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  1. In Memory of LAJ_FETT: Please share your remembrances and condolences HERE

Lit Are Invisibility and/or Flight appropriate GFFA technologies/Force-powers?

Discussion in 'Literature' started by Ghost, Jun 14, 2013.

  1. Ghost

    Ghost Chosen One star 8

    Registered:
    Oct 13, 2003
    Teleportation and Time-Travel, despite being common futuristic technologies in other works, don't really figure into the EU because they don't "feel" like Star Wars and would make the GFFA into a very different place. (Only the secluded Aing-Tii seem to do it, in their own unique way)

    Probably the same deal for why nanotechnology isn't used that much (like to cleanup waste, or manufacture, or for healthcare)... it would just change the way the galaxy works, and doesn't feel like Star Wars. (So far, it's only been used as the "nanokiller," another superweapon of the Empire's)


    But what about Invisibility, or Flight? Not jetpack flight, I mean peter pan flight. And by invisibility, I mean real invisibility, not cloaking from radar. Those are other elements that we see in other science-fiction and fantasy settings... but haven't really been used much in Star Wars. I could see them being the result of advanced Force powers, or of advanced technology. But would they feel appropriate for the GFFA?
     
  2. FatSmel

    FatSmel Jedi Knight star 3

    Registered:
    Sep 23, 2012
    People have been able to use the force to make themselves appear invisible, like Luke and Jacen with the Fallanasi techniques.

    I don't think anyone will ever fly, unless they have wings
     
  3. Mechalich

    Mechalich Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Feb 2, 2010
    That we've only seen the Aing-Tii use the Fold Space power so far doesn't mean they are the only ones who can do it. They taught the ability to Luke, Ben, and Jacen, and potentially others have developed their own versions.

    Invisibility exists in the form of both highly advanced stealth technologies (such as those featured in the Knight Errant novel) and the Force Cloak power, which involves bending light to obscure vision and works on droids (rather than sensory misdirection camouflage).

    As for flight...well, first of all TCW really upped the capabilities of jetpacks to something a whole lot closer to 'peter pan' levels. Likewise, A skilled Force-user who made a real study of the idea could probably fly by controlling the wind with great precision or riding on a small object that they were levitating - I've always imagined that a properly skilled Zeison Sha, being telekinetic specialists, could 'ride' their discblade as a form of flight.

    The reason we don't see these powers often is probably a matter of difficulty and risk/reward balance. Flight, to choose one example, is actually a great way to get shot at, so it has limited advantages over the sort of Force-jump enhanced movement we see a lot already. Ultimately, the overwhelming majority of Force users in the EU we observe follow the Jedi school of power development (includes the Sith and affiliated dark side groups) who focus the overwhelming majority of their training effort on how to cut people up with shining plasma blades. Not surprising that other powers are much rarer.

    Nanotechnology is rarely used because it was not really on the speculative radar during the OT, so the universe doesn't have the conceptual structure support it. The same is true of advanced biotech and advanced networking technologies.
     
  4. AdmiralWesJanson

    AdmiralWesJanson Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    May 23, 2005
    Flight like Superman? No. Levitation? Yes. Remember CoPL and Isolder's musings on "Skywalker"
     
  5. Starkeiller

    Starkeiller Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 5, 2004
  6. Ghost

    Ghost Chosen One star 8

    Registered:
    Oct 13, 2003
    Well, we know from Plagueis that at least one Sith Lord could fly. And it looks like the Force can be used for invisibility too.

    But do these things seem appropriate for Star Wars?

    Invisibility is a featured trope in similar stories, like the One Ring in Tolkien's world and the Invisibility Cloak in Harry Potter.

    You would think Flight would be more common, with how many gravity-related deaths there are... I'm sure Palpatine wished he had it :p
     
  7. Matthew78

    Matthew78 Jedi Knight star 2

    Registered:
    Dec 16, 2006
    Vergere is a bird right? I bet that she could fly like an Eagle if she wanted to do so, she had feathers after all and the force, Vergere could put Peter Pan to shame, and we have yet to see a Toydarian Jedi Master.
     
  8. King of Alsakan

    King of Alsakan Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Nov 25, 2007
    Science mixed with fantasy is great combo, so I just assume all of the nano tech and other advanced technologies are there just "off screen" supporting this super advanced civilization.

    I am glad there is no time travel, because that's done so poorly so often. I think there have been numerous cloaking technologies used in various stories. As for teleportation don't for get about Magwit's mystifying hoop and Gree/Kwa technology.
     
  9. vong333

    vong333 Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Oct 18, 2003
    Thats a very question that was posted and a good thread to put comments in. Throughout the entire history of star wars, there have been cans and cannots, do and do nots, and what not. There has been authorized accepted versions, not accepted versions and modified versions. We have gone from GL is the man, to the EU is the bomb to now Disney. We've had rules, regulations, of what is and what is not. We have said that the writers, animators, storytellers, producers, directors, artisits all have different visions and their interpretations of those visions should be such. We've gone from there is not way a droid can fire cloaked to a hologram, we've gone from an era were cloaking devices weren't available to stories with different versions of cloaking. Star Wars is science fiction but also science space fanatsy. We restrict what should be but then at the same time we don't. It's like star wars in itself is full of hypocrisy. Remember when they said no more star wars movies after the 6 that came out? Now we not only going to get 7,8,and 9, but in between stories as well. Same thing with this stuff.

    To say that in star wars the power of flight without a jetpack is not available is to not know the source material itself and be ignorant. To say that cloaking can't be done is the same thing as well as teleportation and time travel. Its the manner and frequency that we have that make them rare.

    The bottom line, in the end, Star Wars is star wars. With that this includes the movies, script, making of books, art books, novelizations, comic books, video games, short stories, cartoons/animations, tv movies, toys, trading cards, roleplaying games both in book form and card form, etc, etc, etc.

    Every source has one version or type of the above listed.

    For example: The power of flight has been a big mystery in star wars. Can one do it? Is it their? Is it like Neo/Superman/Iron Man?

    The power of flight can be traced back to the Ewok comic book number 8 and 12. In those two books Morag the Witch can first of all stays levitated the entire time, in issue 12 she flys in the air...of course with the stick with the shadowstone on it. Henceforth with Wicket says, Look, she's flying. Then you have from the cover to the interior panels that shows not only horizontal flight, but vertical. know this resembles more of levitation but she is off the ground in the air at various heights and moves up and down over long distances.

    In the Mortis trilogy of the animated series, both the son and daughter can change into flying creatures were they fly. In fact the son, out ran a republic shuttle . If you look at the scene carefully, you see that he put a bit of turbo at the end of the flight sequence. The father doesn't change into any creature, but has wings that come out of his back. In the animation series, the animators did not do the father flying in the air, but him having the wings and getting from the castle to the scene were both the son and daughter are fightining implies that he flew there.

    In Ewok Battor for Endor tv movie, the witch used a ring which allowed her to change to a bird and fly.

    The jetpack sequence of the clone wars animated series does a bit more in this department. First it showed that one can travel over long distances both vertically and horizontally with the jet pack, something that role playing games and other EU material had restricted (several meters up and across). In the series you see the depth from which flight with a pack can be attained and looked a lot like Neo/Superman/ Iron man flying. The exceptions are that the jet pack cannot go into a mach type speed like iron manm nor will it out race a plane/fighter. One will also not be able to fly all the way up to the startosphere like Neo, nor outinto space like superman. Unless you lauch from a space ship and fliy over to another. This can be done like in the Star Trek Darkness movie, or like the first star trek movie when the dude in the space suit was trying to out run the cloud energy ribbon. This was shown in the first season of the lcone wars cartoon series when Anakin was in Dooku's ship. In the opening sequence, you see obi-wan in a space suit moving horizontally towards Dooku's ship, and the distance appeared great.

    I'll post more on the others in a bit.
     
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  10. AlyxDinas

    AlyxDinas Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    Jul 12, 2010
    I don't know if I'd object to Invisibility as the power of an obscure Sith amulet or something. But I feel like it is something that technology has outraced. As for Force Cloak, I was always under the impression that it usually isn't perfect because it's such a taxing technique.
     
  11. vong333

    vong333 Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Oct 18, 2003
    So flight in essence can be accomplished with the force and a jet pack to a considerable degree. Their was one sequence in the Dark Horse Tales comics that covered a 6 part story set between Episode 1 and 2. The story had an individual who flew up in the air with a special type of jet pack that allowed him to be way up their in the air along with his other comrades. I can't remember the name and is another one of those obscure situations. You can see in the backdrop numerous other beings up in the air even higher than our characters. The jet pack appeared to be of a higher caliber version with extended wings for flight. The people of course had breath masks and helmets.

    There was also Abel Pena's article from the Dark Forces game. The one with Maw, the dude that has no legs. He can basically stay levitated at all times and can go up or down and side to side with the dark side of the force. You can even see video on this via youtube where Maw is moving around without legs in the air. Pena though gave it a rating system much like the roleplaying games. Also, if you have some of the Wizard of the Coast roleplaying games, force flight is covered and the Witches of Dothamir are alleged to be able to do that.

    Then we had the Darth Pleguis novel that had a holocron of a dark lord who can fly in the air.

    Then there were two stories that has a special version of flight/glide. The first being the famous Wolverton novel, Courtship of Princess Leia. In that book, Luke's x-wing blow's up way up there in the air, and he just crosses his legs and floats all the way to the ground.

    The second one was in the Old Republic novel, Deceived. The female jedi and her companion have their ship explode up in the steratosphere an she uses the force to basically glide almost 31 miles from up in the air. The book gave meters, but the translation/conversion puts it up their in miles. If one remembers the AOTC movie, Obi-Wan did that amazing fall and in the novel, which was then shown art with the depth of that and the anecdote that stated from the recently released storyboards book state that no one should be able to survive that kind of drop. Yet, in the Deceived novel she did.

    So not to beat a dead horse dry, can one fly yes. But star wars doesn't do this straight out like in other franchises and properties. They do this with obscure rare stories, pictures, and video and by a lot of implied and alleged than actual visually seen. Star Wars has had different variations of this across the board and we have to remember as we move forward with the franchise, many of the limitations that were imposed before are probably no longer going to be in affect. I guess I can say that about the entire EU, from planning to execution, to marketing etc.

    Now onto cloaking devices...
     
  12. vong333

    vong333 Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Oct 18, 2003
    When it comes to cloaking devices, we have to understand that before the prequels, cloaking devices were rare and those that were available dealt with a double blind effect. What that meant was that one could use the device but practically was blind to maneuver. That was while Thrawn used it in innovative ways. This changed with the release of TPM. Darth Maul's craft was equipped with a special styigum cloaking device that allowed the vehicle to be both visually and radar not seen. Of course a crystal grav trap sensor could detect it but within the number of stories that started coming out, cloaking devices from starships to fighters, to personal gear became more and more readily available in the different stories. They still require a lot of energy to use and the styigum crystals aren't readily available but its there. In the Force Unleashed 2 novel when Boba Fett and his invisible warriors attacked the rebel fleet and boarded the ship both the fighers and the warriors were invisible giving the rebels a hard time. You had the stealth ship from the clone wars cartoon series which littlely became invisible and flew as such. Never had we seen actual cloaking to that degree in a starship. Yeah in the video games we have but in an official story....not really. Heck even in the micro series the droids that attacked Ilum were invisible, the only problem is some brainiac decided to say it was a hologram instead of actual invisibility. Maybe to the die hard fan base they accept that, but to most causal observers, they see a droid that is not visible, fire lasers. They can be detected by Artoo, but he can't pinpoint them henceforth when Padme throws her coat to have Threepio pick it up. That way when the droid fires, she can pinpoint its position. Trust me on this one, I have talked to those EU diehards and they say its a hologram because of the ret-con, but I have talked to the casual cartoon watcher collector and they say, "Dude, the heck with those nerds, the droid was invisible and fired as such and that's it.. When I watch the show I don't keep no stupid list of what actually is or isn't." "I just watch it and enjoy it period and in that series the droid became invisible period. That was several people I spoke to at Tate's Comic Shop.

    But, in the end, cloaking devices and invisibility whether through the force or a device has become more and more common. As Disney moves in with the property, bare in mind that many of the restrictions before aren't going to be followed to a tee.

    Time travel is the next one...............We don't have time travel as much as star trek or other franchise's but in its own way it there. The Droids comics from marvel had something like that, followed by a Dark Horse story that involved Mace Windu. Then of course we had the famous flow walk stuff and the J. Kemp novel of time travel from a sith ship. It's not in big quantities but it is there. Some of you will say, but the stories ain't canon........well my answer to that is the following: