anakin and tusken raiders

Discussion in 'Maryland' started by orangerful, Jun 22, 2002.

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  1. DRK_HLMT Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 7, 2001
    star 4
    Oh no! Isbeth is calling out the EUDF! Everbody run!!! :_|
  2. Face Loran Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 21, 1999
    star 4
    "While George has OK'ed the writing of the books, the making of the toys, etc, etc, etc, he has publicly stated that none of them are true canon except HIS movies."

    Well, if we're just going by what Lucas says, then nothing, including the movies, is "canon." Why, you ask? Because Lucas has never, ever, mentioned the C word in an interview. Ever. The notion of Canon starts and ends with Lucasfilm Licensing, who's policy regarding canon, ironically enough, says everything is canon, unless labeled infinities. While you can believe whatever you want, you won't be able to back up your opinions with anything from George Lucas, because it doesn't exist.

    That's right, you better run!!! [face_devil]
  3. Fire_Light Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 24, 2002
    star 5
    I think I missed the boat on this one. :D
  4. MuttandSolo Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 1, 2002
    star 4
    Do not underestimate the powers of the EU. Lies, betrayal, mistrust are its ways. The Dark Side, EU is. Once EU you have accepted, down the quick and easy path of the Dark Side you will travel and forever will it dominate your destiny. Consume you it will, as it has Isbeth.

    The novelizations, remember the failures of the novelizations...
  5. gh0stdevil Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jun 3, 2002
    star 1
    Okay, people have pointed out GL never used the word canon. Well I didn't mean to imply I directly quoted him. What I meant was that I remember hearing him say that nothing but the films were "VALID". Valid, canon, whatever. =P

    -gh0stdevil
  6. Rev_Leidu Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 22, 2001
    star 5
    Do not underestimate the powers of the EU. Lies, betrayal, mistrust are its ways. The Dark Side, EU is. Once EU you have accepted, down the quick and easy path of the Dark Side you will travel and forever will it dominate your destiny. Consume you it will, as it has Isbeth.

    The novelizations, remember the failures of the novelizations...


    Why must everyone accuse the EU of being terrible? There are good books out there, you know. Why don't you try the Trawn Trilogy or one of the good ones besides Crystal Star or another one like that.

    Judging the whole EU on the few bad books, honestly. *shakes head*
  7. SirLancelot Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 10, 2002
    star 4
    honestly, people read one of the bad EU novels and they think its all crap, i hate when people sterotype like that. Dont you know whenever you make a novilization of a movie then its is automatically bad?

    To you what is official star wars? Is it when Lucas does all the writing and directing himself? If its not by Lucas its not true star wars? Most people will agree that ESB is the best SW movie, and i would agree, it is the best of star wars. But you know why its so good? Because someone beside Lucas wrote the screenplay and someone else directed! Sure Lucas wrote the story but luckally for us that was all he did.
  8. Mogook Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 14, 2001
    star 4
    Alright, we had an EU debate here before, and we know how that turned out. I let this go for awhile, but now we have people I've never seen before posting in this thread. I think this is going too far.

    Let's get this back on topic before a mod decides we're crossing dangerous territory and closes it. :)
  9. SirLancelot Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 10, 2002
    star 4
    good idea, arguing about it has gotten no one, no where, so lets cut it out before another thread becomes a waste land
  10. orangerful Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Apr 29, 2002
    star 1
    For me, and maybe just for me, "canon" are the films. Why? because this is what most people have seen. Majority of people, even if they are not huge fans, have seen the films.

    Also, I have alway felt that Star Wars the movies are less sci-fi and just more updated myths. Most of the books I have picked up have been hard core sci-fi novels, not working in the mythical stories that shroud the original trilogy. The books are for a different breed of fan, one of which I am not.

    I'm sad to say Rev_Leidu, that I am one of those people who gave up on the EU pretty quick. I loved the Zahn trilogy that kicked it all off. And have the "tales from the cantina/jabbas palace" books. Then I picked up Kevin J. Anderson's books. And that pretty much killed it for me. I had no desire to see these characters that I had grown to love be written wrong. So I've pretty much ended my E universe after "The Last Command". (though I will admit that i own most of the books published over the years, I work at a library and we are constantly getting donations or withdrawing star wars books).

    But either way, to each his/her own. If you love the EU then by all means read the books etc. They are just not my bag baby.

    I'm sure you guys have had this conversation a thousand times, but I this is the first time I've been a part of it so I thought I'd toss it out there. :)

    toodle pip
    Sam
  11. lawnmowerman603 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jun 23, 2002
    star 2
    anyone know if there's a virginia fanforce?
  12. Mogook Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 14, 2001
    star 4
    This is off topic. There's a Norfolk, VA forum. Go to the Northeast forum page to find it. :)
  13. Genghis12 Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 18, 1999
    star 6
    gh0stdevil...
    "Isbeth, not to contradict you, but I've heard a very different story."

    That's alright. People tell all sorts of stories all of the time, from the existence of the Tooth Fairy to Lucas talking about canon. The difference? The Tooth Fairy is more tangible than a quote about Lucas speaking about "canon."

    "While George has OK'ed the writing of the books, the making of the toys, etc, etc, etc, he has publicly stated that none of them are true canon except HIS movies (IE eps 1,2,4,5,6, and soon 3)."

    WRONG. What George Lucas has done was personally originate the expanded universe himself. In fact, the very first ever stories expanding on Star Wars were the ones seen in Marvel's ongoing Star Wars comic series. We know Lucas' role because it's been published:
      Marvel & Canon
      Star Wars #1, July 1977, Marvel Comics
      "The Story Behind Star Wars - The Movie and the Comic Mag
      by Roy Thomas
      It started slowly, this Star Wars project. Both for George Lucas and even for Marvel Comics.
      It's a couple of years now since I met George Lucas... We met, shared a dinner and a few anecdotes and that was it.
      Or so it seemed.
      For, a few months later, a friend of George Lucas' looked me up. His name was Charlie Lippencott, and he was (for lack of a better term, he said) media director of George Lucas' new film, Star Wars, about which I knew nothing but the name.
      Fairly understandable, since at that statge filming ahdn't even been started.
      Charlie informed me, after a spaghetti dinner and some more swapped anecdotes, that he and George would like Marvel Comics in general and me in particular to handle the comic book adaptation of Star Wars..." Marvel Bullpen Bulletins (Archie Goodwin, Ed.)
      "ITEM! To emphasize what Stan was saying in the Soapbox about the House of Ideas zooming along, let's kick off this column with a few words about another new title we're springing on you this month... STAR WARS!
      If that sounds familiar, it might be because we've plugged it a bit in the past, but a much better bet is that you've been hearing about the multi-million dollar, super science-fiction film from Twentieth Century Fox upon which our comic is based. STAR WARS is an epic of the far-flung future where intergalactic war and intrigue ruin rampant... To do it justice in graphic story format, Mr. Lucas and company handpicked Marvel for the awesome adaptation task, singling out Rascally Roy Thomas as writer/editor and Wholesome Howard Chaykin as artist..."Birth of Non-Movie Canon (OR Dispelling the Big Green Bunny Hatred Myth)
      Star Wars #6, Dec. 1977 Marvel Comics
      "...And yes, as heralded at the end of this issue's wind-up of the film story, just 30 days from now Thomas and Chaykin will be carrying on the story of our Star Warriors, into new areas not covered by the movie itself. It came about this way:
      George Lucas himself, of course, had had plans for more than one 'Star Wars' film ever since its inception several years ago. In fact, there exist several earlier screenplays under the name 'Star Wars' which bear almost no resemblence whatever to the film as it eventually emerged, and Roy was given these to scan to see if there was anything that could be turned into a comic-book Star Wars #7 and beyond. While the screenplays are fascinating, they seem if anything to occur in the months and years before the movie itself, and we're pretty certain that it's really the likes of Luke Skywalker, Princess Leia, Han Solo and Chewbaaca, the droids Artoo and Threepio, that everyone wants to see more of.
      Accordingly, Roy got together for lunch in Hollywood the other day with George Lucas (as well as amiable Mark Hamill, who plays Luke in the movie) to discuss the direction he and Howie would take the trip. Messrs. Thomas and Chaykin had already plotted #7 and set the direction for an issue or two beyond, but they wanted to be sure that their own scheme of things did not conflict with future plans of George hi/>/>/>
  14. Mogook Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 14, 2001
    star 4
    I wish people posting in here would read the previous posts. The title of this thread is "anakin and tusken raiders." No more canon debates in here! I don't want Rox to have to lock this thread. It isn't fair to orangerful (who started this thread) and it isn't fair to the others who posted in here for a valid discussion. End the petty debate or continue elsewhere.

    We have these lengthy posts that mean nothing when all the dust clears. Those interested in the thread's topic will have to scroll through meaningless posts about what is and isn't canon. Please end it.

    EDIT: I'm not posting this as an invitation to continue the debate. But since the previous post contained quotes, I thought I'd post something. This is only food for thought. If any posts after this attempt to re-ignite the debate, the thread will have to be locked.

    The interview is here, on the Official Site. I don't want to post the whole thing because it's long, but I encourage all of you to read it.

    I'm quoting LucasBooks' Chris Cerasi:
    When it comes to absolute canon, the real story of Star Wars, you must turn to the films themselves - and only the films. Even novelizations are interpretations of the film, and while they are largely true to George Lucas' vision (he works quite closely with the novel authors), the method in which they are written does allow for some minor differences. The novelizations are written concurrently with the film's production, so variations in detail do creep in from time to time. Nonetheless, they should be regarded as very accurate depictions of the fictional Star Wars movies.


    Let's continue the topic this thread was intended for and we can all get along. :)
  15. Genghis12 Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 18, 1999
    star 6
    Mogook,
    Not fair. You can't give out outdated information and not expect someone to address it.

    The TOS policy you posted has been superceded by the Gamer policy I posted. TOS carries the August 17, 2001 date. Gamer carries the Oct 2001 date. Gamer is the latest word on the situation.

    That is, the one I posted is LFL's latest word on the matter. The one you posted is not and is irrelevent as McCallum's quote from four years ago.

    And furthermore, TOS reinforces exactly what Gamer was stating. TOS states the movies are Absolute canon, but no one discussing such a narrowly-focused sub-group of Canon.

    Everything not Infinities is canon. The movies are absolute. That's what TOS and Gamer say and support each other with.

    Lock away if you feel you have to. :)
  16. MuttandSolo Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 1, 2002
    star 4
    I post one "EU is the Dark Side" joke as a poke aimed at Isbeth out of fun and everyone on the planet thinks I'm bashing the EU. I do not wish to continue this petty canon debate, nor did I wish to begin one.

    Can we get back to Anakin and the Tuskin Raiders debate, please? My apologies to Orangerful for unintentionally starting this problem. I guess I'll have to keep my EU jokes to myself from now on.

    And Genghis, get out of our threads or I'll have you reported, again. This is the Maryland forum. There are people here who do not venture into the other forums because of spammers like you, so please go back to your corner of the Internet, and leave ours alone.
  17. DRK_HLMT Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 7, 2001
    star 4
    People, please. All this talk of canon has got me thinking I'm at a camera convention! This EU debate will go on and on and will cause some harsh words to be said. So I say let sleeping dogs lie. I love the books AND I love the movie and not once do I sit and contemplate what is "canon" and what is not. Nor do I try to convince others that one or the other is right or wrong. They are stories to entertain us and not some bizarre conspiracy to unravel the fabric of the universe. Take it for what it is and if you want to believe that what you see or read is gospel according to George, the EU and the almighty GFFA, then by all means that is your right. Just don't think you can convince anyone else that what you might consider canon, no matter how many sources you quote, is the end-all be-all of human existence and think that it will not be challenged. It is human nature to question everything and ask for the ABSOULTE truth. but that may never happen so just read the books, watch the movies and ENJOY YOURSELF! That's what SW is all about right??
  18. gh0stdevil Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jun 3, 2002
    star 1
    I like Tusken Raiders.

    I like Anakin.

    I like candy.

    Mmm, candy.

    -gh0stdevil
  19. Genghis12 Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 18, 1999
    star 6
    Muttandsolo...
    "And Genghis, get out of our threads or I'll have you reported, again. This is the Maryland forum. There are people here who do not venture into the other forums because of spammers like you, so please go back to your corner of the Internet, and leave ours alone."

    [face_laugh] Go right ahead. I have just as much a right to post here as anyone else.

    But, more importantly, I'm posting here as a favor to a Maryland Fanforcer. But even that's irrelevent, because there's people here who are posting completely incorrect information. They should expect to be called on it. Regardless of whether I have specific business here or not, someone brought up a side point of discussion and people were interested in discussing it. If it gets into a prolonged discussion, I accept that those wishing to continue discussing it can move to its own thread different from this one. But, your addressing/commenting on it and trolling people is also just as off-topic.

    If you don't like venturing into other forums, then that's your perogative. But, you have absolutely no business telling anyone where they can and can't post.

    Quit trolling people who have come here just to help. It's people like you who tear SW fandom apart. You should be welcoming SW fans into your corner of the internet instead of being a jerk about it. [face_plain]
  20. DarthSapient Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Jun 26, 2001
    star 10
    Okay, okay...time out. Technically, this thread should get locked because it went off-topic and has remained that way ever since. But I won't lock it. Also, you can discuss anything in this forum, including EU vs. canon. But I'd like to just say a few things.

    Start a separate thread for EU vs canon. Whether you love it or hate it means little to me. Gush and bash, I don't care. Just remember that both sides are correct in their own minds, they deserve to be heard, and neither side should flame. So continue that portion of the conversation in a new thread, just post your disagreements in a respectful and mature manner and then everyone wins.

    And who knows, maybe you just might learn something or change your point of view. This is directed at no one in particular and everyone all at the same time. :)
  21. Mogook Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 14, 2001
    star 4
    Alright, this has gone too far.

    Genghis12, I didn't know the information I posted was out of date, and you called me on posting stuff without allowing atleast one rebuttal. For this I'm sorry.

    DRK_HLMT, you're exactly right. In the end it doesn't matter.

    And in general, everyone is allowed to post here. It's great when you see other people come in and contribute their own theories. But what I think upset Mutt was that people only came in here to debate EU. They didn't come in because they happened to come across the thread and wanted to contribute their own interesting theory. It seems they were called in and to debate EU. I'd like to see more outsiders come in and post, but when they're just coming in to argue something that is OT and shouldn't be discussed, the thread becomes a war.

    This thread will have to be closed, but orangerful, if you like, please feel free to start another thread. I encourage you to start another. I think you had an interesting topic with some nice theories on it. I'm sorry your thread turned into a battlefield.
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