth Guy Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Aug 16, 2002
    He writes an episode a season and is credited as a "consultant," but he doesn't really have any say about the changes. That's up to the showrunners.
     
  7. GrandAdmiralJello

    GrandAdmiralJello Comms Admin ❉ Moderator Communitatis Litterarumque star 10 Staff Member Administrator

    Registered:
    Nov 28, 2000
    I have no problem believing that she was a harlot, but the thing is--she's far too blatant about it in the show. Her whole persona depends on the plausible innocence thing.
     
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  8. RC-1991

    RC-1991 Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 2, 2009
    "Do you like my dress? I can't decide if I like it better like this- or this" *strips*
     
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  9. Miana Kenobi

    Miana Kenobi Admin Emeritus star 8 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Apr 5, 2000
    I dunno, I totally got the impression that she really was sleeping around.
     
  10. Jabba-wocky

    Jabba-wocky Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    May 4, 2003
    I don't see how it would make any sense if she was. From a story-telling perspective, it makes sense to have a character that is the inverse of Cersei: chaste instead of unfaithful, kind instead of spiteful, wise instead of stupid, subtle instead of crass, meek rather than belligerent. It expands the reader's understanding of the role and limits of female life in Martin's universe, and thereby adds depth and nuance to the portrayals we've already seen. By contrast, what does it add to have yet another person sleeping around? Further, how would it be even remotely intelligent to put such a delicate secret in the hands of a man long known to be on the payroll of a women who is trying to kill you? And how would these supposed acts square with the Kettlebacks' reports to Cersei that she had virtually no opportunity for misbehavior, flanked as she always was by her cousins?

    The only solid evidence we have Margaery doing things in King's Landing is helping poor people and entertaining little children like Tommen and Alysanne.
     
  11. The Great No One

    The Great No One Jedi Grand Master star 8

    Registered:
    Jun 4, 2005
    other than the fact that maegary is not really most of those things that you listed. and frankly, i figured she was doing stuff with her cousins.
     
  12. Jabba-wocky

    Jabba-wocky Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    May 4, 2003
    How isn't she? At the end of AFFC, she revealed that she's always known Cersei was angling to eliminate her. Yet, throughout the entirety of the series, she has never once advanced a plot to strike back at Cersei. The only moves she has made in courts have been those that either genuinely stabilize the kingdom (eg sacrificing Loras to defend against the Ironborn) or improve its rulers (training Tommen in the basics of governance). Even when put under torture by the Faith, she didn't speak ill of Cersei, and had to wait for Kettleback to break before the truth came out. Why would she behave this way, unless she were sincere? Given that no one else knew what was going on, who exactly was she performing for?

    Also, if Margaery's cousins were open to the sort of activity you suggest, why would the Kettleblacks have listed it as an impediment? Wouldn't they have just slept with all of them at once?
     
  13. Coruscant

    Coruscant Chosen One star 7

    Registered:
    Feb 15, 2004
    Isn't Sansa supposed to be the inverse of Cersei? I mean, if we're talking about having two characters with some similarities, but mostly differences in all the meaningful areas for the whole storytelling potential angle.
     
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  14. Jabba-wocky

    Jabba-wocky Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    May 4, 2003
    Sansa has some contrasts with Cersei, yes. But she is unambitious, sort of stupid, and is basically a doormat to date. Margaery is our only look at female who has been even moderately successful at navigating a traditional female path to power.
     
  15. Rogue_Ten

    Rogue_Ten Chosen One star 7

    Registered:
    Aug 18, 2002
    the only traditional path magaery is navigating is the traditional path to getting knocked up
     
  16. SWpants

    SWpants Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Oct 28, 2004
    Huh. That would make sense. I always felt like she was sleeping around too, especially after she admitted she knew what Cersei was up to. As in, she knew to watch her back with all she did.

    With Martin being on set as often as he was, he could have said something about it. Maybe he didn't mind or maybe (just maybe) he didn't have a set idea of her to begin with.
     
  17. Jabba-wocky

    Jabba-wocky Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    May 4, 2003
    Rogue: . . .in that she got married?
     
  18. Mar17swgirl

    Mar17swgirl Chosen One star 7

    Registered:
    Dec 26, 2000
    Understatement of the year...
     
  19. Coruscant

    Coruscant Chosen One star 7

    Registered:
    Feb 15, 2004
    So I just checked out GRRM's livejournal for the first time in a while. He made a post containing a YouTube video of him winning an award or something. Guys... this does not look good. That is one massive, massive man. :(
     
  20. RC-1991

    RC-1991 Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 2, 2009
    Careful guys. It's like Gabe Newell and Fat jokes. Every time someone speculates that Martin will die before he finishes ADOS, TWOW gets delayed another month.

    I've come to enjoy Sansa's chapters, myself. They get pretty damn interesting once she gets to the Vale.
     
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  21. Miana Kenobi

    Miana Kenobi Admin Emeritus star 8 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Apr 5, 2000
    In my mind, the Game of Thrones is always evolving. Cersei knew how to play the Game of Thrones for a long time, but Margaery knows them too, though she knows the current game, which Cersei fell behind.
     
  22. BaronNoir

    BaronNoir Jedi Master star 1

    Registered:
    Sep 6, 2001
    I have my pet hypothesis about Jon Snow. I want to discuss it

    -Considering the fact that Ned sister eloped with Rhaegar...
    -Considering the importance of Rhaegar
    -Considering that Ned obviously consider Jon family, while he is known for being extremely faithful

    I wonder if it would be possible that Jon is the kid of Ned sister and Rhaegar-this would explain Ned passionate call about how the Tangaryan should be allowed to live, while he send Jon to the Wall...the only place an Tangaryan can live without being hunted.
     
  23. Darth Guy

    Darth Guy Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Aug 16, 2002
    lol, your pet hypothesis? :p
     
  24. BaronNoir

    BaronNoir Jedi Master star 1

    Registered:
    Sep 6, 2001
    Ths is an expresion in French denoting a fringe theory. (I know it's stupid, it's just my personnal interpretation)
     
  25. Darth Guy

    Darth Guy Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Aug 16, 2002
    That's not what I was saying. It's a very widely held theory by fans-- and backed up by a lot of text.
     
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