Abuse of Power by an Administrator - I Have Been Demoted

Discussion in 'Communications' started by Lord Bane, Dec 26, 2002.

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Moderators: JoinTheSchwarz, LAJ_FETT, Ramza
  1. RidingMyCarousel Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 20, 2002
    star 6
    Carter, I think that in all respect, I was very open and honest about the situation with you. We never stole anything from TFN save banner dimensions, and those were made for us by one of our friends who does graphic design. They weren't permanent and they were temporary as a placeholder until our graphics administrator had came up with a scheme. It's changed now. There's not a single resemblance of TFN's look there. This issue is over. Can't we move on?


  2. xie Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 25, 2002
    star 5
    This isn't program code, no money is being made on either side. Two banners, a sidebar, and a curve are not ideas copyrighted or patented by TheForce.net - and if anyone should have taken action, it should be Josh, when he returns, not Carter, TFN Staff "Administrator".
  3. citizen-tom Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 20, 2002
    star 5
    I agree with Xie. There are many sites on the net with a curve and sidebar, sorry to burst your bubble. By the way, Cool boards Salty, I signed up.
  4. Master Salty Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 18, 1999
    star 6
    That banner design doesn't belong to you. I should've asked Scott's permission to use it. I admit the mistake and we took care of it, but you've continued to ******** towards my friends and it pisses me off. Last time I checked you didn't create HTML code. That banner we put up doesn't belong to you. It's the intellectual property of the person that designed it.


    BTW...thanks for advertising my site. I appreciate it.
  5. Carter-TFN Ex-Staff, Admin Emeritus

    Member Since:
    May 24, 2001
    star 4
    I don't want to argue the merits of banner or design look copycats. While it had implications leading upto my actions on Bane, it's not what's at issue here.

    edit: Salty, no problem. :) The way I get ostracized by the mods here for doing the right thing, perhaps I'll join your site. ;)
  6. Master Salty Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 18, 1999
    star 6
    Thank God, you finally understand the real issue here. YOUR abuse of power. Leave my site out it.
  7. Carter-TFN Ex-Staff, Admin Emeritus

    Member Since:
    May 24, 2001
    star 4
    So how did I abuse my power if Sapient and co. proceeded to reban Bane?
  8. Jedi_Satimber Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 3, 2002
    star 8
    I have been told about this big bruhaha, and have decided to venture into this forum and thread to see for myself. I must say that I am shocked and disturbed.

    From what I have been able to remember (it took me over 5 hours to read every post here, with many distractions)...here are some highlights and some of my thoughts. Unfortunately, it took so long for me to finish, that it is now time for me to go home from work...sadly, I will not be able to get the responses until tomorrow.

    *My comments should also be viewed as not towards one person in particular...but to anybody in the position at question, whether it is real life or fake life*

    AT the very worst that's a mild flame ...

    It's a flame and bannable at that. Bane has always liked quick disciplining of fellow mods but I suppose he didn't like it when it happened to him.

    I am a realist, I think. I am disgraced right now though, how is "shut your mouth"/"shut up" a Flame. This is not derogatory at all. What age are you if this hurts your feelings, and then choose to weild power, blatantly?

    Bane has always liked quick disciplining of fellow mods but I suppose he didn't like it when it happened to him.

    from what I've seen, Bane has been a supporter of due process, something you always seem to forget about.

    It appears that due process was not done, and that is why the issue was raised. And I too would not appreciate being punished unfairly.

    Carter you are far to thinned skinned to be a mod.

    As Iw as told have been told and know, mods have to deal with alot of crap.

    If you can't handle it go find something easier on your nerves and leave us alone.

    Now to avoid telling you to shut up, please refrain from posting.


    This is just my opinion, but anybody who gets offended easily should not be in positions of any power at all.

    ___________________________________
    The topics at hand are:
    1. I am calling for an inquiry into my demotion.

    As a right, and this is common courteousy.

    2. I am calling for an inquiry into Carter-TFN's continued status as an administrator at the JC.

    It appears that many have the same opinion.

    3. I am calling for a public record to be made of Moderator Punishment Protocol.

    Also, the masses of us underlings seem to be also notified of these procedures.
    _______________________________________

    - Did Carter-TFN do something warranting a demotion for himself?
    In a word, Yes. He blatantly and willfully weilded power in an uncalled for manner.

    - Were Bane's actions publicly and privately deserving of a demotion?
    IMHO, absolutely not. The term "shut up" in any form of phrase in no way is a vulgar use of the language.

    Sapient,
    I know you're trying your best. However, it is never good to sacrifice justice for expediency. The forums are best served by fairness for everyone, not by getting the matter over as quickly as possible. I know you've tried your best, and that's all we can ask for.


    I must disagree, in a sense. Quick remedy of any altercation should be the goal. The longer things brew, the stronger the resentment gets, and the less effective the punishment is.

    The bare bones of the arguement was this: a mod decided to go on vacation on Christmas Day. Carter didn't like that, and posted a long rant on the subject. Bane defended the mod. Carter posted in bold and caps, and Bane retaliated, telling him to "shut your mouth". Carter said that since he said that, he's out of here, and demoted him.

    And if this really is the case of all of this, then shame on everyone. The JC is a place for fun. It is not a job. I know from talking with a couple of Mods, and it is not many, but they can get worn down by their duties...and it is on a volunteer basis. If someone wants to go away for a while, from a volunteer job...they have every right to do so. This world is in shambles, and life is too short, to get bent out of shape over something like this.

    __________
  9. Master Salty Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 18, 1999
    star 6
    I'm not sure why Bane was rebanned. I don't agree with that. This is the second time you're arbitrarily demoted and banned a JC Mod. You don't see something wrong with that? It's power abuse, my friend. Nothing more, nothing less.


    I hold no grudges, so if you wish to join ATS, I can't stop you and will welcome you.
  10. DarthKarde Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 28, 2002
    star 5
    So how did I abuse my power if Sapient and co. proceeded to reban Bane?

    As I understand it Kadue, in consultation with PB revoked the ban imposed by DS. While I do not wish to criticise DS he was under a lot of pressure to act when he did as lots of people were screaming for action. It was hardly the best circumstance for him to make a considered judgement. IMO you abused your powers by making a unilateral decision about a fellow mod over a minor issue that did not require immediate action.
  11. Grilled-Sarlacc Former Head Admin

    Member Since:
    Jul 19, 2001
    star 6
    Ha! "Damn you for talking trash about my website. Oh, would you like to join?" [face_laugh]
  12. Carter-TFN Ex-Staff, Admin Emeritus

    Member Since:
    May 24, 2001
    star 4
    Salty, get your facts straight, I demoted SOTS to manager for fussing with administrative tools and I never banned him.
  13. Master Salty Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 18, 1999
    star 6
    My mistake, but it was still a unilateral move.


    BTW...we could've settled this a long time ago. All you had to do was PM me about it.



    Ha! "Damn you for talking trash about my website. Oh, would you like to join?"

    I don't hold grudges.

    ;)
  14. JediJeffro Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 23, 2001
    star 5
    I haven't read all of the thread, but I will say this - it hardly seems right to ban Bane without doing the same to Carter.
  15. Carter-TFN Ex-Staff, Admin Emeritus

    Member Since:
    May 24, 2001
    star 4
    Salty, I had no idea you were involved till later on. I saw the site on RMCOY's profile and started my query with him.
  16. Master Salty Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 18, 1999
    star 6
    I have a hard time believing that, Carter. I never sign off and my name is always at the bottom. Not to mention my ATS email address has been on the main site since the DNS picked up the domain.
  17. Lord Bane Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    May 26, 1999
    star 5
    I will get banned for this post. Kadue told me to stay out of here, but I cannot. RMCOY, please ban me if you are still reading this, since I won't go against Matt's wishes. But I cannot sit idly by while that snake lies through his teeth at the members. I cannot let someone who had administrator status sit by and feign innocence to such a degree. It disgusts me and I said as much in the ModSquad before his abuse against me.

    "I expect a certain level of respect and courtesy from my fellow mods, esp. since I would offer them the same consideration but this wasn't warranted..."

    No. You give respect to mods that are on your Watched Users List, to those users who kow-tow to you or who scratch your back. You have flamed over PMs many members because of graphics arguments. You once said to me "You're a total gutless big mouth wimp" and you claim you give respect to other mods? I was defending friends there, too. SotS and farraday, but they're on your hit list too, aren't they? Your lack of respect started this, started this long ago.

    "The way I get ostracized by the mods here for doing the right thing, perhaps I'll join your site."

    If you joing ATS.net, I will watch every post you make like a hawk. I don't care if Salty demotes me for saying that, but you are a troublemaker and have no respect for people that disagree with you. I cannot stop you from joining, but I am not nearly as forgiving or welcoming of such irksome folks as Master Salty is. His patience far exceeds my own.

    You do not do the "right thing." You do what is right for you and there is a difference. Demoting SotS, kicking me out of the ModSquad for disagreeing with you, the whole banner flap and all the flaming you did over PM and in public to regular users - you are a pockmark on the ass of the Jedi Council and TheForce.net.

    I think people should know that bad blood has existed between Carter and myself since September, when there was another private incident that led to me returning to active duty, with a main purpose to see someone more capable in charge of the JC. I had no faith in him as an administrator, and over the months, that opinion was repeatedly proven correct. We have clashed numerous times in the ModSquad, in public, and over PMs, where I have been flamed by him in very frank terms. I have not sought out his demotion over the things he has said to me because that is childish and petty, but I felt he went too far today. He attacked RidingMyCaroselOnYou in the ModSquad. I came to my good friend's aid, and yes I was upset and it showed. I saw RMCOY, a friend, being disrespected by an administrator who is not worthy nor has he shown himself to be worthy of any sort of special colors or privalege. I was not alone in thinking this way, but got only two posts in before the unilateral demotion and stripping of my access. I gave Carter one chance to solve this with me in private, extended just that much courtesy that I had been denied, and was banned for it. I managed to get this thread posted before that, exactly the same minute Carter stripped me of VIP ability and banned me. I waited to post the thread until I had gotten a response from him. I gave him the courtesy he denied me.

    But, it has proved something. It all has shed light, all this trouble and commotion and my surely long term banning for violating a direct order from an administrator and flaming, unabashedly, in public, not to mention the drama.

    The system works.

    It may have required me to act as a sacrificial lamb (or test subject as it were) but certainly, the end rewsult was a success. The ModSquad can mete out punishment to one of its own in an expedient manner, be it manager or administrator. Whether or not I agree entirely with the exact reasons for my personal punishment is in fact moot. What matters to us is that precedent has been set in the public domain and from this we can glean insight for future moderator infractions.


    I have come to the complete end of my te
  18. Carter-TFN Ex-Staff, Admin Emeritus

    Member Since:
    May 24, 2001
    star 4
    Salty, I have much more interaction with RMCOY in dealing admin stuff and seeing it in his profile jumped out at me.

    Just about everyone has links in their sig and rarely if ever do I check what's in their sig.

    I have no reason to lie to you but believe what you will.

    edit: sigh, so who's doing all the bold lettering now. [face_plain]

    Bane, Josh and the JC admins have had many issues with you. You've been reprimanded numerous times for your actions. The JCC coup, just about every JC admin spoke out against your conspiratorial methodology.

    You're not a team player, you have your own agenda and I've seen you time and again willingly dictate things on your whims.
  19. JediJeffro Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 23, 2001
    star 5
    "You're not a team player, you have your own agenda and I've seen you time and again willingly dictate things on your whims."

    Pot. Kettle. Black.
  20. Carter-TFN Ex-Staff, Admin Emeritus

    Member Since:
    May 24, 2001
    star 4
    I don't think there's anything more to add to this thread. It is now locked.

    //click//

    Doh, I don't have mod powers anymore. [face_laugh]
  21. Jedi_Learner Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 10, 2002
    star 5
    "Bane, Josh and the JC admins have had many issues with you. You've been reprimanded numerous times for your actions. The JCC coup, just about every JC admin spoke out against your conspiratorial methodology."

    Post some evidence of this please.
  22. Sithman Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 6, 1999
    star 7
    Geez.


    Has anyone stepped back and actually looked at what's going on.
    You're arguing about "power abuse" on an internet message board.



    If any of the things that happen to a person here on the JC inhibit their ability to discuss Star Wars, then I can see a reason to make a fuss about it. Banning someone is the only thing that can truly inhibit someone from discussing Star Wars, so a simple demotion doesn't seem a problem.

    If Bane is simply demoted, then who cares? Go discuss Star Wars like you did before you got involved in your beloved internet drama. And believe it or not, the JC could become a much more fun place to hang out. [face_shocked]

    So, all in all, why make such a big deal about all this?
  23. AmberStarbright Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 20, 2002
    star 7
    I totally agree I have read most of this thread through and it's such a shame all the fighting on here for what?

    At the end of the day this is only a message board.

    I think some people on here need to take a step back and have a look at they're behaviour [face_plain]
  24. DarthKarde Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 28, 2002
    star 5
    So, all in all, why make such a big deal about all this?

    Well a lot of people care about this site and want to make it as good as possible. If you only want to talk about SW then why are you posting in the Comms forum.

    Doh, I don't have mod powers anymore.

    Given your attitude in this thread I for one would think it a good thing if that situation was to become permanant.
  25. Kadue Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 20, 2000
    star 5
    I am sorry for this, but I gave the chance for things to settle slightly, and hope that if this thread progressed, it would do so without falling into the same trap as other Comms threads of its ilk. It hasn't, and the last 100 posts are just going around in circles.

    This issue is officially on ice until Josh and/or Vert come back to participate in sorting this out. Any issues with that you are free to take up with me, but that is how things will stand. This thread will be locked, and so will any other thread that appears. This is my decision, not that of the other mods, so any blame for that is mine.

    Nothing here will be forgotten or swept under the carpet, but until there are the beginnings of resolutions made, this thread will do more harm than good if it continues like this.
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