Amph A Song of Ice and Fire Discussion Thread

It wasn't her political naivte that marked her as an idiot in my mind, it was her willful disregard was what everything was telling her about Jeoffry. What Sansa did in the first book was what most thirteen year old girls swept up in their own emotions might do.

But stupid is stupid.

Escusable? considering her age, and the fact she was shelterd? maybe. But lets call a spade a spade, Sansa was stupid. The real question is, "Is she still Stupid". She knows how to keep her mouth shut now, she is learning from Littlefinger. But the jury is out on her still being stupid when we get some chapters from her in the next book.

 

What did they tell her about Joffrey? Do you mean how her loving father arranged this marriage for her and let it go on for months despite him knowing that it might not be perfect? Or how Ned tells nor explains anything to her when he finally ends and crushes her dreams of becoming queen?

Quite frankly, in my opinion both Ned and Robb show much more stupidity in their interactions then Sansa ever did. Especially, in how their actions seemed like a concentrated effort of how to get captured/lose a war.

 

I just read some very interesting speculation on Westeros.org that Young Griff is not indeed really AT. In the words of Euron=Daario theory supporters,

"It fits."

 

Yeah, I am betting that Young Griff is really a Blackfyre thus a hundred times cooler then just a regular old Targ.

 

He can be both a Blackfyre and not a Targ, which is neat. He can look like a Targ, claim to be a Targ, but really be a Blackfyre.

Daemon Blackfyre would be proud.

 

Everything? as in her experinces on the kings road? what did it tell her about Jeroffery?

He was violent, cruel, deceptive, and seriously lacked empathy. Thats waht everything told her about Jeoffery, and she disregarded that reality for her fantasy.

 

she was 11.

 

I remember her father indirectly telling her that was okay and not a big deal, seeing how despite the fact he knew the reality of the situation(both Arya and Sansa told him the truth) he decided he has no problem keeping the betrothal going.

Something that for a naive 11 year old might seem like dismissal of how Joffrey's behavior was not that horrible, otherwise if he was such a terrible sociopath why would her loving father continue to give her over to him.

Simply, yes it would been nice for her to see the reality but Ned seriously messed up in how he dealt with her situation as he kept protected and naive.

edit: Ignoring the issue on the trident, no one ever told her anything about Joffrey's true nature. The most she got was Arya complaining about him and telling how Jon thought he looked like a girl. I think you are thinking of Ned who was told frankly by Robert that Joff was a terrible kid through that didn't stop Ned from continuing the betrothal.

 

Show of hands, who thinks Jaime will lose his at the end of next week's episode?

 

Pretty neat https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/lv?key=0Aj_uNZmcJaTddG9BVU5tRnJJTE5KcE5JRkFha1ZfNUE&toomany=true]timeline[/url] of ASOIAF. Just started looking at it... I didn't know the first two Dany chapters took place before the events of the prologue.

 

They certainly seem to be cutting to the chase this season. The Wolf Pup has already met the Hound, rather than just bumbling about the Riverlands for a couple of episodes like a deadlier Frodo Baggins.

 

Yeah, I think that the hand comes off next episode. And I believe the cave duel may be happening in episode 4.

What, Tyrion become a maester and vow celibacy? The whores would go begging from Dorne to the Casterly Rock.

His nobility and his recklessness.

 

I think we saw with Pycelle that the celibacy vow for maesters can be...flexible.

 

I dunno about that timeline. Much of its reasoning, especially for the stuff that's far out of place book chapter-wise, seems pretty dubious or open to interpretation.

 

So, I was wondering exactly how Jaime losing his hand will play out. Without Vargo Hoat and all those characters, I'm a little bit afraid the writers are going to make Roose Bolton the man who delivers the order. But I keep telling myself, obviously, the writers wouldn't do something so stupid. Right?

 

It won't be Roose. It will be an original show Bolton bannerman who probably has some Vargo Hoat characteristics (though not the lisp). He'll probably get killed when Jamie rescues Brienne or something.

 

Maybe Locke(what a dumb name) will still do it in attempt to ruin Roose's planned betrayal of Robb so somewhat similar to what happened in the books.

 

Or maybe Roose will have him hanged when he hears about the hand.

I guess primarily I just have a bit of a trepidation about TV-show Roose Bolton. When I watch the show with "virgins," so to speak, he's still a character that they go, "Wait... who he's supposed to be?" For a character with such a pivotal role at the end of the season (or at least should have one, anyway), he's just not that memorable yet. Hopefully, in the next couple of episodes he gets that scene where he sits down to eat with Jaime.

 

They should have never replaced him with Tywin at Harrenhall. That's how the book introduced Bolton to readers, and the show hasn't really gotten another opportunity.

 

To be fair they don't want to give away his betrayal to easy, through IMHO they have basically put up flashing lights over Robb's head saying I am going to die and be betrayed by my men.

Sigh, I just wish we got to see more of Robb's friendly allies such as Greatjon, Smalljon, Mormont, Blackfish, Mallister, etc instead of just Bolton and Karstark so it doesn't seem like all of his men hate him.

 

I do love the look on Roose's face whenever Talisa wanders into Robb's tent.

 

i think tywin was actually more important to get to know at that point, and i'm hard pressed to think of what other storyline they could have forced him into. roose will have lots more to do later, but i agree that he needs to have a couple memorable scenes before the red wedding.

 

All that I didn't like about that change was that it made Arya look extremely stupid in how she didn't use a "death" on him, as referenced in the last episode.