ST Andy Serkis (Supreme Leader Snoke) in the ST

With Snoke being over 7 foot tall and not human and Rax being human I don't see all this thinking that Rax is Snoke. The only way it would be possible is for Rax to literally turn into an alien from being possessed or something. I doubt they would go that far with the darkside. I am sure Snoke's original look wasn't so scary looking either years ago.

 

The audio book uses Snoke's voice when Rey is hearing that.

 

how do you know that? is andy serkis himself credited?

 

I think they use someone else other than Serkis for Snoke's voice for the book

Edit: Some people say the same guy does all the voices even the female ones for the audiobook but he does use the Snoke voice for that part.

 

so, really there is no proof?

 

About Snoke getting in Rey's head? I would take that as 90% + proof Snoke was doing it if that guy was told to use Snoke's voice for that part.

 

sorry, i was asking about proof of the voice. i really take voice-reading with a grain of salt usually unless there is some proof of this? so like proof it was intended to be snoke's voice... like if the same person read all the voices and snoke is evil and the voice in rey's head is evil... well, he could just use his "evil voice." see what i mean?

i mean this one thing (one line in an audiobook) yes? is what the whole argument that rey is being influenced by snoke hinges upon. so i just urge caution in voice interpretations... (set critical thinking to maximum)

 

Well I put it at 90% + and not 100% because of what you say but that guy could have easily done a generic evil voice if they asked him to instead of using Snoke's voice.

 

There is a third option, make him the "Kadann" a member of a non-Sith force-using movement that served as custodians of the Sith when necessary, who was also the only guy Palpatine did not consider a mere pawn, and co-planned the Empire with him, meaning the Empire would still continue as long as one of them lived.

But it probably should be one of those three options, or else it would be contrived and underwhelming.

 

I don't think Snoke should be outright a bigger badder threat than Palpatine. That takes away from Anakin, he really didn't do much if 30 years after he brought balance, an even worse guy showed up. I really hope they go with more character driven narrative than trying to one up the threat level from the past. That's a mistake that Legends EU post Jedi made a lot.

 

I agree that Snoke should be more of a character driven villain than just a kind of one dimensional video game power guy. But it's not an either/or choice, as we sometimes treat it here. The most important thing about Snoke is that he is sufficiently different from Palpatine and the Sith, and that this difference be a result of his inner motives and character. And on top of that, he could be uber powerful. That would be fine as long as he's distinct.

I don't agree that a more powerful character than Palpatine would say anything negative at all about Anakin. After all, he was never supposed to have been someone who would end all varieties of evil for all time and everywhere in the galaxy they may lurk.

If Anakin didn't even know who Snoke was, why would we blame him for not stopping him?

 

A lot of the conflict and the solution ultimately boiled down to Anakin's redemption, so not much can really be done to ruin it. Even if a million Palpatine clones came back, you can't take away from Anakin's redemption, because he died a good man.

But yes, a Kadann-type of character, more of a Palpatine peer than a Palpatine superior, who also has an easy-to-explain backstory that still provides a greater sense of saga, might be a better way to go. But let's see what Rian Johnson has to give to us, it might be awesome and it might make absolutely perfect sense!

...My chief concern is, Rian Johnson is allegedly making "some strange thing", which while might work for Snoke, raises new concerns. It sounds like that, as with more and more movies today, he will defenestrate even the slightest elements of hard science-fiction and take Star Wars into the purest fantasy direction possible. Sure Star Wars had a lot of fantasy elements in terms of tropes and at least half of what we knew about the Force (though the Force also reflected popular speculative 1960s psychic pseudoscience, which still adds up for a fantasy story), but it still had a lot of science fiction in the backdrop. Then the prequels came and hilariously reversed this, the hard science fiction lessoned all over except for ironically in the Force, and it was not even the most fitting hard sci-fi explanation (sure Midi-Chlorians aren't the worst explanation, but they sure aren't the best either), proving that putting something in space does not a sci-fi make. Now the Force will have more fantasy elements to it, as it probably should, but from what I'm gathering, so will the rest of the Universe, and the problem with that is, we have so many pure fantasies to choose from, to the point in which they are hardly special anymore ("oh look, another one"), and so few fantasy stories with a few strong elements of pure science fiction to support them, as was the case in A New Hope. This is Star Wars, not Har-Rey Potter.

 

I agree that the whole point of Anakin's story was his redemption. People often think he also needs to have ended evil for all time when that motive of needing to control everything was really what led him down the wrong path.

I don't think you have to worry too much about the entire SW storytelling-verse all becoming one single type of genre, like fantasy. For example, Rogue One was more of a war film, and the one shot films will give them the chance to focus on multiple genres. The Han Solo film may end up being a kind of space western with an emphasis on comedy.

So SW is a unique entity because it can offer a film like E8 that may be more fantasy oriented while then having a one shot film that is more hard sci fi. Overall, the universe will have a nice diversity of generic elements.

However, I do question whether SW has ever really been hard sci fi. I'm interested in how people specifically define that because I don't really see much of that at all in the OT. The OT was more fantasy and myth in space.

 

Oh definitely. I mean EP VII is kinda a Nostalgia Heavy Fan fare film

Rogue One is the War film with Sci-Fi elements but hints of fantasy in it.

Ep 8 will be fantasy heavy but also i think i title Noir (That's RJ's style) from what i hear

Han Solo will be a western

and Ep 9....Uh...Not sure to be honest.

 

This was in response to the woody harleson interview. But it confirmed what I suspected

https://twitter.com/pablohidalgo/status/823330391884898304

Kasdan had no clue who/what Plagueis is when asked that question at comic con, and JJ was covering for the awkward response.

 

Yep, the film writers don't know much about Legends or peripheral characters of the films. Pablo has said this numerous times.

Plagueis is both really: barely mentioned in the Saga and the book that made some fans fixate on him is Legends.

This is why using Legends to speculate about Snoke is unlikely to lead us anywhere; the odds of the ST connecting to it likely depends on the writers accidentally repeating something from it.

Legends is a good source for thinking over possibilities, but when people assume the writers are looking closely through it for something to do they're just misunderstanding the creative process.

 

agree. I had the same position as you on the Kasdan/writers but it's nice to finally get a solid confirmation.

Considering "Darth Vegas" has been used to "bolster" Plagueis = Snoke theories ranging from these forums to Collider Jedi Council, I wonder can we finally send Plagueis to the trash compactor thread?

 

I wish. It would allow the thread to focus on other possibilities.

But I think many Plagueis fans would interpret Snoke saying he's not Plagueis as a hint that he's Plagueis.

For them, Yes means Yes and No means Yes.

 

JJ lying about Khan is what keeps the thought alive for a few fans still. Maybe someone can ask the new director about it and it would 100% bury the subject finally.

 

See, I took Kasdan's response completely different from you. To me, it sounded like Daisy started to say "is that Sn...." then Kasdan cut her off with the "who is that? Who is Darth Vegas?" and it sounded like he was being sarcastic and pretending to have no idea who Plagueis is, and that's when J.J. jumped in because Kasdan was laying it on the play dumb act way too thick.

Do you really think someone as immersed in Star Wars as Kasdan is would have no clue who Darth Plagueis is? These guys do this stuff for a living and have studied, at least the main trilogies, to the point where they can almost recite these movies. You don't just write an installment movie without knowing everything there is to know about the other movies.

 

If Snoke's identity is not clearly explained in episode VIII, the Plagueis speculation will endure until at least episode IX, whatever the director or the film crew say about it.

That's what happens when you create an out of nowhere vilain that looks like a living dead uber emperor, I'm afraid.

 

I just had a theory about Snoke, based on a line Han says to Kylo: "He's using you for your power" (or something to that effect).

What if Snoke's increase in power is tied to the decrease in the number of other Force users? Everytime a Force user is killed, he grows stronger.

So, here's my theoretical history of Snoke. Again, take it for what it's worth:

1000 BBY: The Sith are defeated, and reduced to the Rule of Two. Snoke's power begins to increase (assuming he is an ancient being).
19 BBY: Order 66 is issued, and the Jedi are almost completely wiped out. Snoke's power increases even further.
4 ABY: Vader's redemption and his overthrow of Palpatine increases Snoke's power even more.
Between ROTJ and TFA: The Knights of Ren are around; Kylo joins them; Luke begins training a new Jedi Order; Snoke's power decreases or remains the same.
Still between ROTJ and TFA: Kylo and the Knights of Ren wipe out the Jedi; Snoke's power increases.
Since Kylo is the only Knight of Ren we've seen, what if Luke also defeated the Knights, around the time he goes into exile? Snoke's power increases even further.

Once Snoke is sure Skywalker is dead, he will take Kylo's power for himself, almost ensuring large amounts of power.

As I said, this is a theory, based only on Han's line. But this would be different than your typical Sith: a dark side being who uses the deaths of Force users to increase his power, to grow stronger. It would be akin to Kueller in the Legends novel, The New Rebellion.

 

And if he is declared as Plagueis in 8 people will speculate how the story needs to turn in 9 so that he is not Plagueis

 

Like Snoke is trying to monopolize the Force?

 

That's a good way to put it.