Abuse of Power by an Administrator - I Have Been Demoted

Sorry, Genghis. But the longer we wait to make a decision, the more we have taken steps back to one of the criticisms we most often have received. We took as much as we could under consideration and will not let it drag on. We cannot. Josh would be the final say if he were here and we were afforded the luxury of time. After that, it's Vertical. Neither are here. PadmeBra was logged on but has since logged off. Carter is an administrator but is part of the group we're discussing. The only administrator besides me was Rox. I sent my recommendation to him and the following is my decision.

Okay, please understand I did the best I could and this is what I have to do as an administrator. Based on everything, here is what I've decided:

Lord Bane: 48 hour ban for flaming publicly in Mod Squad and via PM and inciting drama in Comms. In order to ban him he has to be demoted, but this ban is not a demotion. No private forum access during the ban.

Carter-TFN: 48 hour ban and 1 week demotion. No private forum access during the ban.

I am removing private forum access so that both Carter and Bane can cool down and come back calm and relaxed. I feel they both need time to reflect on other, more positive things and come back with a clear-head.

 

watch out with those "accusations" xie! We are all suppose to play nice and merely stick up for our friends

 

Thanks for your openness and honesty, DS.

 

48 hour ban for flaming publicly in Mod Squad

Pardon me, but isn't that contradictory? Public flaming in private?

 

I think he means in an area where it is visible to many members, in this case the Mod Squad. I would have to say that it sounds like a fair punishment on both sides, and I'm glad such quick action was taken. I look forward to seeing the long-term effects of this decision.

 

Sapient,
I know you're trying your best. However, it is never good to sacrifice justice for expediency. The forums are best served by fairness for everyone, not by getting the matter over as quickly as possible. I know you've tried your best, and that's all we can ask for.

farraday,
the guidelines I cited were specifically suited for this situation. It is not a special case, without precedent.

 

Hopefully, there will be long-term effects from this decision.

 

Pardon me, but isn't that contradictory? Public flaming in private?

No, I gotta go with if flaming in PM is a "no-no" there's no contradiction over "public" flaming in a private board. Same general principle applies.

 

Actually, this was mod vs mod, instead of user vs mod, which is what the guidelines were designed for. Bane isn't a newbie, he knows what to do. They are just guidelines after all, not strict law.

 

Agree with DS. Good job, you have prouved that the adminitration can take quick action.

 

All I can say from reading this is that it takes me back to the arguments we used to have in law school before we went out in the real world to make money and forget all the policy debates that used to keep us up all night. I think a few mods here should apply for law school.

Anyway, I think DS did a good job here. Happy New Year.

 

Thank you, Sape. If Josh wants to add anything more, it's up to him to make that determination. In the meantime, we can all hopefully resume life on the roadways.

 

Well, I got here too late to make any good comments here. So I'll sum up my thoughts...

Sapient. I think those punishments are good. Fair. I applaud you and the rest of the administration on the well balanced outcome.

Genghis, this thread needs to be left open until there is nothing more to be discussed. All members must be allowed to have fair discussion.

As for the two members of the administration in question....well:

Lord Bane.....I respect him. To me, he has always been friendly, always been respectful, and has always listened. He has a passion for improving this place. Many mods just care about maintaining their status. Lord Bane really wants to make this place better.

Carter. I dont know him as well as Bane, however, I am aware that Carter is willing to discuss different issues with members. Sometimes he might not see things your way, but he does at least try to listen. At least, that has been my experience.

I am aware that Carter and Bane dont get along well. I am aware that they have heated discussions. I am also aware that they arent the only ones that have heated discussions. Yet this sort of punishment isnt doled out to all mods that might say one bad thing too many. It would be affected by the fact that one of the arguing parties could do it. Carter had no impartiality in the matter, and as such, really shouldnt have done that...probably should have referred the matter to another, impartial, administrator.

But both mods were probably baiting. Both pushing the envelope. Where can you draw the line? As such, both deserve to be punished.

 

Good Decision.

Thankyou.

 

I agree with Dagsy on this issue.






What do you know, the universe didn't implode...

 

Having gone through a recent demotion and banning crisis myself, I would also like to know more about this case. I now look forward to re-reading this thread in full.

 

No offense Gath, I like you and all, and I thought you were a good mod, but your case was a little more clear cut. Also, I believe that the appropriate steps were taken in your case, though I may be wrong.

 

Normally I don't jump into these issues, but after reading all of that I felt the need to at least chime in a little.

First off, good call on your part, Sapient. I know it couldn't have been easy, but I do believe that this was an issue that needed to be resolved at least in part in a timely manner until Josh or Vertical can return.

This whole issue has made me consider that there seems to be a bit of a hole in the power structure for dealing with issues such as this when both Josh and Vertical are away. If it hasn't already been considered, you all may want to start thinking of which person or persons are to officially act in place of Vertical for just such cases as this. And don't say that this is isolated. Something tells me that there is more of this sort of thing brewing than anyone would care to admit publicly. Mod (and I use the term generically) interaction in this thread alone seem to prove this for me.

In terms of Bane and Carter, I haven't personally interacted very much with either. I will say that for the most part I've seen Lord Bane act in a fair and levelheaded manner in the past. And while Carter may attempt to be helpful, there have been times that some of what he has done in the past have raised a flag or two in my mind. But as I've said, this is from observation and not from really knowing anyone or the exact situation.

Hopefully Josh and or Vertical will be back soon and there will be a more clear resolution to this matter.


*returns to lurking*

 

Edit: Let me just say that I made this post before having the chance to fully read this thread, and know the specific goings on up to this point.

As to the question of what is supposed to happen if both Josh and Vert are absent, there is an established procedure where the 3 JC administrators (PB, Sape and myself) come to a decision, but there are caveats that hopefully cover the major situations. Everything related to this is going to be looked at.

 

The situation as it stands at the moment is this, both Lord Bane and Carter are unbanned, without any return to previous status levels. They will remain there until such time as Josh and/or Vert have a chance to get online in the next two days.

This decision was arrived at from consultation between myself and Padme Bra as outlined above. The exclusion of DarthSapient from this was done due to his involvement in this prior to that point.

This thread itself is being unlocked in the interests of free speech and open communication, but it also comes with a stern warning. Any post that is made from this point on in this thread is to be civil, productive, constructive, and to the point.

Any post that is solely for the purpose of making an attack at any single person, or group, no matter who or why, will be dealt with swiftly and harshly. This is your only warning, and failure to do this will result in a ban.

I am deadly serious on this issue, and leniency will not be shown. This is not a thread that is here for your entertainment or enjoyment, or for the airing of personal gripes for perceived wrong-doings. If you are unsure whether to post something here, err on the side of caution, and feel free to talk to me privately, or if you do not wish that, to the AC members who will bring it to the administration in general.

Again, this is the only warning on this that will be issued.

 

A question,

Q: Are the standards higher for a mod than a 'regular' user? If so then should their punishment be worse?

 

Are the standards higher for a mod than a 'regular' user? If so then should their punishment be worse?

The mods recently held a vote and the vast majority said that they felt they should be held to higher standards than regular users. This makes sense, because they can't expect the regular members to respect the rules if they don't. It is a privilage to be a moderator, not a right. They have to be deserving of it. That being said, their punishment is worse, and rightfully so. The same goes for VIPs such as City Representatives in Fanforce. However, the question here I believe is more "Is Carter acting inappropriately?" than "Did Bane deserve to be punished?"

EDIT: Spelling

 

Little question..

We all know that Carter and Bane were arguing.

Can we know what they were arguing about?

UKS

 

This incident clearly highlights the need for due process to be followed in all but the most extreme cases, where immediate action needs to be taken. Without knowing the full details it is impossible to give a complete judgement but there is clearly a personal dispute between the two individuals in question. IMO impartiality is a very important aspect of moderating and in this case it seems that Carter TFN was too close to the situation to make an objective judgement on whether Lord Bane was deserving of a ban and/or demotion. In such cases it would surely be best practice for an Admin to consult with other members of the administration before making a judgement. Unilateral action is not good and should be avoided unless absolutely necesary. I doubt that anyone here would consider a mild flame or a private board to be an exceptional incident that required immediate action. I would also add that most admins, managers and moderators commit an enourmous amount of their free time to the JC and as such deserve a fair hearing before any punishment is passed against them.

 

Can we know what they were arguing about?

I think that is irrelevant.

in this case it seems that Carter TFN was too close to the situation to make an objective judgement

I think that just about sums the whole thing up.