Amphitheatre Reform Proposal

Discussion in 'Communications' started by RidingMyCarousel, Aug 5, 2002.

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  1. RidingMyCarousel Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 20, 2002
    star 6
    Amphitheatre Cleanup Proposal
    Greetings. Myself and Terr_Mys wanted to bring up some issues with the recently created Amphitheatre board. The board isn't running on the rules set out for it when it was created. So, in this proposal, we would like to point out a few things that would help clean the Amphitheatre up and bring it back into better shape. :) I. Frivolous discussion/list threads
      A. All threads that do not contain a serious discussion of one of the arts should be locked and their authors redirected to the proper forum.
      ~ Meaning, threads that do not fit into the description of the Amphitheatre should be redirected by either a user or a moderator. It would help clear the confusion and keep the same thread from being reposted.
      B. All threads that consist of lists of favorite films, songs, etc. and of no real discussion should be locked as soon as possible and their authors redirected to the JCC.
      ~ As stated above, these should be redirected. Now, one "official" thread on each of these topics would be fine, for a general discussion. It would keep some of the traffic in the Amphitheatre, but would not be allowed to leave those designated threads. This would help bring together more people to discuss (without an in depth discussion) certain aspects of the arts.
    II. Lack of definitions
      A. Defintions of proper threads should be posted in the Amphitheatre. A clear, standard definition of what belongs and what doesn't is a requirement.
      ~ As Lord Bane stated in the Welcome to the Amphitheatre thread, That is a bit of a difficult question. What constitues arts and culture? To some, only things like theater, art and literature may be included. Others see film and television, dance and modern music as a part. We will have to learn as this forum grows. The main areas of focus right now include film, poetry & prose, theater, artistic expression, dance, music both classic and modern. That is not to say other topics cannot be discussed. That is a sample, starting point. Culture and the arts are ever-changing and we must respond to that..

      Now, more of a definition could be defined. Such as social threads (save those approved by the moderators; eg: Favorite song, etc) would not be tolerated. And threads that are just a "I think this show rocks" & "I agree" should be locked and relocated. Some threads go days without being looked upon by moderators. Many Amphitheatre goers inform moderators also, but the response time is generally much slower than on the rest of the JC.
      B. A clear distinction must be made between the following topics and which ones belong in the Amphitheatre.
      1. Film discussion threads and film appreciation threads
      2. Video game discussion, appreciation, and artistic viewpoint threads.
      3. Music discussion threads and artist/band/composer appreciation threads.
      4. Literature discussion threads and literature/author appreciation threads.
      5. Any other art-related topics that are not clearly defined.

      ~ As stated previously, threads that are just "appreciation" threads do not belong in the Amphitheatre, unless some form of in depth discussion is involved. Appreciation threads are YJCC content. And unless one or two are moderator approved, they should not be allowed.
    III. Lack of moderation
      A. There is need for stricter moderation in the forum. Moderators must monitor threads more closely and use clear judgement when deciding what to do with a thread.
      B. There is also strong need for a moderator to solely moderate the Amphitheatre. While other moderators may moderate the forum at times, there should be one or two moderators dedicated solely to it.
      ~ With the moderators that currently cover the Amphitheatre busy with other assigned forums, the board is easily overlooked. Normally (not all the time :)), most moderators seem to skip ov
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  2. wstraka5 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 22, 2002
    star 4
    There are several problems with section 3 of your proposal.


    1). One can argue that every forum would need a specific mod dedicated to it. For example, the 3SA forum always needs a lot more moderation than most of the rest of the JC. The YJCC, Senate, 3NSA and AOTC forums also need a lot of moderation, yet only the Senate has a dedicated mod (KnightWriter)

    2). The other major problem is that most mods, like regular users, want to post elsewhere asw well as the fact as can't be on at all times.
  3. farraday Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2000
    star 7
    Even if this doesn't end in a promotion of a new mod, it does highlight the problem of mods either not knowing the rules or just ignoring forums until they're notified of a problem. If I may recall, before AotC there were lots of problems in Music, but since it's off the beaten path, there was little moderation, much to the dismay of it's regular visitors.
  4. Red_Oktobur Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 7, 2001
    star 6
    Several? Looks more like TWO, wstraka :p
  5. RidingMyCarousel Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 20, 2002
    star 6
    I agree with you, wstraka. Mods are people with lives. They can't be on 24/7. But, the moderators for the Amphitheatre have commitments to other boards first. KnightWriter is doing a darn good job with the Senate and going back and forth with the Amp. when needed. What myself and Terr are getting at is that either the rules should be followed strictly and possibly a new moderator to help enforce them.

    Problem being, some moderators don't follow the rules of the Amphitheatre. And there are a few threads that aren't what the Amph. was designed for. Here's a small list:
    There are others that have gone on like this, but most are just left to be.
  6. Red_Oktobur Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 7, 2001
    star 6
  7. Terr_Mys Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 19, 2002
    star 6
  8. Red_Oktobur Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 7, 2001
    star 6
    Just did a quick peek thru the 1st page, and I see what James means. And Mys, too.
  9. Gandalf the Grey Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 14, 2000
    star 6
    Alright, going through the list of threads:
    Mystery Science Theatre 3k Thread ~> When I got the lock request, I locked it.
    M. Night Shyamalan's Signs ~> I?m generally not going to necessarily lock one thread because another thread is closely related. For example, if someone started a Isaac Asimov discussion thread, and later someone else created a I, Robot discussion thread, I would probably allow both. The later thread encourages more focused discussion around a specific subject.
    Best Horror Movie of All Time ~> Keeps going through cycles of people not reading the warnings and putting in lists of their favorites, people warning them to stop listing and start discussing, a few intelligent posts, and then someone posts another list and the cycle restarts. I still have hope for the thread.
    THE Woody Allen Thread ~> It?s a movie discussion thread, centered around films that Woody Allen makes. Given that there is actual discussion happening, I had decided to leave it open.
    For the love of all that is holy and good, what is this opera?!?? ~> Thought it was an opera thread, ignored it do to my lack of interest in opera [face_blush]
    "heroes" from box office movies battle royal/survivor. ~> locked on sight.


    Normally, I look at the top twenty five or so threads in a forum and if nothing looks out of place, then I go about my business. If something looks suspicious, I open it and see what?s inside. But things slip through. Only spending a few hours online every day, we mods need the cooperation of regular users to keep these boards running optimally.

    Some of the reasons in which the Amphitheatre doesn?t seem to play by the rules originally set out is because Lord Bane is generally harsher on off-topic-ness than myself, and in part because I (and presumably other mods as well) can?t be online at all times. Generally, as far as I?m concerned, as long as there is honest discussion surrounding one form of art or another, it?s alright to have it in the Amphitheatre.

    I'm not saying I disagree with what is being said here though. I'm definitely going to consider it.
  10. darth daedelus Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 14, 1999
    star 1
    The forum has been going for a few weeks now and it only has four pages. It's not like PSA where redundancy really clogs the place up, so I don't see the case for the kind of close moderation you are proposing.
  11. gwaernardel Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 5, 2001
    star 4
    I tend to agree with daedelus here. It's been going for 2 months and there hasn't been all that many problems...just the same users that will have problems with redundancy and posting in the wrong forum no matter where they go. Everything that's been in the wrong place has been locked, and it's not bringing anyone else's enjoyment of the Amphitheatre down. Not mine, at least.
  12. Terr_Mys Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 19, 2002
    star 6
    Still, I think the point remains that there is a lack of information regarding the forum. Not everyone is really sure what belongs there and what belongs in YJCC, and the Amphitheatre tends to suffer from a lack of activity. Maybe that's just because there isn't a whole lot of interest in the arts, but it could be due to other things.
  13. KnightWriter Administrator Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 6, 2001
    star 8
    I believe the Amphitheatre is still developing an identity as a forum. I'll work on moderating it more closely, and I'm sure Gandolf will as well. Between the two of us, I'm sure can do the work that is necessary. It does not have the activity of the Senate (which is one of the reasons that forum justifies a dedicated moderator), and as mentioned before, it's still developing an identity, which means both members and admins are learning as they go along.

  14. Kerr_Plunk Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 2, 2002
    star 6
    the Amphitheatre tends to suffer from a lack of activity.

    suffer? how so?
    the amphitheatre seems to going along quite smooth from all outward appearances.. maybe a misplaced topic here and there, but, i don't see how it is suffering


    Maybe that's just because there isn't a whole lot of interest in the arts, but it could be due to other things.

    the way i see it, is that the responses in the amphitheatre are not stream-of-consciousness, off-the-top-o-yer-head type responses - they are generally rather well thought out, which leads me to believe that people just take their time in formulating their responses rather than just flying off the cuff with one quip here and another there...

    the amphitheatre is fine... it's like leaving the playground and going into the den... if that makes sense...


    edit: spelling
  15. Terr_Mys Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 19, 2002
    star 6
    All I'm saying is that perhaps the Amphitheatre isn't very well-known? I'm not sure, but it could be possible that a lot of JCers interested in the arts are not aware of this forum. By suffer I simply meant that it doesn't seem to get much attention.

    And, sure, that may be due to the fact that it's a forum for well thought-out discussion, but some of the more intelligent topics are overshadowed by the simpler, more YJCC-esque ones like, "Official Halloween Thread".

    I don't know. Really the main point RMCOY and I were trying to make is that the forum needs clearer definitions as to proper content, and it certainly would be nice to get in some more intelligent discussions, and weed the bad ones out. It may not be a serious problem, but it's still important.
  16. KnightWriter Administrator Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 6, 2001
    star 8
    All I'm saying is that perhaps the Amphitheatre isn't very well-known? I'm not sure, but it could be possible that a lot of JCers interested in the arts are not aware of this forum. By suffer I simply meant that it doesn't seem to get much attention.

    Do you have any ideas to change that?

  17. Terr_Mys Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 19, 2002
    star 6
    Well in section IV-C of the proposal we said: C. Information about the Amphitheatre should be shared on other art-related forums in the hopes of gaining wider interest.

    This is just one of many solutions, and probably isn't the best one. But still, starting simply, I think it would be wise to re-do the Amphitheatre's informational threads and make them 'sticky' in order to help visitors to the forum.
  18. EmpressPalpatine Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Mar 31, 2001
    star 4
    nice to see the campaign gathering steam...
  19. Radiohead Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 31, 2002
    star 4
    All I'm saying is that perhaps the Amphitheatre isn't very well-known?

    The Amphitheater is a unique board. It seeks to promote intelligent discussion among its visitors; the fact that it's "not well known" or that it's not visited by as many people as the YJCC for example shouldn't be a big issue. Some people don't visit the Amphitheater simply because they don't care to have well thought-out debates about the arts--and there's nothing wrong with that. The best any moderator can do is to improve the board for the current regular posters in The Amphitheater, but also to promote its growth and development.
  20. Terr_Mys Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 19, 2002
    star 6
    And that's exactly what we're trying to do. I'm just saying that it would probably be easier for me to have a productive, intelligent conversation about an artistic topic (save for some spamming) in YJCC...
  21. MrEmh Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 14, 1999
    star 2
    Haha, surely you jest.
  22. Terr_Mys Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 19, 2002
    star 6
    Well...in some respects, I'm serious. Many threads in the Amphitheatre seem to get nowhere.
  23. RidingMyCarousel Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 20, 2002
    star 6
    Some threads in the Amphitheatre go nowhere, then again, threads in every forum go nowhere. I mean, look at the YJCC ;)

    But I think that may be what Terr is trying to point out. Unfortunately, just like some topics in the Senate, the conversation will go back and forth. In sense they go nowhere, and become redundant with the same ideas, back and forth. But every now and then a new idea is thrown in with the old, killing the redundancy, bringing life to the thread.

    if someone started a Isaac Asimov discussion thread, and later someone else created a I, Robot discussion thread, I would probably allow both. The later thread encourages more focused discussion around a specific subject.
    -- I see your point. It's a rather good one. But then again, if the two threads are nearly similar, would this be grounds for locking?

    ..and it's not bringing anyone else's enjoyment of the Amphitheatre down. Not mine, at least.
    -- It doesn't really bring it down for myself, either. It's just like seeing something that shouldn't be there. That tends to get annoying.

    ..which means both members and admins are learning as they go along.
    -- As the identity grows, though, some people more and more often are going about creating YJCC like threads. Moderators and new users alike don't help with using the set rules. Then again, it is a new board.

    Now, I'd like to spark up some debate. If the rules currently for the Amphitheatre were changed to allow a looser discussion of things (such as certain discussion threads, I'd assume mod-approved like mentioned in the proposal), do you think the Amphitheatre would still stay the discussion place it is? Or would it loose the "flavor" it has as a serious discussion forum? I'm not saying change the entire rules, just maybe allow a few threads purposely be "off topic", and if they just turn into a chat thread, lock them.
  24. Internet_Drama Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Dec 26, 2001
    star 1
  25. solojones Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 27, 2000
    star 9
    I frequent the Ampitheatre, and sadly it doesn't seem to get much attention from posters or from administrations. I agree with what my pals Carosel and Terr said, but the way I see it it boils down to these two options:

    1) find some people who are willing to mod the Ampitheatre board (probably wouldn't take too many, because it's not a large board)

    2) integrate the discussions there back into YJCC to make them more visable (in which case, you might need more YJCC mods)

    Just my .02 :)

    -sj loves kevin spacey
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