Lg.Is, NY Add your two cents: How does the force balance.

Hello.
Here is a discussion topic. I think we all know the answer but since I don?t make the meetings I would like to hear others thoughts and version because there are a couple of options I think.

The Prophesy says "the chosen one will bring balance to the force."

Question: ?If Anakin is the chosen one how is it that he will balance things?

 

Well, I think the Lucas has already said that Anakin fulfills his destiny by EVENTUALLY destroying the Emporer at the end of Jedi. So what they said was true...from a certain point of view.

 

Interesting. but at that point the force is mor out of balance then ever sonce there is now no sith...

 

And why would the council want to see balance with the force when the good guys have the advantage??
I have a feeling this is not a question that will be ansered in Ep 3. --Billy

 

Well, I think that the balance Lucas was referring to is in fact achieved with the new jedi order. Luke realizes what Yoda had realized too late; the Jedi needed to change with the times. So perhaps the new order utilizes a grey area in the force wherein attachments are allowed thereby creating avenues for dark side encroachment. Basically you can still have balance without absolute good and absolute evil. You can have a mix and have the force still in balance.

I'll be more than happy to debate this with any interested party.

 

Wow Now I thought this was a no brainier. I guess my thought is mine. Here goes.

For there to be day there must be night. If there are 10,000 Jedi and only a dozen sith then we are out of balance. Anakin balances things by bring it down to Two and Two. Emperor and Vader vs. Yoda and Obby Dooby. Then Obby Dooby Dies and Luke moves up. Still Two to Two.
But Alas nothing lasts for ever and we swing out of balance again. Or do we.... Trump (opps) The Emperor always had another apprentice in training. So at his death maybe we have Luke and the apprentice. Can you say Episode SEVEN....

 

I don't think it's a 1 good guy - 1 bad guy thing. I think it's more like making the good guys less good and the bad guys less bad. You don;t have to have pure good versus pure evil to have a balance. The balance can be achieved as long as the net force usage is close to neutral.

The Jedi model changes with Luke's regime. It is more likely to succeed as it can improvise, adapt and overcome.

Much like Palpatine achieved his evil goals by manipulating the old jedi order (using good to accomplish bad)so can Luke achieve his good goals by manipulating the dark side. (using bad to accomplish good)

Surely Anakin's sacrafice ended the Sith rule but it served only as a catalyst to bring balance to the force. The balance was fully restored when a broader spectrum of ideals and force abilities was incorporated into the new jedi order.

Is this making sense to anyone?

 

Troll

 

Great points. Im just gonna sit back and listen. --Billy

 

Hay Inn-vader.
I kind of agree that it may not be a 1 to 1 thing. The Emperor was bad enough to be 5 jedi. But the jedi order was arround for over 1000 years yoda said and we do not know the set up before that. If there were say 1000 jedi at episode 1 then the force usage would have been way out of balance by yours and my statement. However if it is not a 1 to 1 thing then Anakin would have knocked the force out of balance on the other side when he killed every one off an did acheve the 1 to 1 balance in Empire.

 

How can I better explain my point?

How about this:
It isn't about JEDI and SITH. The force is THE FORCE. There is no 1 to 1 thing. I suppose the measurement would be of force usage, not the number of Jedi and the number of Sith. Now my EU needs some work however when it comes to the movies I'm as good as anyone. There are many force users across the Star Wars universe. The vast majority remain undiscovered and/or untrained. Beings having access to force powers may belong to an entire different religion/philosophy entirely. Who knows how they use the force? So many things to consider. Also, one must consider how powerful the force user is. I'm sure someone like Yoda has a much greater effect on the universe than a padawan, say, for each identical force task.

Here's my simple yet effective mathematical explanation:

Force Effect = (# midichlorians) * (force ability)* (duration of force tap) * (light side or dark side multiplier which is either 1 or -1 respectively)

So for any given time the NET FORCE EFFECT is simply the sum of individual force effect among force users. The further from ZERO the sum gets, the less balance.

Now, I love letting my mind go crazy trying to make sense out of George's vague explanations but I think we're going to have to accept the whole balance issue as a plot point and nothing more.

Then again, who knows what you guys might add?

It's a matter of hours now guys! See ya soon!




EDITED AS FOLLOW UP:
Also, keep in mind that the Sith decided to bring this imbalance upon themselves when they couldn't stop killing each other! Jedi don't intentionally kill other Jedi. Sith do kill Sith. For balance to be achieved you can either (1) bring down the net use of the light side of the force, (2) bring up the net use of the dark side of the force. We know the Sith cannot peacefully coexist with each other so #2 is out.

Or is it?

I believe, if the Jedi order was capable of change, which it was, it could have found ways to tap the dark side to serve a good purpose.

For instance, Mace Windu taps the dark side in his Vapaad style of fighting yet he is not a Sith, he is a Jedi. Would he be less of a Jedi had he struck down Palpatine in the Chancellor's office? Point of view again.

From my unique perspective I see Anakin as bringing balance to the force and then handing Luke the reigns as he brings forth a new Jedi order capable of maintaining this balance, even in great numbers, as both light and dark side abilities are used for the good of the New Republic.

 

New here , and to the whole SW phenoneom (sp?)
I saw all the movies, it's just now I'm getting into them totally.
Can Leia still eventually turn? Then that can balance things out dending on how you look at things? She has all the rage inside her also she was able to not be found out by DV so the force inside her may be stronger.
This can set the stage for a VII weather or not Lucas makes it or gives it to someone else, or it's already been done and just in a holding cell somewhere.
Anyway, in my pea brain I see more coming. the $ is just too great. Look at James Bond. Never say never.
Then again there would have to be 2 sith right? We still also don't see any other Jedi mentioned, some could of still be unfound at the time, or DV could of impregnated someone else as well.

 

When that prophecy first came up in Ep 1, there was lots of debate about what was out of balance. I personally always felt that Anakin brings balance by fathering LUke. Luke is the balance, by being a new kind of Jedi.

But now that all the movies are out... it seems what is out of balance is the return of the Sith. Mainly, the fact that Palpatine has become so powerful. Anakin is supposed to fulfill the prophecy by destroying the Sith and thus bringing balance back to the Force. And he does that. Eventually. He kills Palpatine and dies in the process. So, no more Sith.

 

Then again, if memory serves, and forgive me for those of you who are dismissive of the EU, but who is to say that The Force should be manipulated by beings anyway? In one of the novels I read in the early 90's there was a faction/religion that believed in the force however the practicioners frowned upon force usage because, as they saw it, for every tap of the force there was an equal but opposite effect somewhere in the universe, in essense, making every force tap selfish, even the use of the light side.

Perhaps things got so far out of whack by having all of these force users running around that the force needed to reset itself bringing forth a balance.

Come on, reply, don't just read!

 

What if the Emperor is alive? What if he escaped somehow? What if he cloned himself? We don't see his body and he can "fly" ....

 

How do we know if he blasts enough lightning out at the ground he cant halt his fall. After all if the Force can help a jedi jump 50 to 70 feet in the air and they can lift a X-wing Why cant they self levitate.

 

I'm liking the idea of the Emperor still being alive Im listening. --Billy

 

What if the Emperor is alive? What if he escaped somehow? What if he cloned himself? We don't see his body and he can "fly" ....

Weird, I just brought this up on that other thread - before reading this.

Palpatine does clone himself. And now, since it keeps coming up, I have to go find out what book that was in. Sigh.

Problem with the EU is mainly the fact that Lucas doesn't really acknowledge it. He approves the books, or rather LFL does, but that doesn't stop him from contradicting anything already written if it doesn't agree with his current vision. And even in the books alone, continuity was screwed up. That's why I gave up.

 

Hey guys -

Listen, I'm a bit doin' the Romulan Ale thing so I'm not ripe for the picking right now but as I remember, the Emperor had "THE MOUNT TANTISS PROJECT" up and about in which he had clones of himself to take on his dark force presence in Tim Zahn's trilogy -

meaning he had so much power that the dark side destroyed his physical self so much that he needed clones to host a physical embodiment, even if it was at best a temporary host -

relevance to the movies???

As I see, NONE. Lucas meant for Palpatine to die. A story has a beginning, a middle and an end. Of course we would LIKE the storyline to continue but Mr. Lucas has other agendas and most certainly has other projects in mind.

Palpatine died. Bottom line.

Let's pretend he didn't just for fun.

OK, so he's alive. Now what?

 

Hello Sort of a new member I guess. My first meeting was at Icon just a few months ago. Was unable to make last meeting, hopefully can the next one. I've been reading for a while figure I'll start posting here. Since it's an issue I've been considering.

I'm not to knowledgeable of the storyline AFTER the movies but here it goes. I Think the Balance referred to by the "prophecy" might have had something to do with Luke and Leia. Twins. Personally I always thought of Luke more as a Grey area jedi leading more toward the dark side but not far enough that he'd lose to it's Tempting power. and figure if anything Leia was just the opposite.... or was it the other way around... er anyway. I figure Balance doesn't necessarily mean Light extreme side of the force versus Extreme Dark side. It could be a slight margin

Anyway. I can't type. So good luck reading that.