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Abbas and the Palestinian Elections

Discussion in 'Archive: The Senate Floor' started by Virgilius, Nov 26, 2004.

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  1. Virgilius

    Virgilius Jedi Youngling star 2

    Registered:
    Oct 7, 2004
    Now that Yasser Arafat is dead, the Palestinians are going to have an election to chose a new president. Mahmoud Abbas, the former prime minister whose power was deminished by Arafat in 2003, is the front runner. Many in the West support his candidacy because they believe he will be an effective negotiator in the peace process. However, other candidates could spoil the election. Among them is Marwan Barghouti, who is an Israeli jail for terrorism. Another factor is Palestinian terrorists. Arafat and his Fatah movement were always in the middle when it came to the "bad guys." Hamas, Islamic Jihad, etc. are the terrorists responsible for suicide bombings. Ariel Sharon and his Israeli government only made things worse by killing lots of civilians when terrorists were bombed. The terrorists will certainly try to influence the elections.

    Do you think Abbas can win the election? Can he be successful in the peace process? What do you think the terorrists will do?
     
  2. Darth Mischievous

    Darth Mischievous Jedi Grand Master star 6

    Registered:
    Oct 12, 1999
    Honestly, I don't think much is going to change.

    The terrorist factions will kill any Palestinian leader who tries to make peace with Israel.
     
  3. DarthArsenal6

    DarthArsenal6 Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Oct 16, 2001
    Honestly, I don't think much is going to change.

    ......as long as Ariel Sharon stays in power !

    Abbas did voiced his concern over him.
     
  4. Darth Mischievous

    Darth Mischievous Jedi Grand Master star 6

    Registered:
    Oct 12, 1999
    Blaming everything on Israel again, DA6?

    There are far more problems within Palestinian society than Ariel Sharon, but it is typical for Palestinians (and sometimes, the Arab world in general) to blame everyone else for their problems.

    Admittedly, Ariel Sharon isn't a nice guy to the Palestinians.

    But, let us think honestly what would be the case were the situation reversed and the Israelis were the 'West Bank' and 'Gaza' so to speak.

    That Palestinan leader would wipe Israel off the map and not give it any consideration, unlike what Israel gives the Palestinians.

    Israel has been quite patient and tolerant, compared to what they would get were the situation reversed.

    The Arab world already tried to crush Israel twice.

    Certain powerful Palestinian factions have no less lofty goal, which is why I think the 2-State solution will never work. I think Israel would accept it, and the Palestinans would use it as a stepping stone to try to crush the Israeli state.

    History has proven me correct, and I don't see why that mindset will change.
     
  5. DarthArsenal6

    DarthArsenal6 Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Oct 16, 2001
    DM as being part of this forum for some time you really do amaze me
    Forget ? where did I mention that Israel is the root problem to every middleastern situation
    WHERE DID I EVER MENTION ISRAEL ANYWAY ?!
    Pls re-read what I said before posting.
    My post was referring to Palestinian prime minister Mahmood Abbas .He may not go ahead with it cus he?s making a deal with the devil (Sharon) .
    Ariel Sharon is NOT Israel

    There are far more problems within Palestinian society than Ariel Sharon
    True that?s why I don?t trust Mahmood Abbas like I never trusted Arafat.

    Admittedly, Ariel Sharon isn't a nice guy to the Palestinians.
    That?s quite rosy for someone who committed genocide against the Lebanese people and making Palestinians homeless.
    Why not post something of Ariel Sharon on the same level as you did against Yasser Arafat, in the ?Yasser Arafat is dead what next? thread, here.

    I don?t know how you see the difference between them even when both of them have killed innocent civilians.

    Israel has been quite patient and tolerant, compared to what they would get were the situation reversed.
    yeah that?s why they had to get the army to bulldoze Palestinian homes to make more settlement in the past .


    Certain powerful Palestinian factions have no less lofty goal, which is why I think the 2-State solution will never work. I think Israel would accept it, and the Palestinians would use it as a stepping stone to try to crush the Israeli state.
    And that?s the view of every single Palestinian ?
    you sure do have a low opinion of every Arab and Muslim alike in general its quite evident in many of your post. -a big hint here

     
  6. Mr44

    Mr44 VIP star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    May 21, 2002
    Marwan Barghouti has offically dropped out.

    Since Barghouti represents the younger generation of Fatah, I don't know if this is really a good thing.

    An unregulated Fatah is a dangerous beast indeed, to all parties involved.
     
  7. Virgilius

    Virgilius Jedi Youngling star 2

    Registered:
    Oct 7, 2004
    Yes, I just heard that Barghouti dropped out. Thank goodness. It's bad to see terrorists run for political office.

    I agree with DarthA on most of what he said. I think Abbas certainly is more sane and wiser than Arafat. I recall that he called one Israeli military strike a "terrorist attack." It was a good description. Even though it is right to kill Hamas, Islamic Jihad, and Al Aqsa Martyrs Brigade leaders, it is wrong to kill innocent civilians. I find it interesting that most Jews in Irsael are more moderate or liberal than the conservatives they elect a la Sharon and his ilk. I think Shimon Peres and his party are better leaders. As for the Palestinian leaders, they had to put up with Arafat's corrupt hold on power. Now that he is dead Abbas and people like him can actually work with the Irsaelis. Praise be to Allah.
     
  8. Virgilius

    Virgilius Jedi Youngling star 2

    Registered:
    Oct 7, 2004
    Here is some interesting info about Abbas from BBC:

    Mahmoud Abbas, also known as Abu Mazen, was named as chairman of the Palestine Liberation Organisation (PLO) after Yasser Arafat died on 11 November.

    The main Palestinian political faction, Fatah, is now set to pick the 69-year-old as its candidate to succeed Arafat in January's presidential poll.

    He was the Palestinian Authority's prime minister from May 2003 until his resignation almost four months later.

    His leadership was meant to open a new, post-Yasser Arafat, chapter in Israeli-Palestinian relations in which the peace plan known as the roadmap was meant to lead both sides towards resolution.

    But, on one side the bitter struggle between the Israel and Hamas has left him on the sidelines. On the other, the power struggle with Arafat - who had refused to hand over crucial powers to Mr Abbas - limited his ability to act and took up much of his time.

    Born in Safed in British Mandate Palestine in 1935, he is one of the few surviving founder members of Fatah - the main political grouping within the PLO.

    In exile in Qatar during the late 1950s, he helped recruit a group of Palestinians to the cause. They went on to become key figures in the PLO.

    He co-founded Fatah with Arafat and accompanied him into exile in Jordan, Lebanon and Tunisia. In the early days of the movement, he became respected for his clean and simple living.

    Controversial doctorate

    A highly intellectual man, Mahmoud Abbas studied law in Egypt before doing a doctorate in Moscow. He is the author of several books.

    But some Jewish groups have criticised both his doctorate and the resulting book, The Other Side: the Secret Relationship Between Nazism and Zionism, as works of Holocaust denial.

    They claim he downplayed the number of victims and accused Jews of collaborating with the Nazis.

    He denied that charge in an interview with the Israeli daily Haaretz in May 2003.

    The Holocaust was a terrible, unforgivable crime against the Jewish nation, a crime against humanity that cannot be accepted by humankind

    Mahmoud Abbas, rejecting the charge of Holocaust denial
    "I quoted an argument between historians in which various numbers of casualties were mentioned. One wrote there were 12 million victims and another wrote there were 800,000," he told the newspaper.

    "I have no desire to argue with the figures. The Holocaust was a terrible, unforgivable crime against the Jewish nation, a crime against humanity that cannot be accepted by humankind," he said.

    Oslo architect

    Mahmoud Abbas always kept to the background, but also built up a network of powerful contacts that included Arab leaders and heads of intelligence services.

    This enabled him to become a successful fundraiser for the PLO and to take on an important security role in the early 1970s, before being appointed head of the PLO's department for national and international relations in 1980.

    Mahmoud Abbas, regarded as a pragmatist, was one of the main initiators of the dialogue with Jewish left-wing and pacifist movements in the 1970s and in the difficult years before negotiations were eventually started between Israel and the Palestinians.

    Widely regarded as the architect of the Oslo peace process, he accompanied Arafat to the White House in 1993 to sign the Oslo Accords.

    Referring to the current intifada, Mr Abbas has called for a halt to armed attacks on Israeli targets to avoid giving Israel a pretext to destroy the last vestiges of Palestinian autonomy.

    Palestinian return

    In the light of his origins in Safed in Galilee - in what is now northern Israel - he is said to hold strong views about the right of return of Palestinian refugees. In the newly-formed Palestinian Authority, Mr Abbas took over the refugee file and pushed for progress on this issue.

    It is his view that: "Everyone should first be granted the right of return, but then we have to sit down and discuss the details that have to be jointly agreed upon and mutually acceptable to both sides."

    Afte
     
  9. DarthKarde

    DarthKarde Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Jun 28, 2002
    Marwan Barghouti has changed his mind and entered the race at the last minute. IMO this is a good thing. While Abbas would probably be more willing to compromise and would have far greater international standing I don't think that the Palestinians can unite behind him. He simply doesn't have the popular support to hold things together.
     
  10. Vaderbait

    Vaderbait Jedi Knight star 6

    Registered:
    Sep 26, 2001
    Whoever said the terrorist groups will kill any Palestinian leader who helps the Israelis is right.


    That's why they need to start actively hunting them down. If anyone knows where the terrorists are, it's the PLO. Make a quick secret deal with Israel and the US, and BAM, special forces are taking out Hamas leaders left and right, capturing massive groups of terrorists. Outrage among the Muslims? Of course, but then you show that the PLO wanted it done and helped, and then the extremists have to find a new angle. No more "freeing the Palestinians".
     
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