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Anakin character development: did the "Clone Wars" cartoon do it better?

Discussion in 'Star Wars TV- Completed Shows' started by -maynard-, Aug 13, 2005.

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  1. -maynard-

    -maynard- Jedi Youngling star 3

    Registered:
    Jun 1, 2005
    -maynard- posted:
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    ok. the flaw(s) im referring to is that the PT uses a very heavy mythological (arguably biblical) and philosphical foundation, but at the same time asserts that we ignore them to large degree.
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    I'm not sure what you mean. I've never seen Lucas assert, either directly or through the movies, that we should ignore the mythological/Biblical/philosophical foundation. Lucas has referred to the SW movies as a modern myth, and has been open about his various influences, particularly Jospeh Campbell


    Lucas asserts that these issues should not be taken very seriously because he says his movies are just popcorn flicks. i dont think that heavy mythological/Biblical/philosophical issues should be presented in the way they were in the PT if they werent going to be explained.

    if he wants simple and fun movies, then make simple and fun movies

    you cant bring up all these giagantic issues and then your answer too the issues you brought up is, "well, its just a saturday serial. dont take it too serious."

    so again, he tried to have it both ways.

    as for Luke being in a better position because he is older: if Yoda and Obi-wan had not changed their ways from the PT, they would never have trained Luke cause they would consider him far too old. they thought anakin was too old. Its a change in mindset, mostly due to Qui-Gon
     
  2. Shelley

    Shelley Jedi Youngling star 5

    Registered:
    Sep 9, 2001
    But where did it say he would become the most powerful Jedi ever?

    They are popcorn flicks, but they also have the resonance of a modern myth. Besides which, they are different things to different people.

    What particular explanation did you want?

    Or, he wants to make simple and fun movies that are also modern myths, and he does that.

    As far as I know, the closest he's come to saying that is in reply to the people who treat the movies as scripture: "They're only movies." Yes, they have mythological/Biblical/philosophical resonance, but they're also based on serial adventures and cheesy sci-fi movies.

    I don't see how. The movies are a balance between the profound and the banal. Many people dismiss them as just cheesy kiddie movies, which is true in some sense, but they also have the resonance of modern myth and have various undercurrents running through them.

    They almost didn't. "He is too old. Yes, too old to begin training." Yoda was also reluctant to train him because he didn't have patience and was reckless.

    Somewhat, yes, but they didn't change their mindset THAT much. At least, Yoda didn't.
     
  3. -maynard-

    -maynard- Jedi Youngling star 3

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    Jun 1, 2005
     
  4. Shelley

    Shelley Jedi Youngling star 5

    Registered:
    Sep 9, 2001
    Or it just points to him being the one who will bring balance to the Force. Which he does, without becoming "the most powerful Jedi ever."

    What specifics am I supposed to get into? I asked you what particular explanation you wanted.

    In what sense?

    But you don't say how.

    Which are...?



    Although at first Yoda said, "He is too old to begin training." Besides which, they had little choice. They hid Anakin's kids from him to protect them, and basically waited until the Force made their paths cross again.

    I thought he always did. Qui Gon was a master -- he was Obi Wan's master.

    Which Obi Wan had already done when he became Qui Gon's apprentice, all those years ago.

    Also, does any of the above explain how the CW cartoons developed Anakin's character better?
     
  5. -maynard-

    -maynard- Jedi Youngling star 3

    Registered:
    Jun 1, 2005
    your asking me to write a paper here and are only responding with questions rather than opposing points. i cant possibly keep responding to, "what do you mean?" What is your proof?" just letting you know :)

    as for the non-questions:


    -maynard- posted:
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    the change comes in seeking to train those near at or near adulthood.
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    Although at first Yoda said, "He is too old to begin training." Besides which, they had little choice. They hid Anakin's kids from him to protect them, and basically waited until the Force made their paths cross again.

    Ben was watching over him the whole time and waited till he matured, rather than taking him as a boy like they would have in the PT

    -maynard- posted:
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    as for Yoda, he does change. he calls Qui-Gon master
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    I thought he always did. Qui Gon was a master -- he was Obi Wan's master.

    no, he refers to Qui-Gon as his(Yoda's) master and submits to Qui-Gon's teachings as a greater Jedi


    -maynard- posted:
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    and submit to his teachings (in deleted script)

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    Which Obi Wan had already done when he became Qui Gon's apprentice, all those years ago.

    i think that is half-true. he disagrees with Qui-Gon that he should listen to the council. What im saying is that, along with the Jedi purge, the order gets remade. the two survivors alter their preconceptions and views. they are far less arrogant and more trusting of the will of the Force. The most plausible explanation is Qui-Gon.

    Also, does any of the above explain how the CW cartoons developed Anakin's character better?

    nothing. but you asked for an exaple of a problem of the film relating to the higher issues and i got off on a tangent[face_tired]

     
  6. jedi_jacks

    jedi_jacks Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Jul 17, 2005
    veering off-course of the thread, but i cant resist

    -maynard- posted:
    as for Yoda, he does change. he calls Qui-Gon master


    it takes a great jedi, to call a lesser jedi master. very humble, unlike anakin with obi-wan. also, i thought QJ achieved his ability to communicate from anakins darkside emotions, not just from his own pure/lightside abilities. last, it is yoda and only yoda, who hears QJ, not anakin, the obvious intended reciever. yoda should not be underestimated, it was his ability which created the whole force ghost commune abiliity, i think. and, i also think, it is the ability to commune that counts, i think everyone becomes one with the force to a certain extent.

    ill get on track sometime over the weekend, i swear!

     
  7. Shelley

    Shelley Jedi Youngling star 5

    Registered:
    Sep 9, 2001
    I'm asking you to clarify.

    That's nice. I don't know what it has to do with anything, though.


    as for the non-questions: [/color]

    Ben sent Luke and himself into hiding, so the Emperor and Vader would not track them down. He waited until the Force guided them back together.

    OK, but what does that have to do with lack of character development in the PT?

    And he later apologizes for it, but Qui Gon reassures him.

    Possibly. It could also be that watching everything they ever worked for be destroyed, knowing that the Jedi Order had been decimated (as well as nearly being wiped out themselves), and that the Chosen One had turned to evil, humbled them considerably. They didn't want to make the same mistakes that the Jedi Order did, especially not with Anakin's children being their only hope for restoring the galaxy.
     
  8. -maynard-

    -maynard- Jedi Youngling star 3

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    Jun 1, 2005
     
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