Anakin, you idiot!

I don't think it was love as much as it was selfishness, and just being naive as well. The more I think about Anakin the more I scratch my head. He's got all this talent, and he gets in his own way every single time.

 

One thing is for certain, neither Anakin nor Padme understood true love - they never knew it, especially Anakin. But the more I watch the PT, the more I see Padme is going through many of the same trials as Anakin is - she falls for the same tempatations and traps until her entire life is a pillar of lies built on a shaky foundation.

I love how the OT heros, Luke and Leia, are able to redeem their parents. Luke and Leia had flaws, but their strengths definitely outweighed them.

Luke and Leia are like the anti-Anakin and anti-Padme respectively. They are both much more thoughtful and capable of endurence than their parents were.

 

One thing is for certain, neither Anakin nor Padme understood true love - they never knew it

Padme?, how so?. just curious.

 

Plus Luke and Leia kissed better than their parents... just all around better at everything


In all seriousness though, I agree with all that ETC.

 

The Padme angle is an interesting one I'll grant you, but IMO she gets off the hook a little too easily (but so does Anakin so what do I know). If she had denied her feelings in AOTC, most, if not all, of this would have been avoided. I know, I know, that's a wild wacky idea... to give up what you personally want for the sake of the galaxy, but it would have saved everyone a lot of grief.

 

Hi, DUGGY.

In my view, Padme's relationship to Anakin was purely driven by codependency. She knew Anakin was a troubled individual and that growing close to him was dangerous, but she allowed herself to become attached to him.

Padme was psychologically dependent in an unhealthy way to Anakin who was drawn to darkness (fear, anger, jealousy, pride) and was clearly on a self-destructive path.

She allowed herself to be controlled and manipulated by him and he ultimately destroyed her.

This is not true love at all. Both of them had mental issues that prevented them from experiencing true, unconditional love.

 

I'll definitely agree that she was Manipulated by him, But i always kinda saw her as the Level headed one. In AOTC she resisted the feelings they had, she tried to even talk Anakin out of it. and in ROTS i saw her as a Woman who really Just loved the guy and wanted to go away and leave it all behind and raise their baby. Anakin definitely had Mental Issues. but i always saw Padme as a Strong intelligent Character. although she does let her feelings get in the way of her judgement. But we all can do that.

Interesting take.

 

It's just that Anakin and Padme both wanted something different. They were never on the same page. The only thing they had in common was their lie. The only thing they had was the other's warm body.

Padme was a terrible enabler. She didn't understand the depth of Anakin's mental angst because he always lied to her. They couldn't communicate with one another at all. Their hopes and dreams were totally different. Their political ideals were on opposite ends of the spectrum.

Padme became Anakin's obsession when he was taken from Tatooine. She became more of a mother figure to him that he could run to and whine and complain. Padme needed a strong arm to rely on, a comforter, but instead she was always dealing with Anakin's mental issues.

I still think Padme was a victim in the relationship, but she was also an enabler and someone in denial of the threat. She wanted to believe Anakin was a good person, but she knew he was kind of a twisted, deranged, self-centered sociopath. She just didn't want to face reality.

You feel bad for Padme, but at the same time you have to see where she is partly responsible for Anakin's fall. Padme could have told Obi-Wan the truth - explained the warning signs, but she was too afraid.

Padme was afraid she would lose her position of authority as well. She had just as much to lose as Anakin, if not more.

 

EwokThatCried, important observations you have made given Padme's question to Anakin, "How long is it going to take for us to be honest with each other?" I think it would be fair to say the answer is until the end of their meeting on Mustafar.

 

Yeah, I just never got the impression that Lucas was writing a typical love story where the lovers share a pure bond but are torn apart by external forces, and fight to remian together, etc.

He's really showing a relationship that is entirely based on negative emotions and confused for love and devotion. It's really about attachment, fear, and shame.

 

They both have more baggage than Heathrow.

 

Yep, while drowning in that river in Egypt.


DarthDuckie - They both have more baggage than Heathrow.

 

You feel bad for Padme, but at the same time you have to see where she is partly responsible for Anakin's fall. Padme could have told Obi-Wan the truth - explained the warning signs, but she was too afraid.

Padme was afraid she would lose her position of authority as well. She had just as much to lose as Anakin, if not more.

Good points ETC but I think Padme told Anakin that the baby would change their lives and she would no longer be able to serve in the Senate. Nevertheless I think one of her mistakes was not allowing Anakin to go ahead and tell the council everything including the marriage even if it meant explusion. I admit Anakin wanting to no longer hide his marriage and just let things come out in the open was one of his smarter ideas and it was something he shouldve carried through on.

 

Padme's problem as I understand it from the AOTC novelization, is that she had spent so much of her life giving to others, that when Anakin came into her life again, she started to think of herself. Sola had meant well when she prodded Padme with the idea of thinking about herself for a change, but it backfired in the worst possible way. Because she was so set on personal happiness, that she started to do selfish things. These things put her in conflict with her own morals and values. The part that cares only about others vs caring about herself. The is best demonstrated when she's panic stricken about her pregnancy. That she could lose her job, Anakin could be kicked out of the Jedi Order and their lives would be put on public display for the media. Rather than do the mature thing, she opted to hide this knowledge from others. She wanted to keep things frozen in time, just as Anakin did. Only she didn't have the power to even attempt this, much less be tempted by the idea.

I think she knew true love. She just didn't know how to deal with Anakin and when she lost him, it was too much for her.

 

darth_sinister nailed it on the head with the point about Padme's responsibilities and selflessness throughout much of her life as an important pivot in her love for Anakin. She essentially had no childhood or time for herself-- becoming the Queen of her world at 14 and then immediately taking up Senate duties-- and Anakin gives those things back to her in a way, allowing her to be just "Padme" rather than a senator or former Queen.

And anyway, I don't believe that Padme or Anakin went into the marriage with their eyes closed to the consequences. The ending sequence of AOTC always conveyed to me that they somehow sensed they were going, wide-eyed, into a future of sadness and separation. The crucial point was that this ceased to matter anymore in the context of the failing Republic, the approaching War and the slow crumbling of their old world. Why shouldn't they have their short time in the sun? Padme says as much in her confession of love before the Geonosis arena. I think they did truly love each other but it was too late for them to find happiness by the time they come together-- Anakin's character, Palpatine's machinations and the instability of the galaxy had progressed too far.

Call me a hopeless romantic, I personally don't like to think that Anakin wreaked havoac on the galaxy and destroyed so many lives because of...someone he didn't "truly" love but was merely unhealthily dependent on. It just makes the whole thing so shabby and ....sad. It undermines the mythological grandeur of the Saga. I prefer to imagine that, though Anakin was very flawed and tragically misled, theirs was a deep and abiding passion that produced the two powerhouses we know as Luke and Leia who later save the galaxy.

 

How would the star wars saga have gone had Anakin killed palpatine and became ruler in episode III. How can he just become ruler he isn't a poliitian like palpatine was he was just a jedi.

 

I would certainly like to think so too, but isn't it sort of the point that had Anakin "truly" loved Padme - then he would never have gone down the path he did? That if he had truly loved her - that he would've listened to and respected her wishes?

To me, the sad thing isn't that it's not true love - the sad thing is that Anakin was never interested in her true love to begin with, and like Ewok pointed out, I think Padme realized this. All he really wanted of her was for her to agree with everything he said, to just know her place in his perfect little galaxy and to speak only when spoken too.

I mean, look at one example from RotS, she talks to him about the war and asks him if he could talk to Palpatine - and he gets angry and calls her a Seperatist. Padme, who's been anti-war ever since TPM, yet the mere notion that she doesn't agree with his ideals sends him into a hissyfit that leads him to mistrust her. It seems like he doesn't even really know her, which goes hand in hand with how disconnected from reality the boy has become.

- O_F

 

I find it amazing that people are bashing Queen ILTWTL for being anything other than a poorly realized character who lost the will to live. She certainly loved Anakin, she went to Mustafar in the hope that she could save him.

Anakin, on the other hand, let his love for Padme be warped by his own pride and arrogance, and more than anything else, sheer gullibility and idiocy.

 

Padmé makes it quite clear in AOTC that a relationship with Anakin is not something that could ever work. She explains why, and she explains that she is not going to allow them give in to their feelings for each other.
Okay, on one hand, you might observe that the fact that she eventually "went with her heart" and said to hell with it is terribly romantic.
Personally, I don't think that is the point though.
Padmé and Anakin both knew the dangers and both knew their relationship was something that was an impossibility.
Yet, still, they both allowed it to happen...

 

So rather than listening to her head, she trusted her feelings. Funny, I thought that was good advice.

 

"They're my friends. I've got to help them."
"You are reckless."
"You're going to find many of the truths you cling to depend greatly on your point of view..."

 

Maybe the real solution for Anakin and Luke is to ignore the jedi completely and call Albus "it is our choices that decide who we are" Dumbledore the next time they need some advice. Don't think he'd have a problem with shagging the hot queen.

 

No, she and Anakin both abandonded their principles, which is never a good idea and led to just about every mistake made in the PT.

 

And they put themeselves above their very important duties. Both were selfish.

 

Which principle did she abandon? She married the man she loved, and continued to serve in the senate and be a voice of caution against the powers being given Palpatine.