Lit Ancient Races: Celestials, Rakata, and Co

Discussion in 'Literature' started by Cronal, May 19, 2011.

  1. Todd the Jedi Mod and Inquisitor of SWTV

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    Also at the very end of the story, Luke theorizes that though they've defeated Abeloth and she appears to be completely destroyed for now, there's a good chance she could come back far into the future, so he orders a task force of Jedi to search for the Force-imbued sword on Mortis, which means they are looking for the monolith from TCW.
  2. Pelranius Force Ghost

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    Apr 25, 2003
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    With regards to the cephalods and saurians fighting that war between Abeloth and the Ones, did anyone else besides me think of the Gree and the Kwa?
  3. CeiranHarmony Force Ghost

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    May 10, 2004
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    I did ;)
  4. Cronal Force Ghost

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    On Abeloth's role sounds like she is almost like the Reapers from Mass Effect. [face_thinking]
  5. Aerevyn Jedi Knight

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    Oct 9, 2007
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    This is just speculation but it's still an interesting concept...

    What if the Celestials ARE the Force?

    The 'will of the Force' could actually be the will of an incorporeal race who used to be more directly involved in galactic events but for reasons unknown now are more distant, acting instead through others.
  6. Cronal Force Ghost

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    Dec 17, 2009
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    Doesn't the novel Darth Plagueis have that as a theory about the Celestials? That they are part of the Force and directing everything from it or something to that effect? This makes me curious how much future material will tackle the Celestials now.
  7. Dawud786 Force Ghost

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    Dec 28, 2006
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    I toyed with the idea of the Celestials actually being angelic beings who are emanations from the Force, perhaps exist as beings within the Living Force without corporeal form, back when they were first mentioned in Dark Nest. I still like that idea, and it helps to accord with the Ones on Mortis. Because I'm not entirely certain they are corporeal beings either. Though I like the idea that the Celestials/Ones brought together the various Force-sensitive beings on Tython to found the Jedi Order. They want to help make the people of the galaxy at large aware of the Force and its will. The Will of the Force isn't the collective will of these beings, but they are following the will of the Force themselves.

    Once I finish FOTJ Apocalypse I'll tackle this stuff in the Force thread.
  8. Lt.Cmdr.Thrawn The Another Saga & CT Manager

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    If I recall, this is essentially what the Force originally was in the early drafts of ANH.
  9. Dawud786 Force Ghost

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    Dec 28, 2006
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    It was called the Force of Others... but "Others" wasn't really defined in any way different than what we ended up with in A New Hope. And if The Father is a Celestial, he still talks about the will of the Force as if it is separate from him.
  10. CeiranHarmony Force Ghost

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    he also said he is dying and we know he did not age in millennia... so? he lies a lot too ;)

    and there still is the fact of the ancient 3000 year old jedi distress signal... why use an old one if they were not from that time and if there is no line of choosen ones every few 1000 years?
  11. Cronal Force Ghost

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    Dec 17, 2009
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    Sorry to bump this up again but some new news from TOR from some content posted online about the upcoming Patch 1.4 called Terror from Beyond.

    We get to see some actual Gree and their Hypergates. On top of that, a member of the Imperial Reclamation Service states that the Gree are eons older than the Rakata. So, on a time table, we see that the Gree built their civilization long before the Infinite Empire. Cool to see BioWare developing the Gree and making them quite... cool. Considering the Separatist Trident's are based on Gree designs, BioWare could model a Gree ship like a Mass Effect Reaper :p
  12. Sinrebirth SWC and EUC Forum Moderator

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    I just want the following:

    1. Tho Yor = Mortis monolith.

    2. Sidious caused the imbalance that was killing the Father.

    1 I can give or take. But 2 has to happen.

    Unless Sidious' imbalance causes the death of the Father we have two separate imbalances. Which just confuses me. Anakin can also only resolve one or the other.
  13. Zeta1127 Force Ghost

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    Sep 2, 2012
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    Mortis seems too mythological for Star Wars. I don't see purpose of this so called "Throne of Balance" and blaming Anakin for everything.
    Last edited by Zeta1127, Sep 18, 2012
  14. Adrian the Cool Jedi Master

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    Sep 3, 2012
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    It seems the Celestials have something to do with the Tho Yor, 'cause they and the Mortis monolith look very alike.
  15. Sinrebirth SWC and EUC Forum Moderator

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    No, it doesn't. If Sidious undoes the Father, then Anakin defeats the source of the imbalance... what follows is subsequent ripples. We can hardly blame Anakin for stopping Sidious but not stopping every other Sith threat from five millennia.
  16. Zeta1127 Force Ghost

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    Sep 2, 2012
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    I edit my original post, and I meant blaming Anakin for the sixty-years after the Mortis trilogy.
  17. Dr. Steve Brule Force Ghost

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    Sep 7, 2012
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    My main problem with the Mortis episodes is that they not only don't really mesh with what Lucas wrote in his own movies, they're contradicted within the episodes themselves.

    Anyway, I mentioned this in another thread but I thought it was worth mentioning here. I'm not a big fan of the Atlas establishing that essentially every world said to house an ancient civilization was said to be the Rakata. I just don't feel that it worked, especially in cases where the ancient civilization was clearly humanoid. I suppose it can be argued those ruins were made in the imagine of Rakatan slaves, but that also seems to be pushing it. Unless they were their own independent civilizations until the Rakata came in to destroy and enslave them.
  18. Ghost Chosen One

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    Oct 13, 2003
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    So, to recap what we know now from FOTJ... the "Celestials" were only 3 beings, and they're all dead by the time of ROTS... right?
  19. CeiranHarmony Force Ghost

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    May 10, 2004
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    nope.. Celestials = Many... three of them, the most prominent/influential were the Mortis Beings.. the ones who seem to care and intervene in the galaxy while others enjoy the netherworld parties. by time of ROTS, all are dead... but only two of them died by magic dagger... Son did by lightsaber.. so if that means final death? who knows
  20. Cronal Force Ghost

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    Dec 17, 2009
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    Well, I think its said that the Celestials are many and are part of the Force. The family from Mortis I believe are referred to as the Architects. What does that mean? No idea, I presume that the Ones serve as physical avatars in the material plane to enact the plans of the Celestials. Thats the way I see it.

    Also, old thread from the temp board: http://boards.theforce.net/xentemp/index.php?threads/elder-races-celestials-rakata-and-others.771/

    Only added that in because I think we all made some interesting points for discussion. Not sure if I should attempt to merge the content into this thread or not.
  21. Tim Battershell Force Ghost

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    Sep 3, 2012
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    So what about Abeloth's Planet - was it the original home of the Ones - or is it a copy?

    Ditto the Font and Pool etc?

    If the pool is an Abeloth-created fake, can anything seen in it be trusted?
    Zorrixor likes this.
  22. Cronal Force Ghost

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    Dec 17, 2009
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    An interesting question. Don't think it was ever answered so I think it was more likely it was a prison. If it was a home, then either the Ones wanted a place within the Maw where they would not be disturbed or... the Maw was created around their former home to contain Abeloth. As for the Font or Pool, that depends on whether the planet was a former home of the Ones or not. If its not, then that perhaps implies the Font and Pool are copies of the original.
  23. Adrian the Cool Jedi Master

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    Sep 3, 2012
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    The Maw was created by the Celestials using Centerpoint Station to imprison the Kiliks within it, because the Kiliks were a slave race of the Celestials and started a rebellion against them.
    Last edited by Adrian the Cool, Sep 19, 2012
  24. Zorrixor Chosen One

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    Sep 8, 2004
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    I took it as a copy personally, with the original the land in Mortis, which she was trying to replicate.

    Very interesting thought on whether that makes the visions in her replicas untrustworthy though... hadn't even thought of that. [face_thinking]
    Last edited by Zorrixor, Sep 19, 2012
  25. Cronal Force Ghost

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    Uh, I think you might be mistaken there. Its not the Killiks who were imprisoned. Rather, it was One-empowered Killiks that entrapped Abeloth and built Centerpoint Point to maintain her prison. The Killiks were presumably banished after that into the Unknown Regions by the Celestials... UnuThul said it was because the Celestials were angry over some action the nests had made whilst Luke speculated it was because it was because they were running amok after leaving Alderaan. Yet, The Old Republic MMO indicates the Killiks willingly embarked on their Great Migration from Alderaan where they separated into countless smaller nests after not being able to find a home for all their kind though some still remained on Alderaan.
    Last edited by Cronal, Sep 19, 2012