Just though I'd start a general thread to talk about the latest going ons in Australia. Don't know if there will be enough people to keep it going but hey.

Who would you prefer Howard to stay on or Costello to take over as PM.

I'd prefer Costello, but I've always said you know somethings wrong when you start looking forward to a Costello government.

No matter who's PM at the next election I hope Beazley can knock them off, yes it's tall order, but I do come from he state that got rid of Kennett.

 

Wow. Australia is a busy place.

 

That's because it's widely recognised here that politics is a mugs game.

And now, I say this with no particular political bias, that Peter Costello is a smug ******. Honestly. Everytime I watch question time I want to kick him in the balls. So it's on purely personal grounds that I'd rather see Howard (or anyone else) remain as head of the Liberal party and thus, the nation.

 

smug ******

Is this a derogatory Aussie slang term? Because I like it and fully intend to use it in the future.

 

Nothing personal but god I hope -techno-union- is wrong.

I wonder, does the name suggest an affinity to unions?

That would explain the desire for a labor victory.

I don't care if Howard or Costello leads. As long as it's the liberals. Keep cutting that income tax boys.

 

Bugger, T-65 and I agree!

Frankly, Australia has never been better off than it has been with Howard at the helm. He's been the most consistent, successful reformist leader we've had and the country has never been better off for it.

If you think Costello is a smug ******, it's because you're too young to remember Keating. Costello's a smart, quick-thinking man but nothing on the Hon. Paul J.

And if you remember question time during the Latham era before Parliament, Costello's repeated verbal spanking of the ALP leadership - which, IMO, is a sorry collection of ideologically disparate wannabes - was pure gold.

However, at the risk of being controversial, I'd love to see Malcolm Turnbull get to the top.

E_S

 

Costello is a humble man with a magnetic personality compared to Downer. I can't think of anybody who irritates me more than that ponce.

 

Downer's problem is he has what's called a cultivated Australian accent - that is, he sounds affected and poofy. He's actually very good at what he does, but he's not a born leader.

E_S

 

Downer's problem is he has what's called a cultivated Australian accent - that is, he sounds affected and poofy.

So basically he has a British accent?

 

Downer's problem is he has what's called a cultivated Australian accent - that is, he sounds affected and poofy.

Oi! I have one of those!

...

Oh yeah. Never mind.

So basically he has a British accent?

The people who've asked me what part of England I'm from would suggest a yes.

 

Firstly, I think that people with political affiliations should state them up front in this thread so people know where everyone stands and can understand where the rhetoric comes from.

Downer's problem is he has what's called a cultivated Australian accent - that is, he sounds affected and poofy.

That's not a cultured accent, that's a holier than thou accent. It's the same way of speaking that other pompous fools like David Flint use.

He's actually very good at what he does, but he's not a born leader.

He's a fat old windbag that's good at blowing hot air and not much else. Yes, he's smug, pompous and poofy and no-one likes him except the makers of fishnet stockings.

As far as Costello and Howard goes, I'd like to see Costello get the job as I personally dislike John Howard's lies. I don't trust the man, he couldn't be sincere if his life depended on it.

 

Good to see some objectivity in there, anyone would think you're anti-Howard.

Yes, basically, Downer does sound English-y. [link=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Australian_English#Broad.2C_General_and_Cultivated_Australian_English]Wikipedia[/link] explains a bit about that.

And he's a tremendously good diplomat with a history in foreign affairs going back a generation.

Howard's Lies; yes, because Politicians Don't Lie?

Frankly, he's told a couple of little ones but no worse than any other leader we've had. I loved the pompous crap coming from Latham and Co, about honesty; like Latham wouldn't also be breaking promises and arduously avoiding the truth. Thankfully, and speaking of pompous windbags, he was resoundingly beaten (Australians have wonderful BS detectors and the wailings of BS klaxons must have deafened the electorate) to restore Kim Beazley to leadership... mediocrity.

Don't get me wrong; Kim's a fantastic guy and the smartest thing Latham did (For the record, I don't call giving Kevin Rudd - a man with Keating and Costello's arrogance combined, minus any personality - or Julia Gillard any public profile "smart") was give him defence, because he's got an excellent working relationship with DoD. He's just not a leader that the Australian people can trust, and if I'm called "wrong" on this; I'd point out his previous defeats. And, yes, I'm aware Whitlam had a string of defeats before victory but at the risk of upsetting the left, look how that turned out - foreign debt and a constitutional crisis.

Heh, I love the irony behind Whitlam - a Labor Right posterboy for leftist students...

Anyway, I think - and I'll try and be objective here - alot of the critcisms levelled at Howard were his own fault. When he entered the Prime Ministership, we'd had a gutful of Keating and his crap and honest John Howard was a perfect remedy. But the problem was that leadership requires one do things like that; something that harkens back to Plato and Res Publica. I'm not bothered by John Howard's "lies" because frankly, he's got alot of catching up to do to be a proper politician. And half the opposition to Howard doesn't really care too much about it either; it's more that he's a successful conservative leader that's theissue, because I doubt pro-Laborites would be as fussed by children over-bored had there been a Labor leader. Though to be fair, Liberal supporters would have been pissed at a Labor leader had that been the case. Such is politics.

But, clearly, I am pro-Howard. I wasn't always; in fact, if you search through the Senate you'll find I earlier identified myself as Labor Right. However, I objectively think the coalition is the better leadership party and their values and ideals suit me more. The problem I have with Labor is twofold; one, it lacks a true sense of identity, which is partially the fault of Hawke/Keating insofar as moving Labor rightwards; and secondly, I don't really thinkt heir policies, whilst good intentioned, will do Australia any good.

E_S

EDIT: Oh, it's the budget tomorrow? Dang, see what I miss being away without my friendly dose of "why bother hiding our bias we lub j00 teh ALP!!1!" SMH?

Any surprises there? Is it going to be another good budget or waht?

 

Good to see some objectivity in there, anyone would think you're anti-Howard.

Why should I be objective when I'd like to see Costello oust Howard. I'd prefer a Costello government to a Howard government anyday.

You must be totally kidding if you think Howard has to make up ground on other politicians. He's the consumate pollie who will bull**** about anything to get his way. Australia doesn't have a BS detector obviously, however they do have hip pocket nerves and Howard went for it in the last election big time.

Flint and Downer's accents are a leftover from the colonial past where many public people including newsreel commentators and radio speakers tried to sound as British as possible for King and Country. Their accent is a remnant that most see as being patronising and aloof in todays society.

 

I never said the cultivated Australian accent wasn't as you say it was.

And no, Howard's not been the consumate lying politician; it's precisely why it took him so long to get to where he did. And you might have to accept the reasons people voted for him were a) because he's doing a good job and people want him to continue doing it, b) the other guy was such a hopeless, populist, soundbyte, loutish waste of space they didn't want him anywhere near a position of power, and c) because people know that Australia is going to continue to get better with him at the helm.

Could you actually list, say, 5 good things Howard has done?

E_S

 

I never said the cultivated Australian accent wasn't as you say it was.

I didn't say you did.

b) the other guy was such a hopeless, populist, soundbyte, loutish waste of space they didn't want him anywhere near a position of power

I have no objectivity, huh?

Could you actually list, say, 5 good things Howard has done?

No.

 

Howard is an excellent politician and economic manager - you can't really look at his long term as PM and deny that.

He is also a lying sack of ****.

The two are not mutually exclusive.

I don't really care for the man but as long as keeps the economy ticking along and provides us with tax breaks and baby bonuses then I'll be happy to keep him.

Australian politics is so utterly devoid of any talent (particularly Labor who have neen forced to ressurect Kim Beazley of all people) that the old saying "better the devil you know" seems partcularly relevant.

 

Wow, you can't list 5 things that Howard's done that's been positive? Yeah, that instills me with confidence.

I'll happily list the good thinks Hawke/Keating did - but I'll not pretend Latham wasn't anything short of hopelessly ill-suited for Prime Ministerial duties.

E_S

 

I didn't say I can't, I said no to the request to list them because if I did I'd have to remove my fingers one at a time with a pair of shears.

"There's no way you can hammer in the last nail"

 

Touche!

E_S

 

I'd describe myself as mostly apolitical... but I have an interest in history and current events, so I try to keep up with stuff in the news and this thread, somewhat.

That said, I voted for Latham in the last election. I don't like it when things stay the same for too long. A change - even a bad change - could be interesting.

That, and I can only remember being under a Liberal government. I'm bored with it. Politcal responsibility is for twerps.

I don't like how Howard runs his elections, though...

 

Hold up there Lostonhoth.

I love what the Liberals have done with the economy. The first home owner's grant was a stroke of genius and I firmly believe was hugely influential in the realestate boom.

But the baby bonus, I'm not too sure about that. It's nice to have a bit of help those few months the mother has to take off work, but it also incourages the wrong type to breed more.

Thus producing babies that are not going to be raised in an environment where they're likely to develop into useful members of society.

I think the jury's still out on that one.

But I hear top tax bracket is going to $80,000+ come July. WHOOOOOOOHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!

I'm not in favour of a bad change. Some people have to worry about feeding a family. So I'll firmly stick with the Liberals.

 

Australians are notoriously reluctant to change government - we've had, what, 6 changes of government since WWII - so it ain't broke and don't need fixing.

Australian politics is so utterly devoid of any talent (particularly Labor who have neen forced to ressurect Kim Beazley of all people) that the old saying "better the devil you know" seems partcularly relevant.


Hence, Malcolm Turnbull.

E_S

 

I actually like Malcolm Turnbull - when you compare him to some of the pathetic union hacks that Labor presented us with at the last election (particularly in Queensland) Turnbull really shines.

If he advances his political career to its logical conclusion, I think we'll have a President and a new flag (sans the Union Jack) in no time.

 

But the baby bonus, I'm not too sure about that. It's nice to have a bit of help those few months the mother has to take off work, but it also incourages the wrong type to breed more.

Thus producing babies that are not going to be raised in an environment where they're likely to develop into useful members of society.

Surely you aren't serious. I've never read a more condescending load of bigoted claptrap in my life.

 

I actually like Malcolm Turnbull - when you compare him to some of the pathetic union hacks that Labor presented us with at the last election (particularly in Queensland) Turnbull really shines.


You mean like Mark Latham, Julia Gillard, Kevin Rudd, Simon Crean, Peter Garrett... ?

E_S