At The Risk Of...

... being a repetitive, annoying newbie who doesn't take much time to get to know everyone first...

... (sorry, I'm a homeschool mom of six children, not much time for 'foreplay', so I will just get to the point!) ...

I thought I should copy and paste this into this forum, since I don't know how often y'all check out the welcome forum... this looks like the right place to put it!

My First Post w/ A Couple of Questions...

Hey everybody!

Today is my first day visiting theforce.net...

I am a longtime StarWars fan... the reason for my username is that I had NEVER EVER been to see a movie in a theater until I was 13 years old (strict, Christian family), when my oldest brother took me to see STAR WARS without our parents' permission!!!

WOW! What an introduction to the big screen THAT was!!!!!!! I was absolutely amazed. And in love with Luke, too!

Star Wars has definitely been a big part of my life... waiting, with baited breath, for each episode to 'take me there' all over again. Like many, I often wondered if we would ever know HOW Darth Vader became a dark lord in the first place, what could have separated him from Luke, Leia, and their mother? Soon we will know the WHOLE story... I'm SOOO excited! My kids and I just viewed the trailers for Episode III earlier today... AH!!! the waiting becomes that much more unbearable, and simultaneously thrilling!!!

ANYWAY...

I did come in here for a specific purpose, so I will get to the point...

We have two VHS copies of the original movie, one of them being part of a box set of the original trilogy. We have Episode I on VHS, as well, Episode II being the only one we have on DVD. Our VERY EXPENSIVE vcr just recently quit working, and I do not know if/when we will have it repaired or replaced. This being the case, in addition to our interest in the movies having just been 're-ignited' by news of Episode III, I went in search of information on DVD versions of the first four movies. So, I am now finding out that not EVERY version, of the original movies, is, indeed, ORIGINAL... but that George Lucas has 'tinkered' with the original movies not once, but *?several?* times???

I was hoping that maybe some of you Star Wars experts might be able to help me out, in identifying which, if any, of my copies are ORIGINAL versions of the theatrical releases.

Here's what I have:

Star Wars... VHS, slipcover with original artwork including Luke, Leia, C-3PO and R2-D2 on front. CBS FOX VIDEO, Cat. No. 1130, copyright 1990.

Star Wars Trilogy... VHS, boxed set, Darth Vader mask (well, part of it) main feature on outer box and first slipcover. Second slipcover main feature is a stormtrooper mask, third slipcover main feature is Yoda. Twentieth Century Fox Home Entertainment, LucasFilm Ltd., copyright 1995. Item number on bottom of box: 0609.

The Phantom Menace... VHS, widescreen video collector's edition w/two boxes (one slipcover, one plastic w/holographic picture), 35mm Film Strip and 'The Art of Episode I' book. Copyright 2000... 2000095, number on outer box and videotape.

Attack of the Clones... DVD, widescreen, 2-disc set, in a regular DVD case. Copyright 2002.

So, I guess I have two questions, for anyone willing to answer them...

1. Are any/all of my tapes/DVDs ORIGINAL, theatrical versions?

and

2. Is there ANY way to get all five (or at least the first four) movies, on DVD, in their ORIGINAL theatrical release form?

Well, guess that's about it for now... time to go watch those trailers again!!! hehe...

D

 

Star Wars... VHS, slipcover with original artwork including Luke, Leia, C-3PO and R2-D2 on front. CBS FOX VIDEO, Cat. No. 1130, copyright 1990.

This is probably orginal. If it really dates from 1990 than it probably is the orgininal cut of the film.

Star Wars Trilogy... VHS, boxed set, Darth Vader mask (well, part of it) main feature on outer box and first slipcover. Second slipcover main feature is a stormtrooper mask, third slipcover main feature is Yoda. Twentieth Century Fox Home Entertainment, LucasFilm Ltd., copyright 1995. Item number on bottom of box: 0609.

This probably also orginal, as it sounds like you have the retouched cuts of the films that were releseed in 95 and 96 before the SEs came out.

The Phantom Menace... VHS, widescreen video collector's edition w/two boxes (one slipcover, one plastic w/holographic picture), 35mm Film Strip and 'The Art of Episode I' book. Copyright 2000... 2000095, number on outer box and videotape.

This one I can't comment on since I was unaware that there was a collector edition of TPM on VHS.

Attack of the Clones... DVD, widescreen, 2-disc set, in a regular DVD case. Copyright 2002.

This one is also original.

Unfortunately the first three films no longer exist in the their theatrical release format since LFL rerelease the original trilogy in 1997 with improved SFX and some deleted scenes. I would suspect that your TPM tape maybe the same since the DVD includes some deleted scenes and extended Podrace sequence, in which case it would not be the cut of the movie that was seen in theatres.

 

The Attack of the Clone DVD is not the original theatrical version. That one no longer exists, I believe.

EDIT: And the TPM tape is the original theatrical version. The DVD recieved a new scene here or there and some tweaks to the editing. Don't lose that tape!

 

As was mentioned there's no official way to get the Original versions of the films on DVD

 

The Attack of the Clone DVD is not the original theatrical version. That one no longer exists, I believe.

Actually it is. There are a couple of scenes that I could see being added to AOTC in the future, but I also have Ep.II on DVD and trust me, its the version that was released in theatres.

 

Which theaters? The digital one? I didn't see the digital one. But the theatrical one had less of a scene than the dvd does and had a different wedding scene, just a slight difference. And perhaps other things. It's kinda hard to check on unless you have a bootleg of the original. But just listen to the commentary. They talk about what's been changed for the dvd.

 

deeysew is right. I listened to the commentary on the AOTC DVD a while back and I remember them talking about how they tweaked with some of the effects [ex: Jango's rocket pack going off before he loses his head] and a few scenes were slightly re-done as well. The changes to AOTC are the most unspoken of all the Star Wars movies, but trust me - it too was altered from the original release.

The reason for George Lucas changing all these fantastic movies is because he wants them to flow better (in his mind) and tie them together. He also has said that he didn't have the technology or time to do certain things with the movies at the time they were made and always planned to go back and make them the way he wanted them to be.

 

It depends on how nitpicky you want to get, as far as I know there are no official video releases of ANH without "Episode IV" in the opening crawl, as was the case with the 1977 theatrical release. Also, I've read there had been some (minor) dialogue changes in the various releases from 1982 onward. The 1995 version is the last release of the pre-Special Edition versions. These versions are not legally available on DVD format.

As far as TPM goes, I know there was at least two scenes added/extended in the DVD release, but I don't know about the VHS collector's edition.

There were some dialogue/effect changes to AotC for the DVD release, so strictly speaking it's not the original version either.

 

I think I know what you mean, actually. In some theatres that didn't have digital projectors, there was a small edit made to the wedding scene at the end of the movie so that you didn't see Anakin's bionic hand because it was done using CGI. The DVD does not contain this minor edit since Lucas had alway intended to show Anakin's hand but was forced to make minor alternations some copies of the films since not all theatres were able to show it.

 

there was a small edit made to the wedding scene at the end of the movie so that you didn't see Anakin's bionic hand because it was done using CGI.

Not exactly. You could see his hand just fine. In the DVD and digital theater release Padme touches it, whereas in the film version she doesn't.

 

Yeah, exactly there's close up of his hand. But there's also an edited version of that scene where that close up isn't there.

 

I thought the close-up was there in both/ all versions (are there more than two?) but only that Padmé takes it in her hand in the digital/ DVD version and not in the film version; before the camera tilts up.

and then there is the longer confession scene which as far as I know first appeared in the IMAX release and then on DVD.

 

Are you sure? I know that in the book the confession slightly longer, since Anakin makes a comment that the only the men are fighters among the Sand People, but that's not on the DVD though and I though that LFL had to actually cut stuff out for the Imax version, or at least that's what I've heard.

 

The exchange...

"To be angry is to be human." "I'm a Jedi. I know I'm better than this."

... was added to that scene for the DVD release (or the IMAX version, I guess -- I don't really know the details of that). It wasn't there in the theatrical version.

 

If you want the original versions of the original trilogy, and you want them on a lasting media (VHS tapes don't last very long compared to disc media we have today), I suggest you buy a laserdisc player and use ebay to find laserdisc versions of the original version of Star Wars original trilogy. It may be expensive, though ... I'm not sure what collector demand is nowadays.

 

Star Wars... VHS, slipcover with original artwork including Luke, Leia, C-3PO and R2-D2 on front. CBS FOX VIDEO, Cat. No. 1130, copyright 1990.

Yep. I have that one myself. Han shoots first, its the original theatrical release.

Star Wars Trilogy... VHS, boxed set, Darth Vader mask (well, part of it) main feature on outer box and first slipcover. Second slipcover main feature is a stormtrooper mask, third slipcover main feature is Yoda. Twentieth Century Fox Home Entertainment, LucasFilm Ltd., copyright 1995. Item number on bottom of box: 0609.

I believe this is referred to as the 'THX' version. LFL cleaned up the prints, making the color crisper than the 1990 release and added THX sound quality. Han shoots first, also original theatrical release.

In 1997 Star Wars Special editions hit the theaters. Added scenes and Greedo shot first. These were available on video. Now, since the DVD came out, Han and Greedo shoot simultanously, more added stuff, and it is the "official" Original Trilogy. So save those old VHS copies from 1990 and 1996.

 

I have that TPM VHS collector's edition with the movie frame. I've never watched it. However, it says something about a documentary on the back of the slipcover. Where is this documentary? At the end of the film? Just curious.

 

This is actually inaccurate- the original films still do exist as LFL had to restore the original footage before they could begin doing the digital changes to the SE's. And LFL is notorious for preserving all of it's film elements, so the original versions absolutely, without a doubt still exist, should Lucas finally cave-in and rerelease them.

In the sense that the originals cuts of the films physically exist, you're correct, but they are not available for public consumption, so in that sense, which is what CV was refering to, you're not correct. And yes, I think DVDs of the unedited moviessd should be released. I love the SE DVDs, but I would also love to have to movies as they were when they came out.

 

Okay, you guys, I have to be TOTALLY HONEST with y'all... my head IS swimming, just a bit, from ALL of the information here!

But, that's okay, I'll sort through it all and figure out which end is up... the bottom line, whatever your opinions are, it looks like I probably have the most 'original' versions I could possibly have, for each of the movies so far. I guess the only issue now is figuring out how to preserve what I have. Any ideas, feel free to e-mail me at mountaingirlcrazy4garth@yahoo.com, okay? I'm not one for illegal pirating, but my attitude has always been, if the animal doesn't exist for the purpose of retail purchase, do what ya' gotta do, right? If it's on the market, I WILL do the right thing and buy it new, if not, well... Like I said in the other forum, if I COULD transfer my VHS to DVD, I would, but I don't have the ability to do that. I MIGHT look into the whole laserdisc idea, but if it's too costly... well, it's not THAT big of a priority to me, sorry to say. I understand that Lucas is the creative mind, here, and this is 'his baby' and all, but he should be proud enough, of his original product, and the popularity that it has engendered, to at least give the 'die-hards' that option of enjoying the movies as they remember them from their first viewing of them. Makes sense to me!!! I mean, with the ability to do what you want to do and have as many versions out there as you have the mind to create, why not just put out there whatever it takes to make everyone happy? Seems to me that he has nothing to lose in that, if anything there's just that much more money to make, right? Although, being a big Garth Brooks fan, I am more than familiar with the damage that can be created by *apparently* over-marketing a product for what *seems to be* the purpose of just making more money or selling more 'units'... so I guess reputation is a concern, as well.

Okay, I'm rambling, aren't I?

ANYWAY...

I definitely want to make sure that I say a big THANK YOU to all of you guys for taking the time to reply to my post and answer my questions!!! So...

THANK YOU!!!

I don't have much time to do this, but I did want to answer, specifically, a few things... and add a few thoughts to the discussion...

First off, I was amazed to learn that the original theatrical release of ANH did NOT??? have the Episode IV 'crawl'??? I know it's been a long time, and I believe I only got to see it, in the theater, once, MAYBE twice, but I thought it had ALWAYS been part of the movie??? Surprise, surprise. Obviously I've seen it, on tape, a few too many times to remember that!

MatthewZ ~ ya' know, I was gonna go 'look at it', to see if I could answer your question... then I realized, OH YEAH, I can't do that, vcr broken, remember? Duh. So, since I don't really remember, I asked some of my kids... they all seem to think that it's at the beginning, and once they started talking about what they remember, it seems to 'fit', to me... at the beginning, I'm pretty sure.

Okay, actually, I think that's about it for now... I really gotta get off this 'puter and get some other stuff done...

again, thanks EVERYBODY, especially Chancellor_Ewok (btw, I like your signatures, especially the 'kitten' one, my 15-year-old daughter thinks we're evil! ), DarthJohnkenobi, & The2ndQuest, for taking the time to help me out, much appreciated!!!

D

 

No, I wasn't implying that at all. Lucas isn't an idiot. I've always figured that he would keep at least one copy of each film in its unalterted state.

 

2ndQuest - WOW! You know your stuff! Now, would you happen to know a copyright question? Is it legal to go to one of these companies offering to transfer VCR casettes into DVDs, even if the casette is not a home video? I mean, people are allowed to make copies of their CDs if they are using them only for their own enjoyment and not for resale, right? But I'm just wondering if a "converting" company would do it for you...

Thanks!

 

I'm not sure on that, either. I've always been under the impression that (for all media- CDs, DVDs, etc) it is legal to make copies for yourself simply for your own use (which is why it's legal to copy your CDs onto your iPod). It's not legal to make copies to sell or give away, though.

Hence why it is legal for me to have a DVD copy of the ANH laserdisc, which I own.

Personally, I think the best 'original' version to have would be the THX remastered versions from 1995. The sound and picture quality have been improved, but nothing* has changed.

*Note: nothing that anyone would notice, but I think there may have been a few teeny tiny things. Anyone who gripes about these is a loser

Personally I like having both the official DVDs and the originals on VHS and laserdisc/dvd.

-sj loves kevin spacey