Am I supposed to feel SORRY for him?!!

I felt so sorry for Anakin, especially the part where he is being reconstructed. Just listening to him scream in agony as the medical droids are poking and proding him, is just very saddening. I know that he is very evil, and has joined the dark side, but he is still human, the droids couldn't have administered a anesthetic, or some pain killers or something.

Another thing that really got to me was the scene when the helmet is lowered onto his head, the look he gives is a look of fright. Still, he has joined the sith, but during that scene, because of the look on his face, I believe that during that scene, it is Anakin Skywalker emerging from deep down inside of Vader, even just for a few seconds. This just goes to prove, there is still good in him. Padme was right. It was very heart-wrenching.

 

I dont feel sorry for vader...I feel sorry for me! I was denied my viewing of him slaying those damn younglings!! *chop* *chop*

 

I dont feel sorry for vader...I feel sorry for me! I was denied my viewing of him slaying those damn younglings!! *chop* *chop*

Grow up.

 

??
witty comeback

 

I agree.

Frankly, the younglings had it coming.

I was hoping we'd see a BBQ with annie toasting them on sticks.

 

This is an interesting thread. Dukhat said it well in comparing Anakin to Han...

One of the main things that has bothered me about the PT is the fact that through its fast-paced battle-filled frenzy you never really get the chance to develop any attachment to the characters like in the OT. This is especially true in the case of Anikan. He does indeed come across as a spoiled, bratty show-off, who you WANT to see brought down to size. In ROTS there is not a single moment I feel sorry for him and I definitely think he got what he deserved. The relationship with Padme is also completely unbeliveable. As a girl, I would have left him the moment he confessed to slaughtering the sand people; even though his mother had just died and he was deeply upset, it did not give him the right to massacre the whole tribe (including children) and certainly NOT if you're a training Jedi! But what does Padme do, she comforts her darling murderer...! From that point on their love was really contrived. I wish GL had been a bit more subtle at times in doing the PT.

 

heck yeah i felt for him. i'm someone who couldn't even bring myself to complete the darkside ending in KOTOR because i had to kill Mission etc.

but suprisingly i could see myself doing everything Anakin did under those circumstances up until the younglings slaughter

Anakin deserves sympathy because his evil sprung from a legitimate desire to help.its a lesser evil than that of the true sith who are just in it for themselves

 

Anakin deserves sympathy because his evil sprung from a legitimate desire to help.

The road to hell is paved with good intentions.

 

Am I supposed to feel SORRY for him?!!

Ok, after seeing the last of the star wars films, the last of the prequel trilogy and the last time we see Hayden Christianson OUTSIDE of the suit for the rest of the saga, I must say...HE GOT WHAT HE DESERVED. Anakin Skywalker was clearly a nut bag from the beginning...

And with the capacity for compassion that you show here, it seems that Anakin isn't the only character worthy of comtempt.

I don't understand why it's so hard for some people to grasp the concept that the audience is intended to have mixed emotions regarding Anakin.

I like Anakin for the good person that he once was, I pity him for the suffering and torment he experiences, I'm angry at him for allowing himself to be manipulated and for the choices he makes, and I hate him for killing the younglings.

Yes, I'm capable of feeling all these things about the same character...

...just as I can have mixed emotions about a person in the real world.

 

I hate little kids with a passion, but even I was shock that Anakin would kill all those little kids, especailly the litle kid that said "Master Anakin what should we do?"

In a way I dont feel sorry for Anakin, he had a choice but he instead took the easy or dark path for powers he is not worthy of!

 

Ok, after seeing the last of the star wars films, the last of the prequel trilogy and the last time we see Hayden Christianson OUTSIDE of the suit for the rest of the saga, I must say...HE GOT WHAT HE DESERVED. Anakin Skywalker was clearly a nut bag from the beginning...

And with the capacity for compassion that you show here, it seems that Anakin isn't the only character worthy of comtempt.

There is compassion in putting down someone no better than a mad dog. A compassion for the victims in his wake and for all the poeple who are his future victims because there will be some.

I've no compassion for serial killers or murderous rapists or tyrannical murderous leaders. They've killed with no compunction and will do it again unchecked.

 

widowlander is correct, based on ROTS i did not feel sorry for Vader...and his turn was not dramatic in and of itself. he was the same foolish and arrogant whiny punk we all bashed from AOTC...only double the power. the effects of his actions dictated the emotions in this film...i felt sad for yoda, really sad for padme and crushed for obi-wan. i guess when anakin ignited his saber against the younglings any chance of me EVER feeling sorry for him flew out the window. i do however understand him completely and i even see how he came to his conclusions. he is not the first immature man to ruin his life over a woman...nor is he the first man to choose the wrong side and get boxed in(literally) as a result. this is a tragic story for the side characters if anakin is the main as GL has said.

 

Everyone is acting like the children slaying is so shocking; It's not. It plays on everyone's heartstrings because it's presented in a fairly graphic way and a personal way in that Anni kills them with his own hands...

But, he wasn't Anni by that point. He was Darth Vader, and as we've known about Darth Vader from as early as Episode 4, he's vile. He destroyed a WHOLE PLANET; How many CHILDREN do you think were on Alderaan? I can assure you, plenty.... Can he be redeemed for these acts?

Yes. He can't right the wrongs, but he can be redeemed...and he was in ROTJ. I do feel sorry for him, even though the youngling scenes do make you want to hate him.. Also, as others mentioned, the book explains more.

 

Dawn of the Dead 2004 version!






Which is better Unrated or R rated!

 

There is redemption. After he pledged himself to Palpatine and to the dark side of the Force, Anakin Skywalker was CONSUMED by Darth Vader. The younglings, the Jedi Knights and Masters, the separatists leaders. He killed a lot of people in the name of finding an answer to save his wife from dying.

I do feel sorry for him. And there is redemption in the end. As long as he dies saving someone he loves. And he does that in the end.

 

Anakin did not ask to be appointed to the Jedi Council. Did he want it? Sure. But he didn't ask for it.

Anakin didn't ask for the Jedi Council to command him to betray his mentor and friend. He did though didn't he?

The way I saw the films, Anakin went from being the "chosen one" to being a pawn in a chess game Sids and the Jedi were playing, with neither side having any concern for Anakin.

Anakin has certainly had his bad moments, exhibited a terrible temper, jealousy, etc...all the traits of a Jedi going bad, but I cannot for a minute believe not a single other Jedi ever had to battle those emotions.

Think about this for a second before you completely toss Anakin in front of a speeder. What happens if Anakin takes his place as the chosen one and kills Palpy instead of Mace?

Scenario 1: The Jedi, already mistrusted by the majority of the senate, are arrested and stand trial.

Scenario 2: The senate, being the weak minded fools most of them appear to be, don't sweat Palpy's removal from office, and allow the Jedi to take over. Who's gonna run things? Mace? Ki? Yoda even said that path led to a dark and dangerous place.

Either option, the republic crumbles.

Yes, outwardly, because of his attachments, Anakin made the wrong decision...but in the grand scope of things, Anakin was left with no choice.

One other thing...there are many great prodigies in society that destroy their own lives and the lives of others, whether through flat out murder, drug abuse, alcohol abuse, whatever, their undoings are. Anakin had a terrible amount of pressure put on him.

There is a lot of debate to the case GL presented here. I think as you read between the lines, Anakin's fall was as perfect as it could possibly be.

 

Technically we aren't supposed to feel sorry for him. We're supposed to see him as an evil person now, that could never be redeemed, and then be surprised in ROTJ as anakins son conjures up Anakin's spirit within the mechanical monstrosity that is now Vader, and bring him back to the light side....

 

Anakin has certainly had his bad moments, exhibited a terrible temper, jealousy, etc...all the traits of a Jedi going bad, but I cannot for a minute believe not a single other Jedi ever had to battle those emotions.

I doubt any previous Jedi massacred a whole tribe of people because he was angry. Do we forget the Tuskens?

Think about this for a second before you completely toss Anakin in front of a speeder. What happens if Anakin takes his place as the chosen one and kills Palpy instead of Mace?

Scenario 1: The Jedi, already mistrusted by the majority of the senate, are arrested and stand trial.

Scenario 2: The senate, being the weak minded fools most of them appear to be, don't sweat Palpy's removal from office, and allow the Jedi to take over. Who's gonna run things? Mace? Ki? Yoda even said that path led to a dark and dangerous place.

Either option, the republic crumbles.

How about Scenario 3: The Jedi bring forward the security tapes from Palpatine's office which show quite clearly an arrest attempt being made and Paplatine - resisting arrest - killing the representatives of the Senate.

The Senate elects a replacement for Palpatine, probably someone NOT in his circle, Senator Organa maybe and there is a transfer of power once things get sorted out by investigations by the Jedi.

Nothing has to crumble. It gets fixed.

Yes, outwardly, because of his attachments, Anakin made the wrong decision...but in the grand scope of things, Anakin was left with no choice.

If it was destiny, no he had no choice, he was going to kill Sidious. He had the chance to and didn't kill him. And he did it for a pipe dream. He wants to save Padme. NOW. Not work on the power together with Sidious and hope they can figure it out. Sidious lied to him and then says the power can be learned when in reality he doesn't know how and instead of saying 'forget you', Anakin goes along with him anyway.

One other thing...there are many great prodigies in society that destroy their own lives and the lives of others, whether through flat out murder, drug abuse, alcohol abuse, whatever, their undoings are. Anakin had a terrible amount of pressure put on him.

What pressure? The pressure of his wife dying in childbirth? A wife who by the by, he wasn't supposed to have in the first place?!?!?!? Anakin broke the rules and paid for it. He did it to himself.

 

The other thing that people are forgetting is that Anakin DOES fulfill the phrophecy; he brings balance to the force.

"Balance" does not mean the "good guys" win the day unconditionally.

Over the course of his life he destroys both the ancient Jedi Order, as well as the Sith.

We're supposed to feel bad about the Jedi Order's destruction because they're "good", but they have some serious problems by the time of ROTS.

So Anakin found out that his only true friend, was a sith lord himself. And he was a nice man!

This all plays into it; the Jedi who are supposed to be his teachers and mentors treat him with fear and distrust, yet he's supposed to take their side?

The only other Jedi who actually believes in Anakin is ObiWan.

Mace doesn't even bother to veil his contempt for Skywalker. Windu has enough of his own brushes w/ the dark side (force crushing Greivous, wanting to slay Palpatine outright) that I would've doubted him just the same as Anakin does.

 

I do feel sorry for him. He was really decieved. In ROTJ, when the emperor tells Luke to kill Anakin, everything is in black and white. Good and evil are very clearly defined. We know the emperor is evil and has evil intensions. In the Dooku duel in ROTS, Ani still doesn't know the chancellor is the sith lord, so it's easier for the emperor to turn him.

 

As has been pointed out, Yoda states in the film that Anakin has been "consumed" by Darth Vader. There's more going on in this story than Anakin simply being a punk. Lucas infers in recent interviews that Anakin is being lured into 'Hell'. His mind is being poisoned by the 'Satanic' Sidious...

...and the films imply that it's been going on since Palpatine first patted ten-year old Anakin on the head.


On the issue of compassion - it's easy to say that you would have no compassion for a serial killer.

But what if you were told that a serial killer spent their childhood being mentally and physically tortured at the hands of an unstable adult - forced to do indescribable, degrading things to themselves and others?

Would that make things a little more complicated, or would you still be saying that you don't have an ounce of compassion for the person in question?

 

Yes you are. Not only do I feel terribly sorry for Anakin, but I am angry at the Jedi. They really screwed this thing up badly. They are entirely to blame for his fall. It was clear that Anakin was struggling, but the still treated him in that same cold manor with which they treat everyone. Anakin wasnt like them. He wasnt raised at the temple by unloving uncaring Jedi. He was raised by a mother who loved him and cared for him. Who would touch him. Hug him hold him and speak in actual words, not just sayings and Jedi maxims. You can see that Obi-Wan is trying to help a little, but he is limited by that sad upbringing that he had. I found myself yelling in my head at Obi-Wan, just give the kid a hug man. Never was a person more in need of a hug then Anakin. They never sat down with him and really explained it. They just kept referring to him as Young Skywalker. To his face. Its just like saying Sit down and shut up kid.

Padme blew it too. Warning signs all over the place with Anakin, but she was too busy with her war issues to even care. The same for the Jedi. So obsessed with the war that they completely ignored the boy.

Granted. I credit Palpatine for engineering the whole thing. He worked his magic on the Clone Wars to obtain
power, but he planned the Anakin seduction to coincide with the clone wars because he knew the Jedi would be to busy to notice.

It is a devastatingly sad movie and the arrogance of the Jedi is truly what caused his fall, or certainly enabled his fall. If they had treated him with any amount of respect, or more importantly, love; then he would have helped Windu and all would have turned out right.

 

Redemption..well it's up to you to decide for yourself, how you feel about it, that's a personal moral issue, but ultimately we are not the deciding factor in this case. Should you feel sorry for him? Again, thats up to you.

 

Heck yea, I feel sorry for him!

This is part of the complexity of the movie. For me I think that Anakin never truly ceases to exist. Anakin is always there- you can see his compassion and his goodness with his concern for Padme that is present at the end of ROTS, all the way up through his love for Luke that finally allows him to come back to the light side of the Force. Remember, people..... as Obi Wan says himself in the movie: only a Sith deals in absolutes. So it is wrong to say that Vader is completely evil, and then just becomes good again. I like the way he turned. It makes him a complex character, not just a black and white character... a "love him now" and "hate him later" kind of character. He has obvious problems but is mislead, as all of the Jedi were, and he just happens to be in a position where he is being manipulated more than most and thusly is betrayed. I feel bad for him, as I think is to be expected.

 

The "ace in the hole" played by lucas is he fact that we all relate to Anakin's fall, in the fact that we do all we can to protect those we love.

My point being that it's no crowbar manovour to turn anakin and we all sympathise with him to the extent that we'd do the same. it's not just evil for evil's sake ....and i think this is the major triumph of ROTS

CATCH 22...our love for em kills em/or we kill for those we love...discuss....