AOTC: Oscar nominations

"And have patience"

LOL,that's something that I have been lacking lately.

Just saw the Oscar nominations and figured I'd head in with my own two sense.

I'm disappointed that Attack of the Clones got robbed in both Music (Score) and Costumes. Though neither had much chance at winning, it would have been nice had they at least been nominated.

I'm a bit disappointed it didn't at least get a nomination in cinematography, but since Road to Perdition & Chicago are on there I can't complain too much.

However, if Perdition doesn't win....*shakes fist*

I am however, quite pleased it got a nod in Visual Effects. Though I think TTT will take it (Gollum will no doubt overshadow the beautiful effects that go into turning Star Wars into a universe far far away), it's an honor just to be nominated, ne?

However, better TTT winning than Spider-Man, IMO. Not anything against Spider-Man, but those effects were dated, lousy, and quite frankly, horrid compared to the other nominees. It's one of the films that, frankly, I don't think should have even be considered for a nomination.

One thing that doesn't make sense to me at all is how TTT could get nominated for best sound. Both times I saw it (in different threaters), the sound was muffled and hard to understand. Considering I'd be going to both theaters for years and had never had a problem of that nature, I'm thinking it's in the sound mix.

Though I'm a big LOTR fan, I have to admit I'm rooting against TTT this year. I thought it to be a horrid adaptation and a below average movie; The characterization was HORRIBLE (what the blazes is up with Faramir a.k.a. Borimir 2: Electric Boogaloo? And when did Treebeard become such a complete and utter twit?), with a couple exceptions (Christopher Lee, Ian McKellan, Andy Serkis) the acting was meh, the sound was muddled, and it was poorly edited-Storylines would be ignored for hours, only to be brought back at the most inappratune times later (merry, pippin, and the ents). Although I'm probably alone in thinking this, I have to say...I thought the battle scenes went on too long as well.

Also, what the heck is up with the ending? Cutting it out to add length to ROTK is understandable, but it's done so incompetently; the way it's done just makes it look like they ran out of film. Why not cut after Gandalf mentions the battle for middle earth just beginning and leaving Frodo, Gollum and Sam to open ROTK? Do they really expect audiences to remember Gollum's betrayal next year? (Especially with Peter Jackson fond of not using a couple minutes to sum up the film.)

As has been mentioned, AOTC didn't qualify for the Music award because not enough of its score was composed for the film; much of it, naturally, came from earlier SW movies. (It's a standard Academy rule, and this year it also applied to TTT.)

As for TTT's sound, I saw the film in two different theaters; one presentation, in an older theater, was somewhat muffled, while the other was quite good.

EDIT:

Check the previous page for a discussion of some of the points you've raised.

One thing that doesn't make sense to me at all is how TTT could get nominated for best sound. Both times I saw it (in different threaters), the sound was muffled and hard to understand. Considering I'd be going to both theaters for years and had never had a problem of that nature, I'm thinking it's in the sound mix.

AAARRRGGGHHHH!!!

You may have been the victom of blown speakers, a non-digital print of the film or a lousy projectionist who forgot to turn the digital decoder on.

It's happened to me many times, in a variety of prestigious NYC theatres (worst of all was the presentation of Apollo 13 at the Zeigfeld). It took one of the sound editors actually talking to the projectionist to make him turn the digital on!

My experiences with TTT were excellent, however, so I can't complain. Further, I can see why it got the nomination. I am still saddened that AOTC didn't get nominated in this category, as it is a great sounding film overall.

Nothing has as cool a sound as Star Wars. Everything else can be debated..well, the FX can't either, as quite a few shots in TTT looked pretty fake. The Ents looked no better than the Rancor in ROTJ. But that was done 20 years ago. TTT will win though. SW gets no respect from anybody.

I dont think the Oscars are about the movies anymore. I think it's come down to what the "people" want. The suits at the Academy have to look at their choices and see what we would like to have win. The winners have to pretain to the majority of the viewing audience. In my opinion AOTC will come out empty handed because it's not what's "happening" in this day and age, and it's not going to bring in the ratings.. The viewers want to see something new and fresh like LOTR win because most of them will tell you Star Wars is an age old idea.

Now I've seen one movie out of the six that's nominated for best movie. I'm not here to bash LOTR so please dont take this to heart, but who really thinks The Two Towers belongs in that catagory. Don't get me wrong. I'm quickly becoming a big fan of the LOTR, but most of the opinions I've heard about The Two Towers was that "it was too long", and most of the time people couldn't tell what they were talking about. Anyway, just wanted to let loose a few points here. They don't really matter, so... bring on the Oscars.

I am really amazed that fans of the LOTR series thought TTT was a worse movie than the first movie. I liked the first movie it was good but...........I found it too long I looked at my watch 3 times not a good sign.

TTT flowed way better to me had better special effects, never looked at my watch once.

As for the Oscars whatever I don't care, not enough people in that industry like SW so it will lose.

The Razzies for worst picture still bugs more than anything else.........John Wilson (Founder of the RAZZIES)Vader is coming for you in the night

i advise that you all go to the academy awards website and see the winners from previous years..and you will find that all,I mean all the movies that win are dramatic. either someone died..or cried..basically what you call a chick flick always wins the oscar for all categories. i went back and i never ever seen a sci-fi film win best picture..ever! or best supportings actor or actress..remember the original star wars lost...all star wars movies have been considered crap..according to the queers at the academy.

Then what sci-fi movie in the past would you have honestly chosen as Best Picture? Give me some examples.

If you say Fifth Element...

Well it's a maximum of 5 nominations per category, not 6. Some categories get onkly 3, like VFX, Sound Editing and Makeup, which only had 2 this year which is a complete disgrace.

As far as TTT, I liked it but I'll tell you what my main complaint is, which is shared by some people. TTT was mostly and action film. Characterization was minimal, except probably some of the new secondary ones. I mean it might be good to have Gimli be the comic relief now and then, but not constantly liked it seemed this time. It seemed much more like a popcorn movie not much unlibe AOTC as opposed to the first where the story and characterization were more developed, albeit a slower pacing some people don't like. From a moer purist viwpoint, The Fellowship basicly just simplified and tightened the story from that part of the book, but Two Towers, not only were the cuts more massive but also they added a lot of extraenous story, especially the bit with the Wargs attack and Aragorn's fall into the river and subplot. Some points were even rather baffling. How come it takes more time for Gandalf to find the riders right there in Rohan, than it takes the Elves to not only travel from much farther away, but how did they know Aragorn was at Helm's Deep in the first place. The message seemed a bit mixed, you have the Elves leaving, even after Elrond speech, have Arwen "leave" to create the love triangle, and then just pull out the telepathy thing to have at the last moment send the Elf archers. Of course people caught in the action might miss this big questions. I enjoyed it for what it was though I preferred the first one.

As far as scifi films, well duh, most scifi films are action or horror stories with no story or character development. A Best Picture should say something about human nature, or society or history. It should have a grander meaning. Thta's why dramas win. And I wouldn't consider a lot of past winners chick flicks. What about Gangs of New York and the Pianist this year. What about grand epics like The Last Emperor, Ghandi, Dances with Wolves, Schindler's List, Platoon, The Godfather, Patton, The French Connection, Ben Hur and Lawrence of Arabia. Not what I would consider "chick flicks".

While I think Clones is weak, I do think that it deserves the award for FX and it SHOULD have been nominated and should win for sound and sound editing. I'm sorry...to compare AOTC's sound effects to something like TTT or SM is like comparing the sound a tidal wave makes to a sound that a person who is mute makes. Really. The other 2 movies sound and its effects/editing is not impressive or ambitious at all. Its very simple.

And I do think that TPM deserved those 2 awards in addition to costumes, makeup, and even musical score (at least a nom due to the fantastic DOTF track. Sheesh.)

darthbane i think you are weak!

this is from yahoo news. and i think it supports my chick flick..comment.

By Jill Serjeant

LOS ANGELES (Reuters) - And the winner is... women. Whoever takes home those coveted golden statuettes next month, it's been a memorable year at the movies for females, producing a bumper crop of performances from ladies with more on their minds than little men called Oscar.


Reuters Photo



In a town where glamour still reigns and actresses frequently lament the dearth of decent roles for those over 35, Hollywood on Tuesday nominated one of the strongest, most complex group of female performers seen at the Oscars (news - web sites) for years.


"These are not big hambone dramatic roles. These are really psychologically complicated parts that delve into the souls and hearts of these women. What's so terrific this year is that we've got so many of them," said Oscar pundit Tom O'Neil.

I am wondering...

Are people angry that a SW film wasn't nominated or are they angry that a George Lucas film wasn't nominated?

GL has worked on things other than SW, Indiana Jones (Natch ), Howard the Duck, Tucker: A Man & His Dream, Willow, etc.

Were you just as angry when those films didn't earn Academy nominations or awards?

Personally, I don't think AOTC should have gotten anything more than effects and sound editing.

WHY?

Well, the costumes in TPM were much more elaborate than those in AOTC (I've seen them at Celebrations 1 & 2) and since the SW films have a lot of sounds that are based on or use the existing library of sounds why reward that?
AOTC used a lot of TPM sounds, speeders & Pod Racers are a awful lot alike, the biggest "new sound" was the sonic charge, but is it fair to nominate a film that probably has less ORIGINAL sounds than anything else that was released?

The score had a lot of music & cues from the previous films, not really as much new there either... why nominate that?

TPM had a better chance at more awards than AOTC going in!

The point I am making is if the Spider-Man people, the LOTR people, the Minority Report people, etc. created NEW and ORIGINAL sounds, effect, costumes, etc. why stop THEM from getting an award?
Would you like to lose to a film that did "recycle" elements, even though you had to create your own?

Be honest!

i wanna know the EXACT reason why StarWars barely ever gets nominations?

Then what sci-fi movie in the past would you have honestly chosen as Best Picture? Give me some examples.

ANH, ESB, ROTJ, Bladerunner, 2001: A Space Odyssey, Close Encounters of the 3rd Kind. I won't even bother mentioning TPM and AOTC because I know you'll simply dismiss the idea.

Let's see of that list... ANH was nominated for Best Picture.

2001 is a visionary film as are the others, but I would say Close Encounters before I could see any of the others winning...

2001 was a template for SW, in a way, so I would say IT would be more deserving that any of the SW films and quite honestly, I think based on the SW films we have, TESB was more worth than any of the others outside of ANH.
People complain that the Oscar go to the same "stuffy films", but do they deserve to go to sequels and "remakes"?
We are going to see more and more of those as time goes by, but if the sequels are "remakes" (honestly, most are... elements of ROTJ, TPM and AOTC are remaking parts of ANH and TESB.) do they deserve to win?

LOTR is in a different category, I HAVE NOT SEEN TTT, but by nature, I would assume that it isn't a "remake" of FOTR, the characters aren't going to be following the same journey, but a little bit different, again.

Another worthy one was E.T. It falls into sci-fi as much as SW does. I don't think it was nominated, was it?

I think that it is just as wrong to accuse the Academy of bias if you are biased for SW and NONE of GL's OTHER FILMS.

Example, RADIOLAND MURDERS used many of the same crew people as the PT has, same GL was involved, were you complaining that IT didn't get any awards?

What about Young Indiana Jones? Same people, same GL was involved. It won Emmys, but did it win enough?

ONE NOMINATION. What the hell???
Like some people have said it should have got nominated for the sound/sound editing. I think Ewan McGreggor should have been nominated for supporting actor.

Also i think for next year there has to be 2 new categories created Best Actor playing an animated character and best supporting actor playing an animated character. That way Frank Oz and Andy Serkis have a chance at the oscar they both deserve.

AOTC was an okay film but not oscar worthy in regards to best picture.

Visual Effects, sound, and maybe costumes were the only chances it had at snagging an oscar. Apparently the film industry only believes it was worthy of visual effects.

AOTC was in a terrible position all around. TPM really made it cool for people to hate and laugh at Star Wars. TPM production quality was better than AOTC, but the movie that didn't live up to the general publics hype really hurt the saga. AOTC is just paying the price for it. With a new saga like LOTR out now, people tend to think it is better than the prequels. Which they are in quality. It is cool to like LOTR. It's more mature than Star Wars.

AOTC not getting the number 1 movie of the year spot also didn't help it at the oscars. The oscars tend to hate sci-fi. But they can't ignore blockbusters. So they give there nods to SpiderMan and the 2nd part of a movie they nominated for best picture last year. Just to save face.

ROTK will get the same amount of nominations if not less than TTT. They gave it a nod, and now they think no more awards are needed. Same thing happened to the OT of Star Wars.


Now when Episode III comes around, depending on how George does it, the oscars and public might react less harshly. I mean think about. LOTR, SpiderMan, and the Matrix will all be out of the way. Episode III will come at a time when the main sci-fi films are done. So it'll probably be number 1 at the box office again. Then there's the hype. It will be the last Star Wars movie. It already promises to have a wonderful plot. Basically what everyone had been waiting for that TPM and AOTC delayed. The Academy will probably look more favorable upon it.

I'd forward both Alien and Aliens for best picture, too.

Remember the technical awards are voted on by people that work in these fields... it's not like some big name star said that AOTC had worse sound effects than Spider-Man, it was determined by sound people!

Also, while the Alien films mentioned were sci-fi, they were also horror and action, how many of those get to be Best Picture?

Look, if GL is going to keep the PT similar in tone, don't expect the same "flaws" that people use like dialogue, acting, etc. are going to disappear in Episode 3!
It doesn't matter what the competition is, okay, Episode 3 would have to be a damn good film and I mean damn GOOD to get a Best Picture nod.
GL is the one in charge of that... he has done it before (American Graffiti & ANH) and it could be possible for him to do it again, but it would probably have to compete against films like those that have been nominated for such awards since the 90's.

Really, was TPM or AOTC on the level as Braveheart, for example?
If you believe that, then don't expect a Oscar for Ep.3! You will be disappointed!
I'm not joking around either!

Alien for best picture?

Yea, I could see that. But Aliens? No, lol!

Other scifi flicks FYC:

The Thing (1982)
-Don't know about best picture for this, but Carpenters directing was top notch.

Blade Runner an 2001 were already mentioned...

How about 12 Monkeys? Or Gattaca?

Here's one for "What if" conspiracy buffs...

James Cameron did Titanic and it won Academy Awards (Best Picture, most notably)... he has made sci-fi effects films and is involved in someway in popular film franchises that made a lot of money for their time and had a large fanbase (Rambo, Aliens, Terminator)...

Do you think that if Cameron had been involved as writer, director, producer in Terminator 3: Rise of the Machines, that he or that film would be "predetermined" to win Oscars?
Based on his Titanic win?

Well...

Huh, come on...

I know how you feel about me, but...

I'm not imagining things....

You know you want to answer....

ST,

I don't mean 'mistakes' in that sense, but I agree FOTR has a lot of bad edits, I'm not disputing that, PJ has (in FOTR) a very particualr way of shooting where basically the whole movie is a montage, this works some of the time but not always. I mean edits, there are scenes in AOTC that last 2 or 3 seconds too long, where there should be cut aways and there is not, where scenes have about 10 times as much dialogue as they need, where one shot does not properly cut into the next, where there is no tension because the cutting does not build it up properly, where people have discussions which make no sense because nessesary dialogue to make the conversation work has been deleted.

"If by "old and new" you mean combining miniatures with CG, TPM and AOTC feature more miniature models than any other films to date."

I meant trick photography and forced perspective. And yes AOTC used models, but they also had entirely cgi clone troopers for no apparent reason. THe philosophy of FX on LOTR is use digital only if you absolutely have to, combine techniques, isntead of just all digital.

"And I could never understand why people say the effects look like a video game. Why are they any worse than mass legions of CG creations concealed in the dark?"

Because more often then not the Uruk hai were costumed actors, and even when they were cgi they looked completely real, where as I find the cgi characters are a step down from AOTC to TPM, even jarjar and watto didn't look as good, I'm not usre what happened. As for the dark, whats wrong with the dark? Yes its forgiving, it also sets a nice tone, The PT could stand to have a few more 'dark' scenes. Either way its in the book, it wasn't done to hide the FX. The next film has a day light battle at 10 times the scale, and FOTR had plenty of complex day time shots.

(regrading the conflict)
"And why is that a bad thing? So many movies today have plots and storylines that are EXACTLY the same thing, AOTC's plot was refreshing. I guess not everybody can appreciate change though."


What change? Everything is rehashed form other movies, mostly SW movies. Whys hould I care about a war where either way the same guy wins, where the supposed heros of the saga are irrelevant because Palpatine will win no matter what they do? It'd be like watching the super bowl if both teams were coached by the same guy, its like playing chess with yourself, whats intersting about that? If the republic wins who cares? The past 2 films have shown that there is nothing particularly good about the republic, if the seperatist win then what real threat is there, since we don't even know what their agenda is. Either way sidious controls the galaxy, its all masterbatory. How can you say TTT was unoriginal? LOTR is basically the beginnings of the fantasy genre, which many including Lucas have borrowed extensively from.



"TTT is the second sequel. The same thing happened with TESB. If there was a Lord of the Rings 5, I can pretty much gurantee there would a split fan base with people who thinks it's better or worse than it's precessors."

And the people who think its worse would probably be right because like SW, LOTR would be trying to squeeze 6 movies out of a 3 movie story.

"P-A-L-P-A-T-I-N-E = E-V-I-L

J-E-D-I = G-O-O-D


That should do the trick."

except the jedi are fighting for palpatine. And are themselves not terribly intersting nor heroic.

I can honestly say that I enjoyed the PT just as much as I enjoyed The Radioland Murders.