Lit After the NJO, before the DNT.

Discussion in 'Literature' started by Silas Nightstalker, Sep 18, 2012.

  1. Force Smuggler Chosen One

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    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    It's been awhile since I've read TUF but R2 was about to tell C-3PO that I believe. That's how the post NJO universe should have started. R2 and C-3PO talking, Luke and Leia overhearing them and we get to see the history of the prequels. Then we go to Naboo and a couple other places, find Mara's family. Stuff like that
  2. imiller Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 26, 2004
    star 3
    @Force Smuggler: exactly - knowing what happens next really would leave a bitter taste to any victories she had. Maybe a story about the Rogues where she wasn't the perspective character? I just don't know - Dark Nest just poisons so much that I love about Jaina and the EU during that time period.

    @LexiLupin: No, I agree they're partners. I just think he's really, really boring. The bits of Zekk in Fury were pretty awesome - him pulling the "I'm actually dark side, not like crazy bug Twi'lek over there" on Ship. But then, Fury is my favorite Legacy of the Force novel. The jealousy of Jag and secret murder plans were fantastic - and I love Jag too :).

    I really wish they'd let Allston just write a trilogy about Jag, the Rogues, the Wraiths, and Jaina post DNT (and maybe Ben), and let Denning write his "Jacen goes nuts and dies after making everyone unhappy" trilogy (without touching Mara), and let Traviss spin off Boba Fett into novels where the Mandos wouldn't bother anyone. Or better yet, have Allston write the DNT slot trilogy, instead of Denning. But he probably wouldn't be a fan of that - while he loves writing Luke, Ben, Leia, and Han, he generally says he likes to write at the margins of the universe - and even when he's writing about the "main" cast, he always throws in perspective characters like Seha, or Javon, or Octa, who bring in a perspective which isn't "I've saved the galaxy umpteen times and am pivotal to every conflict." So...maybe give the next step in the universe to Stackpole?
    Last edited by imiller, Sep 21, 2012
  3. Force Smuggler Chosen One

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    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    @imiller
    If we could wipe DNT/LOTF/FOTJ away I won't complain. I really wanted to see Jaina in charge of a Starfighter squadron and a jedi running missions. More Rogue stories with Jaina as a character but not the main one? Works for me. You spelled Allston wrong in the last paragraph lol. I agree whole-heartedly with your last paragraph 100%.
    Zeta1127 likes this.
  4. imiller Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 26, 2004
    star 3
    Hah! Caught it before the stupid edit time limit!

    I'm kind of odd in that while I hate Mara's death, I actually like a lot of Legacy of the Force. I don't so much hate Fate of the Jedi as find it a great way to take a nap. It's Dark Nest that I get really, really angry about.

    But if wiping it out was the way to wipe out Dark Nest...I'd probably do it.
  5. Force Smuggler Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    I liked LOTF more than I did FOTJ. I hated how Mara's death happened but I was okay that it happened. We want the new Generation to take charge right? Why not get rid of the OT generation to do that? I like DNT as well but if we could a reboot I wouldn't complain. Well without DNT, LOTF and FOTJ would most likely not have happened
  6. imiller Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 26, 2004
    star 3
    We want the new generation to take charge, but I think Mara's death is a stupid and wrong decision for a couple of reasons.

    1) You don't have to kill the old generation to have the new take over (see also: Luke, Leia, Han not being dead - and more importantly, Wedge has actually retired, while not being lazy, and let his daughters take center stage).

    2) Mara is the easy, lazy choice for the authors and editors to kill. She's not forbidden, but she's nearly as beloved as those main characters. However, she has absolutely no in-universe reason for her to be Jacen's sacrifice - the only reason I can think of why they didn't go with Tenel Ka or Allana is that Mara's death would actually get them controversy, and therefore sales.

    3) Other than Mara and Jacen, no one really important or even well developed died in Legacy of the Force. So the whole "will someone die" tension was completely bogus. At least in Apocalypse, as much as I hated the book, Barv's death was of a character who we cared about.

    4) I would also note that saying "we won't kill anyone important" is almost as stupid as saying "we will kill someone important" - it focuses fans on external factors, and not the internal tension of a story. Heaven knows I don't want more characters to die, but for the publicity team to say that everyone important is safe just signals to me that they simply don't care what happens in their books.
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  7. DarthJenari Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 17, 2011
    star 4
    Agreed. Instead we got DNT, LOTF, and FOTJ. There are a lot of good moments sprinkled throughout the 3, but none of them equal the disappointment i've suffered after TUF. I really expected so much better. Instead I got Joiners, the assassination of Jacen Solo's character, and Abeloth.

    I'm wondering if they're ever going to develop other characters Ben's age, like they originally did in YJK.
    Last edited by DarthJenari, Sep 21, 2012
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  8. Force Smuggler Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    Yeah. I do complain about the DNT/LOTF/FOTJ arc but every time I pick up one of those books I end up liking it. Out of the 3 I like LOTF the most. I've only read each FOTJ book once so I really shouldn't have an opinion on that.

    They do need other characters Ben's age. A YJK-type series would be amazing
  9. LexiLupin Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 27, 2011
    star 4
    Disagreed. Pellaeon.
    (Is it bad that I might be more upset about his death than the other two?)
  10. Zeta1127 Force Ghost

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    Sep 2, 2012
    star 4
    I mean seriously, am I supposed to want to read about every character I like either being killed or ruined to the point that they are no longer the character I like?
    SiouxFan likes this.
  11. Todd the Jedi Mod and Sitcom Dad of SWTV

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    star 5
    Disagreed further. Cal Omas.
  12. LexiLupin Jedi Grand Master

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    Mar 27, 2011
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    (may he rest in peace, now that we have official artwork to remember him by)
  13. Sinrebirth SWC and EUC Forum Moderator

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    Nelani Dinn in Betrayal, Sal-Solo in Bloodlines, Lekauf, Mara and Lumiya in Sacrifice, Cal Omas in Inferno, Alema Rar in Fury, Pellaeon in Revelation, Jacen, Shevu and Isolder in Invincible.

    Jacen's death, following by Pellaeon, being the most painful deaths.

    Anyone else I missed?
    Last edited by Sinrebirth, Sep 22, 2012
  14. LexiLupin Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 27, 2011
    star 4
    Well, there's Alema in Fury, and Lumiya in Sacrifice as well. Are we counting villains?
    Guess so. :p And Alema was a likable character once upon a time.

    edit: oh! And Jori Lekauf! Maybe not too well developed of a character, but it was an emotional death.
    Last edited by LexiLupin, Sep 22, 2012
  15. Sinrebirth SWC and EUC Forum Moderator

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    Duly edited.

    It was quite the meat-grinder, indeed.
  16. LexiLupin Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 27, 2011
    star 4
    I personally was a fan of Lieutenant Tebut, but I think we can draw the line well before officers who were introduced to make us like them in one scene, just so we can be appropriately horrified when they're murdered in the next.
  17. Tim Battershell Force Ghost

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    Sep 3, 2012
    star 4
    Fett's daughter?
  18. Runjedirun Chancellor of the EUC Senate

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    Sep 3, 2012
    star 6
    It would be even greater if the series could have been about Jacen training a young teenage Ben, the scenes of them in Betrayal were great. Ben is too old for a young readers series as things stand now.
  19. JediMatteus Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 16, 2008
    star 4
    maybe we could have areboot and get Mara nd jacen back. I would rather see Jacen be part of the imperial knights than a fake sith
  20. Force Smuggler Chosen One

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    Sep 2, 2012
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    A series about Jacen teaching Ben? Not a bad idea. It has potential
  21. DarthJenari Force Ghost

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    Dec 17, 2011
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    How old is Ben though? 16-17? By the end of YJK weren't Jacen and Jaina around that age?
    Last edited by DarthJenari, Sep 22, 2012
  22. Havac Some Guy Who Moderates Lit

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    Sep 29, 2005
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    To be fair, you can have new Jedi characters who are in-the-trenches-style characters who work against smaller-scale threats, and would have no particularly significant reason to show up in a major role in DN/LOTF/FOTJ. We also do have at least one instance of elevation in DN, with Octa Ramis emerging from "nondescript young Knight who's actually a bit of an immature hothead" to "Jedi Master on the Council."
  23. Sinrebirth SWC and EUC Forum Moderator

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    Nelani Dinn in Betrayal, Aliyn and Sal-Solo in Bloodlines, Lekauf, Mara and Lumiya in Sacrifice, Cal Omas in Inferno, Alema Rar in Fury, Pellaeon in Revelation, Jacen, Shevu and Isolder in Invincible.

    Duly accounted for. That's terribad.
  24. Havac Some Guy Who Moderates Lit

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    Sep 29, 2005
    star 7
    I've always found counting Nelani against the body count of LOTF to be ridiculous. She was in one book, in one plotline for maybe half the length of the book, and was introduced for the express purpose of dying. That in no way compares to killing off Pellaeon or Jacen, or even multi-book major supporting characters like Shevu. The character really ought to exist prior to the death for the death to count.

    Dur Gejjen and Tresina Lobi, on the other hand, could reasonably count as recurring supporting characters who were killed off. And if Allston hadn't essentially resurrected Kam, LOTF would be even bloodier.
  25. JediMara77 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 5, 2004
    star 4
    I didn't care about him. ;) I got that I was supposed to, but I just didn't, probably because I felt "meh" about the series and book as a whole.