PT ATOC: ending Anakin's confession on "I hate them" without Padme's response

Discussion in 'Prequel Trilogy' started by BigAl6ft6, Nov 21, 2012.

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  1. -NaTaLie- Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 5, 2001
    star 4
    If you watch I - II - III you notice this line leads into what he says in ROTS:

    (After killing Dooku) "I shouldn't have done it. It's not a Jedi way". And then Palpatine actually reminds him of the Tuskens.

    Then later:

    "Something happening. I'm not the Jedi I should be. I want more and I know I shouldn't".
    Samnz likes this.
  2. BigAl6ft6 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 12, 2012
    star 5
    Good point on the lines being referenced again. I actually really like the way that Christensen delivers the line "Something's happening" and how he's glaring off away, it's very emotionally deadened, in a good way.
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  3. Arawn_Fenn Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 2004
    star 7
    When the time comes for Anakin to be emotionally deadened, Hayden is always the right man for the job.
  4. -NaTaLie- Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 5, 2001
    star 4
    Yeah, that's why he is better in ROTS. But he can be warm and relaxed, too.
    Last edited by -NaTaLie-, Nov 23, 2012
  5. King Terak Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 22, 2012
    star 1
    He looked much more comfortable in ROTS than in AOTC. I liked the mature attitude he showed in the Coruscant space fight and divided feelings he had during the Sidious/windu duel.
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  6. StampidHD280pro Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 28, 2005
    star 4
    :mad:
  7. DRush76 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 25, 2008
    star 4

    I believe that would have transformed Anakin into a one-note bad boy . . . and a less complex character. I don't think I would have liked that.


    Why? It would have dragged a movie that already had a running time of 2hrs/22min. Also, Padme's conversation with Anakin upon their arrival at Naboo served its purpose. I never understood this demand that AOTC should have kept this scene, when the OT never revealed Leia's background in the OT. We never saw her reaction to the destruction of Alderaan, her home since infancy. In fact, the second trilogy never really touched upon Leia's background, until she learned that she and Luke were siblings in ROTJ.
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  8. anakinfansince1983 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Mar 4, 2011
    star 7
    I'm not sure what showing Leia's background has to do with showing Padme's background, but on this part--I always found it a bit unnatural that Leia didn't seem to react at all to the destruction of her home planet. I reconcile it by assuming both that she was in shock and that her reaction was off screen.

    As far as the scene with Padme's family, I thought it added to both her story and the story of her and Anakin together. And it's not like modern movies are limited to a 2.5 hour time frame.
  9. Sistros Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 24, 2010
    star 6
    AOTC was the slowest paced star wars film as it is

    (not that I'm complaining) but showing those things wouldn't have just slowed it down pace wise, it would leave the younger audiance absolutely bored stiff.

    Not to mention, they aren't really relevant to the film
  10. -NaTaLie- Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 5, 2001
    star 4
    Then cut down on all those ships landings/take offs.Also cut the meeting with Queen Jamilla. It's not moving the story forward and do we really need to see another of Anakin's outbursts? Much better to see a scene where she and Padme are actually comfortable with each other.

    I wouldn't say AOTC is the slowest, I think TPM is (and much of ROTJ, too). A lot of very important things happen in it (TPM is a lot less relevant). It does feel choppy at times, partially because of the editing, and partially because it's so condensed that Lucas couldn't allow his characters to go have some fun (ROTS actually has more of the adventure feel to it, despite being the darkest chapter in the saga).
  11. Arawn_Fenn Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 2004
    star 7
    Ouch... [face_laugh]
  12. -NaTaLie- Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 5, 2001
    star 4
    Lol a Freudian slip :D
    Anakin whines like a girl, you know :p
  13. Blur Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 11, 1999
    star 4
    Great catch - I actually just watched AOTC on Blu-ray and did not realize the Padme line "To be angry is to be human" & Anakin's response was not originally in the film back in 2002 - this is despite the fact that I saw AOTC numerous times in the theatre. However, I've only seen AOTC a couple of times on DVD, so probably just forgot this.

    To answer the question in the original post, I definitely feel that it's more powerful to not have Padme's line or Anakin's response, since it downplays the whole scene. It was much more appropriate to not have Padme say anything, which would make perfect sense; i.e., she's in shock over Anakin's confession. This speech by Anakin & his mixed emotions of both guilt & rage here, are, IMHO, some of the best acting in the saga. Hayden does a great job here, and you can really see how much in pain Anakin is. Superb.
  14. DRush76 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 25, 2008
    star 4

    He's not a 19 year-old boy with very little romantic experience, trying to woo the woman he loves in ROTS.




    This scene is not about Padme being appropriate. She responded in this fashion, because she understood Anakin's feelings . . . especially since she knew Shmi and was probably horrified by what the Tuskens did to the latter on a personal level. There is a chance she felt the same about the Tuskens. Padme is not some icon of perfection, even if many fans try to portray her in that fashion. Even the obviously decent Cliegg Lars dismissed the Tuskens as subhuman and not worth his friendship or compassion.
    Last edited by DRush76, Dec 23, 2012
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  15. King Terak Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 22, 2012
    star 1
    Shouldn't that be "friend zone" material.
    Last edited by King Terak, Dec 24, 2012
  16. BigAl6ft6 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 12, 2012
    star 5
    Yeah, I will say Padme's comforting response does imply that she may view the Tuskens the same way that Cliegg Lars did by calling them animals, which does come off as a bit odd to me. Cut out the bit and it leaves on the more menacing note with the Vader-theme up which is contrasted beautifully with the shot of Anakin on the ground, crying. And, as mentioned, without the little tag, you get the feeling that Padme is in shock. And then you leave the scene because all of the good, solid drama is out the way. Cut to Shimi's funeral and the sad continues.
    Last edited by BigAl6ft6, Dec 27, 2012
  17. kainee Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 10, 2012
    star 1
    I actually like the addition of the dialogue from Padme because of all the parallels that it later draws with the dialogue in Revenge of the Sith. I also think it sets up a nice contrast between Padme's approach to Anakin versus how Yoda and Obi-Wan handled him in Revenge of the Sith. Padme's comfort of him both acknowledges that Anakin's not perfect and that it's okay to make mistakes, which is a theme that Padme continues in Revenge of the Sith where she continues with a more conciliatory tone that allows for Anakin to be vulnerable with her. By contrast, the scenes Anakin has with Yoda and Obi-Wan hold him up to a Jedi ideal that Anakin fundamentally can't meet. Yoda's advice for him to learn to let go is impossible for Anakin in light of his secret marriage while Obi-Wan's encouragement in response to Anakin's confession that he's been difficult and not using Obi-Wan's teachings only reinforces the expectation that Obi-Wan has of Anakin continuing to maintain the illusion of the emotionally detached perfect Jedi that he's already broken and the strain of maintaining the facade is getting to him.

    The need to be a bridge to the rest of the movies is why I think as a standalone movie, Attack of the Clones is likely the weakest but when you consider it as part of the prequel trilogy or as part of the Saga, it actually helps to reinforce what's going on. So, personally, I like the change.
    BigAl6ft6 likes this.
  18. DRush76 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 25, 2008
    star 4

    I don't agree with you. I don't think that AOTC is the only SW movie that needs to be a bridge to the rest of the movies. The only movies capable of being stand alones are ANH and TPM. And I would say that ANH is even more of a stand alone movie than TPM. But this doesn't mean I consider ANH or TPM to be the strongest of the six films.
  19. kainee Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 10, 2012
    star 1
    You do bring up a point I didn't fully consider the implications of. I was considering AOTC in context of the prequel trilogy since I feel it's in that weird place where it's just starting to pay off some of the things set up in TPM but still needs to continue building up the stuff that will pay off in ROTS and the OT, so I find its structure a bit awkward since it can't really tie up too many ends.

    Then again, I suppose that can be said for most of the movies in the franchise, as the point of reference will keep changing since Star Wars keeps updating as a franchise. What I considered the strongest movie in the franchise keeps changing for me as the Saga lengthens. When there was only the OT, I used to think ESB was the strongest movie. With the PT, I now think ROTS is the strongest movie. When the ST comes out, my opinion will likely change again. I'm going to predict that with the ST causing the OT to become the middle trilogy that it'll become the middle of a story for me and I'll end up either favoring the ST depending on how they resolve the entire Saga or staying with the PT. But this is a personal preference since with film trilogies, I usually favor the third film since the I find the second film can't be fully appreciated without the climax of the trilogy.

    Though perhaps even trying to evaluate a Star Wars movie on its own is actually a moot point-- they're not really built that way to begin with. I can't really even evaluate a Star Wars movie on its own without using the knowledge I have of the other films. Perhaps, this illustrates the reason why having an influx of new blood with a new generation of Star Wars is good-- to allow us older fans to update our perspectives on the films?
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