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Lit Amilyn Holdo's speech patterns aka "Holdo speak"

Discussion in 'Literature' started by Gruntz, Feb 11, 2018.

  1. mnjedi

    mnjedi Jedi Master star 3

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    Nov 4, 2012
    I was going to point out that even if DJ hadn't overheard that there is no way the FO would be dumb enough not to check for cloaked transports, just in case. I mean they have the technology right there, might as well run a routine scan for the only possible way the resistance could escape your clutches.

    But then I realized Hux is exactly dumb enough not to scan for cloaked transports.
     
  2. vncredleader

    vncredleader Jedi Master star 4

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    Mar 28, 2016
    Yeah. Once a conversation hits Bibble levels it's time to call it a truce. ;)
     
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  3. Gruntz

    Gruntz Jedi Youngling

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    Feb 10, 2018
    Thank you, it's a really interesting detail! Well, suppose they thought it would be unnatural for her to behave like this while she is on duty as the Admiral (just as was said about Amidala: "She can be cold and commanding when she needs to be, or warm and loving as Padme"). I hope this isn't the last appearance of Holdo (they can make a prequel or reveal that she survived in a sequel), so perhaps there could be a personal/informal scene when she's alone with Leia, with some other friends, or with her sweetheart, in which she could be more like her book version, doing meditation and speaking in metaphors.
     
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  4. BigAl6ft6

    BigAl6ft6 Force Ghost star 6

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    Nov 12, 2012
    yah if anyone wants to hear Johnson say that I think it's on the commentary track when Holo first shows up and I believe right when she's having her first conversation with Poe.
     
    Last edited: Apr 18, 2018
  5. Gruntz

    Gruntz Jedi Youngling

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    Feb 10, 2018
    Holdo's way of speaking also reminds me a bit of Oma Desala and the Kheb monk from Stargate, i. e. "If you immediately know the candlelight is fire, then the meal was cooked a long time ago" :)
     
  6. Xander Vos

    Xander Vos Jedi Knight star 3

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    Aug 3, 2013
    Poe destroyed a Dreadnaught.
     
  7. Noash_Retrac

    Noash_Retrac Jedi Master star 4

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    Nov 14, 2006
    At the cost of all eight Resistance bombers and their crews (8x5=40 personnel), at least 1 RZ-2 A-wing (Zizo Tlo) and at least 3 T-70 X-wings (including Jaycris Tubbs). 44 people died in that attack alone.
     
  8. Xander Vos

    Xander Vos Jedi Knight star 3

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    Aug 3, 2013
    And how many lives were saved?

    How many fighters lost their lives attacking the Death Star? 37?
     
  9. Noash_Retrac

    Noash_Retrac Jedi Master star 4

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    Nov 14, 2006
    The Resistance is severely undermanned and underequipped at a time when the Republic is shattered by the First Order.
    Poe played the hero and it cost 44 people's lives. He later played hero and the consequences were close to 370-380.

    Yes the dreadnaught was destroyed, but for the Resistance, every little thing they possess is more important.
     
  10. Xander Vos

    Xander Vos Jedi Knight star 3

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    Aug 3, 2013
    And then Holdo played the hero by ramming Snoke's ship.
     
  11. Charlemagne19

    Charlemagne19 Chosen One star 8

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    Jul 30, 2000
    No lives were saved because Leia pointed out the Resistance needed those bombers more than the FO needed the Dreadnought.

    I trust Leia over Poe.

    Also, he disobeyed orders....from Leia. She was warning him to trust his superiors and basically Poe ended up getting most of the Resistance killed later in the movie.
     
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  12. nancipants

    nancipants Jedi Knight star 1

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    Nov 16, 2017
    You know who killed a lot more people in the Resistance? Kylo Ren and General Hux.
     
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  13. Darth_Duck

    Darth_Duck Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    Oct 13, 2000
    Yeah, but that's their job.

    Sent from my SM-G386W using Tapatalk
     
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  14. vncredleader

    vncredleader Jedi Master star 4

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    Mar 28, 2016
    It says it on their business cards and everything
     
  15. Xander Vos

    Xander Vos Jedi Knight star 3

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    Aug 3, 2013
    That's illogic to me. Destroying the Dreadnaught inherently prevented it from killing anyone else.
     
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  16. Noash_Retrac

    Noash_Retrac Jedi Master star 4

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    Nov 14, 2006
    Poe: "There were heroes on that mission."
    Leia: "Dead heroes, no leaders."
     
  17. Xander Vos

    Xander Vos Jedi Knight star 3

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    Aug 3, 2013
    And as I've already pointed out, this entire message/learning point is completely undermined by Holdo going and doing the exact same thing. Dead hero, no leader left behind. No capital ship.
     
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  18. Noash_Retrac

    Noash_Retrac Jedi Master star 4

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    Nov 14, 2006
    Holdo's decision was last minute and desperate. Read the novelisation and actually rewatch the scene, even I could see that she was running through scenarios until she finally figured it out.
     
  19. Xander Vos

    Xander Vos Jedi Knight star 3

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    Aug 3, 2013
    I have read the novelisation. You think Poe's decision to press the attack on the Dreadnaught was pre-meditated and calculated? He was also acting on the spur of the moment making the best decision he thought he could make.
     
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  20. Sarge

    Sarge Chosen One star 6

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    Oct 4, 1998
    I agree, Poe acted as he thought was right, based on the information he had. Leia was standing back further and had a better view of the overall situation, a better understanding of the big picture. She could see that the attack was unnecessary, and she made the right call to abort. Poe should have listened, but he thought he knew better than Leia. It's the old line of thinking common to front-line troops, "The brass in the back don't understand our situation so we'll have to do what's necessary without orders." Sometimes they're right, sometimes they're not.
     
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  21. Gruntz

    Gruntz Jedi Youngling

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    Feb 10, 2018
    Do you know whether outtakes from TLJ are available anywhere? I'd love to have a look at this version of Holdo :)
     
  22. BigAl6ft6

    BigAl6ft6 Force Ghost star 6

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    Nov 12, 2012
    I've gone through every bit of data on the Last Jedi blu ray, there's no deleted Holdo stuff can I remember. It seems they just reshot it again and she changed the tone of her performance. Johnson says there's still some of her original performance in there, I do believe you can see it when she's doing hand motions in a wide shot in her first conversation with Poe.
     
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  23. LelalMekha

    LelalMekha Jedi Grand Master star 5

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    Oct 29, 2012
    Also, it's more of a real-life issue, but Laura Dern visibly making "pew! pew!" sounds while shooting with her blaster does suit a wackier Holdo.

    [​IMG]
     
  24. Noash_Retrac

    Noash_Retrac Jedi Master star 4

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    Nov 14, 2006
    Laura Dern did mention she couldn't help herself when she doing it so in the end they just left it in.

    I would be in the same situation if I was in a Star Wars film too and I'm sure we'd all end up reliving our childhoods and forgetting that this was actually a film set.
     
  25. LelalMekha

    LelalMekha Jedi Grand Master star 5

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    Oct 29, 2012
    @Noash_Retrac I did say it's more of a real-life issue. Nevertheless, it's there is it's visible, so why not make it an in-universe thing while we're at it?
     
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