AOTC Chapter 5: Old Friends DISCUSSION

Discussion in 'Prequel Trilogy' started by Moleman1138, Sep 8, 2004.

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  1. Moleman1138 Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Aug 18, 2004
    star 6
    Until the release of ROTS on 5/19/05, I would like to discuss AOTC chapter by chapter on the DVD. There are 47 chapters to discuss over the next 8 months, excluding Chapter 1: Opening Logos, Chapter 2: Attack of the Clones and Chapter 50: End Credits.

    Each discussion will last 5 days. At the end of 5 days, the following chapter will be posted.

    Chapter 5: Old Friends
    DISCUSSION: September 8, 2004 - September 12, 2004
    DVD TIME INDEX: 7:00 - 10:28

    The film continues outside Padme Amidala's apartment. Obi-Wan Kenobi and his padawan Anakin Skywalker are in a clear turbolift. Anakin is nervous and Obi-Wan senses it. Anakin explains that this is the first time that he has seen Padme since the Battle of Naboo, ten year ago. The turbolift stops. The Jedi are greeted by Representative Jar-Jar Binks. Jar-Jar tells Padme that the Jedi have arrived. Padme welcomes them. Captain Typho shows his gratitude for the Jedi's inovlvement. They sit down and Padme tells the Jedi that she wants to know who the assassin is. Moment later, Anakin and Obi-Wan get into a heated discussion about Jedi mandates and security. Padme steps in the discussion and states that she believes the assassin will reveal themselves again. She leaves the room. Anakin speaks to Jar-Jar about Padme almost forgetting him. Obi-Wan assures Anakin that she did seem pleased to see them. Obi-Wan heads to check on the security. END OF CHAPTER

    Another scene of exposition. I like Padme's apartment. The colors contrast Palpatine's office wonderfully. The color imagery between these two individuals elaborates upon their character very well. It is good that most of this set was built against green screen.

    This was the perfect scene to reintroduce the main characters to one another again. There are so many character traits fleshed out in this scene. Anakin is the youthful, defiant apprentice. Obi-Wan is mannered teacher. Padme is still very political but still has that innocence from The Phantom Menace. Replacing Panaka with Typho and Sabe with Dorme were tricky, but I think both improved on their predecessors. I love the semi-heated discussion between Anakin and Obi-Wan. Shows already a wedge being driven between master and apprentice

    Then there is our good friend Jar-Jar. I love that silent Breaking the Fourth Wall before telling Anakin "This is the happiest she's been in a long time." In my mind it's like Jar-Jar's saying "I'm back, You can't get rid of me." I think the greeting was over done. I mean Jar-Jar was with Qui-Gon more than Obi-Wan. How can he be that excited. That was just over doing it in my opinion.

    Another good scene. Having four exposition scenes in a row in difficult for an action movie, but the anticipation for the next action sequence is worth a few extra minutes.
  2. GRAND_MOFF_KEVIN Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 4, 2004
    star 5
    I thoguth this scence showed Obi-Wan and Anakin on healthier terms.
  3. SLAVE2 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Apr 6, 2000
    star 5
    I have a confession to make about this scene, while I do love AOTC, and think Natalie Portman has done a great job in both prequels, I absolutely hate the line "Oh Annie, you'll always be that little boy I knew on Tatooine." Argh! I either mute the tv while she says it or cover my ears [face_laugh] Other than that, I do like the scene, my favourite part about it is the small bit of music you can hear as Jar Jar is approaching the door to welcome Anakin and Obi-Wan, makes Jar Jar's first appearance back even better.
  4. MatthewZ Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 21, 2003
    star 4
    I like how Obi-Wan give Anakin the "young one" bit.

    Anakin gives it back to Luke in ESB.
  5. Tatooine_Fireman Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    May 16, 2003
    star 4
    I think it was a good idea of GL to add that scene with Obi-Wan and Anakin the turbolift. The scene is acted very good, and gives me the impression that they really are good friends.

    I also loved to see Jar Jar again, and especially the whole "Obi? Obiiiiii!!" thing. :D

    People say that Anakin and Padme's reunion is a painful scene to watch, but I love it. Anakin tries to play it cool to Padme with his "So have you, far more beautiful I mean...". Then he realizes he talked himself in a corner even more, and tries to "fix" it with "...for a Senator I mean."
    This bit is written well, and played well, and it shows how unexperienced Anakin is around the women.
    I also love the eyerolling of Obi-Wan and Typho. :)

    I love Padme's apartment, very stylish and great colors. I also love her outfit in that scene, it's my second favorite of her AOTC outfits.

  6. earlchinna Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 17, 2004
    star 2
    i agree, the apartments are beautiful, and I like how obi-wan seems upset when anakin says "...far more beautiful" line, whereas typho seems more to find it laughable! I think there are lots a acting details like that in star wars, little facials expressions very discreet and well done
  7. HL&S Magistrate Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Oct 30, 2001
    star 7
    It was good to see a sequence where Anakin and Obi-Wan actually seem like friends. I mean in TPM Obi-Wan was not pleased with Anakins presence. Now we open their AOTC debut with a light hearted sequence. But soon it turns ugly. Perhaps too soon. They looked hostile to each other when they disagreed. Like their discontent for each other wasn't anything new.

    Anyways the apartment itself was nice. Great colors and such. Perhaps too many windows for a Senator who has had assassination attempts on her. In fact, why does she start the scene out standing on the balcony? :p

    Jar Jar returning to his old self when Obi comes up is consistent, but gives the audience bad memories of TPM. Well most of them. My theater audience groaned when they saw him. :p

    Natalie Portman's delivery of lines felt like nails on a chalk board. It was so stiff. It also felt odd that Natalie Portman's character was trying to act all old and wise when she only has 5 years on Anakin.

    But the scene ended nice with Obi and Jar Jar telling Anakin that Padme was pleased to see them despite her cold antics.

    The music brought back Anakins theme and a sad sort of melody at the end of the sequence. But once again it was muted.

    P.S. The shot of Padme on the balcony looks ten times better on digital screen than on film.
  8. Aiwendil Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Jun 1, 2002
    star 1
    I love the elevator scene. It's not awe-inspiring or suspenseful or beautiful, but it's perfect in its own way; the dialogue, acting, music, and composition all come together perfectly. It was this scene that, on my first viewing of AotC, really made me begin to love the movie. The friendly banter between Anakin and Obi-Wan instantly defines their relationship at the start of the movie - GL was quite correct in thinking that without such a scene, they come across too antagonistically from the start.

    Much of what's good in that scene carries over into the scene in Padme's apartment. There are some weak lines - the aforementioned "You'll always be that little boy I knew on Tatooine" among them. I also think that Padme's "Perhaps with merely your presence the mysteries surrounding this plot will be revealed" is a bit weak (apologies if I didn't get that one exactly right from memory). But on the whole the scene works very well. Hayden Christensen struck me as being perfect as Anakin right from the start - here he gives us flashes of boyishness that make him believable as an older Jake Lloyd as well as moments of darkness. I like his measured and precise speech - "I meant that in the interest of protecting her, master, of course" or "investigation is implied in our mandate".
  9. Eighty-Six Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Jul 18, 2004
    I love Anakin's awkwardness. I like that it's in there just enough to give some depth, but doesn't hold up the story or get too whiny. The portrayal is surprisingly realistic, which I'm sure some of us can attest to. Maybe that's why some people really hate AOTC's dialogue, it hits too close to home. :)

    (I'm not trying to start a war, just joking around.)
  10. ThrawnRocks Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 10, 2004
    star 6
    I think that GL did a great job on this scene, esp the little lesson/scolding that Obi gave Ani. It made me feel as embaressed as the characters seemed to be.
  11. Holy_Bum Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Aug 1, 2004
    I think this was a poorly done scene for the following reasons:

    1.) The Anakin/Obi-Wan discussion in the elevator was so dumb. The first time I heard it, I said "wth?!?!?!". Nest of gundarks? Nightmare? Fell? What is that dialogue supposed to mean? Why did they put it there? If they wanted to show Anakin's arrogance, there are many ways to do it, without resorting to incredibly cheesy dialogue. The way Obi-Wan says "oh...yes" makes me want to chuck the dvd remote into the wall in anguish.

    2.) Anakin and Padme confrontation. "So have you, grown more beautiful I mean." I'm not a girl, but I know if a girl said something like that to me, I'd have a much bigger reaction than Padme. And Obi-Wan, Typho, Binks, none of them even look as if they heard Anakin say that line. They just stand there looking dumb, while Anakin delivers a line that should most likely shock the crap out of Obi-Wan, give some kind of reaction from Binks, and a much bigger reaction from Padme, one of maybe confusion, then disbelief, then she would ignore it and move on.

    3.) I cringe when Anakin begins his "We will find out who's trying to kill you Padme.." line. my whole family cringes. Heck, the whole audience groaned when I watched it in theaters. I don't know what it is, but it sounds so hollow, and monotonous, no expression.

    4.) Natalie's acting in general. When I first saw this scene, I was wondering, what happened to the TPM natalie? She was brilliant as the Queen in that movie. What happened to her deep voice, her authority, her presense? Its completely gone in this movie. Instead of the bold Queen from the first movie, we see a timid senator in this. Sometimes it makes me question whether Natalie really did play the Queen in TPM. She seems so different in AOTC.

    don't get me wrong, I love this movie, but this scene annoys me so much. I always forward past this scene when I'm watching, because I can't stand the horrible writing, acting, directing. The good part of this scene was the visual effects, and the background colors, like always.
  12. Viceroy_Wagar Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 26, 2004
    star 1
    i liked the scene but i liked the previous chapter better...
  13. Motee Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 16, 2003
    star 4
    This was a good scene that remained close to the original scriptment. The only thing missing is diplodialect. :(

    I liek Jar Jar and I liked his character development between the two movies. I also liked Amidala'sgreeting to Obi-Wan "It's been far too long."

    Personally, the thing that made this scene was Typho. Some of the looks he gives are classic. :D
  14. Darth-Kevin-Thomas Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 27, 2002
    star 5
    i loved this part from the movie becuase it was so cool to catch up with ob1 and anakin between the two movies.

    the dialoge between ob1 and anakin is great and the apartment looks awsome as well.

  15. Moleman1138 Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Aug 18, 2004
    star 6
    Thank you for all your participation in CBC (Chapter by Chapter). AOTC Chapter 5: Old Friends DISCUSSION will be made available 6:30 AM EST. Although the discussion timeframe has passed, you may still discuss this chapter at your convienience. However, we will be moving on to the next chapter.

  16. jariten Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Jul 23, 2000
    star 4
    right, just time for one more then?!

    although I do like the elevator scene, after repeated viewings i wish Lucas had used the opportunity to show that not only did these 2 characters have life before AotC, but that theres actually some friendship and warmth there. although this was expressed a little, for all their subsequent scenes, they are at each others throats. it wouldve been better to have them joking avout something, something that doesnt relate to Anakin always trying to outdo his master, or give him backchat etc.
  17. DarthyMarkyMark Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Nov 6, 2003
    star 4
    I love the way Hayden plays Anakin - linking Jake Lloyd with Darth Vader isn't easy, but he does it really well. There are flashes where you see Lloyd's innocence, but also, Hayden's whole mannerisms and the way he speaks are very Vader-ish. You can see that his accent or voice doesn't really change when he puts that mask on, it's really just deepened.

    Also, I think the animation on Jar Jar is a huge improvement on TPM - you can see how much the technology has developed between films on characters like Jar Jar and Watto. I love Jar Jar's reaction when there's a very tense pause as Anakin questions Obi-Wan's judgement.
  18. The_Nameless_One Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Apr 21, 2002
    star 4
    I love the whole "reunion" feel to the scene - Binks is back ;)
  19. solojones Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 27, 2000
    star 9
    I am glad for the added elevator scene, because it lets us know that, when they're not talking about 'business', Obi-Wan and Anakin can be quite friendly with one another.

    I never understood the complaints about how their relationship is portrayed in AotC. To me, they come across as friends but also has a father/son pair. And honestly, at that age, and with the problems Anakin has, and with the age difference between them being too little, and with Obi-Wan being too strict, why would their relationship be any different? I thought it was meant to show that Anakin is getting to that upper teens, "I'm an adult, dammit" (when he's really not) era. Don't most people go through that? He should certainly be far from the exception.

    This is our introduction to Hayden as Anakin and I personally think it's great. We get to see how his skills have made him confident, but how when he actually has to confront the woman he has a crush on, he has a total :oops: moment. I love his awkwardness because it reminds me of Luke's aw-shucks, doe-eyed awkwardness at the beginning of ANH. And yet he also shows a more intense edge which is appropriate for the character.

    Possibly one of my favourite moments in the SW Saga is:

    ANAKIN: Why?
    OBI-WAN: What?!

    [face_laugh] Anakin tries to BS his way out of it, Obi-Wan is clearly really pissed off, but the best is everyone else in the room. All the little cuts to them just let you know they're all thinking, "Aaaawk-ward :)"

    -sj loves kevin spacey
  20. Hades2021 Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    May 29, 2003
    star 4
    When I first saw this in theaters, I was like, "NOOOO! Jar Jar has LINES!" Lol

    I think it was a good scene. No problems.
  21. royalguard96 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Aug 13, 2001
    star 5
    For anyone who says those late pick-up scenes are useless, this chapter blows thattheory to bits.

    The bit with Anakin and Obi-Wan in the elevator was an essential introduction to their relationship. One minute they are chuckling with each other, the next they are at extreme odds. The relationship needs to have that complexity to make Anakin's fall seem that much more sad.

    Padme's line to Anakin about still being a little boy is something a lot of us guys can relate to. Seeing a girl we are crazy for, only to have her cut you down to nothing with one smiling comment.
  22. Guinastasia Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 9, 2002
    star 6
    I also liked the elevator scene, and it's a good one to point out to people who insist that Obi-Wan and Anakin HATE one another.

    They don't-they're as close as brothers, but like brothers, they constantly get on each other's nerves. Didn't someone from the film say they're like two friends who spend too much time together?

    And solojones has a good point-they are too close in age for Obi-Wan to be an authority figure to Anakin, at least a surrogate father.
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