Lit Any books on Darth Nilhus?

Discussion in 'Literature' started by LordThrawnStark, Mar 11, 2013.

  1. Iron_lord Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    That would be Palpatine again- after listing all the problems with choosing an apprentice who's very good at one thing.
    Last edited by Iron_lord, Mar 17, 2013
  2. Iron_lord Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    For those that are interested, the full quote is on pages 168-169 of Jedi vs Sith: The Essential Guide to the Force: (Palpatine's additions to the Telos Holocron)

    Choose someone as a successor and you will inevitably be succeeded.

    Choose someone hungrier and you will be devoured.

    Choose someone quicker and you won't dodge the blade at your back.

    Choose someone with more patience and you won't block the blade at your throat.

    Choose someone more devious and you'll hold the blade that kills you.

    Choose someone more clever and you'll never know your end.

    Despite these cautions, an apprentice is essential. A Master without an apprentice is a Master of nothing.
  3. Darth_Pevra Chosen One

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2008
    star 5
    Anything that would benefit the Sith order itself would impress me. New inventions that make them stronger, a permanent rise in power, that kind of thing. Something constructive. Just destroying something while destroying yourself is a very hollow victory, especially if your plan is to rule forever. Kaan at least tried to do something constructive. He failed, yes, but so did the Banites.

    Freedom? That which the Sith order is all about, what's at the heart of their philosophy. I said before: Banites didn't have any personal freedom. Whatever they did, they always had to hide their true nature. All that wealth and power don't matter as long as you still wear "the chains".

    Palpatine made many strategic blunders in the movies. The trap at Endor is an example, using the DS another. The destruction of Alderaan was what drove many into the arms of the Rebellion. His master taught him subterfuge and manipulation but not how to rule.


    Exactly. If you don't care about RoT, you are no Banite anymore. Palpatine clearly didn't care for the RoT.
  4. Iron_lord Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    His Master was a businessman, not a ruler- and couldn't be expected to know, either.

    He cared about it (thus, talking about it in the Telos Holocron- and painting it as the Right Way)- however, he might have changed his views over time.
  5. Sable_Hart Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 28, 2009
    star 4
    Sidious didn't break the Rule of Two. Lumiya was an Emperor's Hand imparted by Vader with some Sith knowledge; Vergere was a candidate for Sith training after/during Dooku's discipleship.

    Because it's twenty years and another half-galaxy more than any other Sith before them ever ruled. You can argue all you like that the success of the Banites was paltry in comparison to the extent of their efforts and I'd agree; but it really comes down to comparing some measure of total success versus none at all. Some > none.

    The ones we know of (Bane, Zannah, Vectivus, Tenebrous, Plagueis, and Sidious) were all fabulously rich and successful. I think you're conflating concealing Sith heritage with hiding in a cave or swamp on some unknown world.

    ...I honestly don't see how. They barely had any personal freedom to do what? Going out, arousing the attention of the Jedi and the Republic and being promptly beaten into submission (or worse, extinction) like their predecessors?

    More importantly, you seem perceive the Rule of Two as being some sort of mystical compulsion driving Sith Lords against their will to an undesirable goal. The Sith before Palpatine could have, at any time, chosen to do away with the Rule of Two and apply patented ancient Sith tactics of RAWR SMASH and LOL CHARGE at the moment of ascent. If their Master prevented them from doing that, the solution is obvious: Kill your Master, like Bane wants you to. Then, you make the rules. They didn't, and with good reason: They weren't stupid.



    You're certainly welcome to your opinion; I personally disagree. But as for my argument? I've already presented it. Pre-Rule of Two? Constant, endless failure for millennium after millennium after millennium. Rule of Two? Unprecedented success for two decades. The bottom, irrefutable line is that Bane's way achieved results.
    Last edited by Sable_Hart, Mar 17, 2013
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  6. Darth_Pevra Chosen One

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2008
    star 5
    Lets just agree to disagree about the usefulness of the RoT.

    Sidious broke the RoT himself when he took Maul as an apprentice. Plagueis was still alive during TPM.
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  7. Sable_Hart Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 28, 2009
    star 4
    That's cool.

    Maul ostensibly occupied a role a la Ventress/Savage/Lumiya/Vergere, etc. Remember, Sidious informed Plagueis and Plagueis approved.
  8. Iron_lord Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    And Plagueis had told him the Rule of Two was obsolete, before that.

    In Darth Plagueis, in Palpatine's speech to Plagueis while killing him, he says:

    "Plagueis the Wise, who in his time truly was, except at the end, trusting that the Rule of Two had been superseded, and failed to realize he would not be excused from it."
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  9. Darth_Pevra Chosen One

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2008
    star 5
    Maul is proven to be Sith by multiple sources like Star Wars Episode 1 Journal for instance. Calling Maul a non-Sith at that time would be a retcon of TPM anyway and I don't like that kind of thing (retconning the movies) much.
    Last edited by Darth_Pevra, Mar 17, 2013
  10. Chewbacca89 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 25, 2012
    star 5
    Would Ableloth be able to take these guys out?
  11. Iron_lord Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    Him being introduced as Darth Maul springs to mind.

    However- a case could be made that he was never thought of by Plagueis or Palpatine as an Apprentice- a potential successor- only as an Agent- someone to be trained only in what he needs to know to fill his role. That said- he can be allowed to think of himself as a future successor.
  12. Darth_Pevra Chosen One

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2008
    star 5
    You can find some logic loophole for everything.

    Probably not Nihilus. Nihilus is like a black hole and can only be taken out by another black hole (the Jedi Exile). Abeloth would be an irresistible attraction to him and Nihilus would simply swallow it, force-god or not.

    I also have the personal theory that maybe Nihilus can be killed by a simple blaster or a rock.
    Last edited by Darth_Pevra, Mar 17, 2013
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  13. _Catherine_ Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 16, 2007
    star 4
    I'm pretty sure I stabbed him to death in the game but idg how that works if he was just a ghost wearing an empty suit of armor.
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  14. Chewbacca89 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 25, 2012
    star 5
    Perhaps the sword you used to stab him was also a ghost?
  15. _Catherine_ Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 16, 2007
    star 4
    Quick, post that in the L-Canon thread.
  16. Arawn_Fenn Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 2004
    star 7
    I would agree in Plagueis' case but not in the case of Palpatine. When Palpatine killed Plagueis he did not intend for Maul to be killed on Naboo. Thus, if Maul had survived, it seems that Palpatine and Maul would have gone forward as the "official" two Sith.
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  17. JevanShevu Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 20, 2009
    star 1
    I'm not the biggest Sith Era fan, and i haven't played the KoTOR games, but who is Darth Nilhus? Is he Apprentice to the Malak Sith Lord (i think thats who the villain in the one game was)
    Last edited by JevanShevu, Mar 17, 2013
  18. _Catherine_ Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 16, 2007
    star 4
    Malak's the bad guy in the first game, Nihilus is one of three in the sequel. He looks kind of like a panda bear.

    [IMG]
  19. JevanShevu Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 20, 2009
    star 1
    He looks kind of cool. I like the mask.
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  20. Zorrixor Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 8, 2004
    star 6
    Like Duros, however, Nihilus has no nose, so that concept art, does it contradict the EU.
  21. instantdeath Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 22, 2010
    star 5
    While you can argue whether or not Sidious actually broke the Rule of Two, he certainly bent it in every conceivable direction. Perhaps that's the way it should be.

    Also, when I was a kid I thought Nihilus and the killer from Scream were one in the same.
    Last edited by instantdeath, Mar 18, 2013
  22. Iron_lord Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    Yup- for him, rules are his servant, not his boss.
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  23. darthzac14 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 8, 2012
    star 3
    James Luceno said in an interview on Facebook that Darth Bane would not have approved of Sidious' methods and not adhering to the Rule of Two.
  24. JevanShevu Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 20, 2009
    star 1
    How did Sidious break the Rule of Two?
  25. darthzac14 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 8, 2012
    star 3
    Just the fact he was trying to become immortal and rule the galaxy himself. I know Bane was going to try the same thing, but Sidious was much more serious about it and after being resurrected Palps didn't take another apprentice