Speculation Balance to the Force - plotline continuation in Episode 7

Discussion in 'Star Wars: Episode VII and Beyond (Archive)' started by Darth_Darkmoon, Nov 1, 2012.

  1. Darth_Darkmoon Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Nov 1, 2012
    When I read that Mark Hamill met with George Lucas because of Episode VII I remembered reading about an interview from 1983 in which George Lucas said that a possible sequel to Episode VI would revolve around an aged Luke Skywalker trying to pass on what he had learned, 40 years after the death of the Emperor.

    I still think that this could be the story for the new trilogy. 40 years after The Return of the Jedi, Luke Skywalker struggles with being the last of the Jedi. He wants to fulfill Yodas last wish to pass on what he has learned but he also knows that every padawan could fall to the Dark Side and Luke doesn't want to be responsible for the return of evil into the galaxy. Still he takes on a pupil and the one thing he feared most happens: His padawan succumbs to the Dark Side and "ressurrects" the Sith-Order.
    Luke has to deal with this and come to terms with the fact that there is no light without darkness.

    So maybe Anakin wasn't the Chosen One of the prophecy to bring balance to the Force. Maybe his purpose was to create a "blank slate". He eradicated both Sith and Jedi but one remained: Luke. This could not be the balance of the Force as at the end of Episode 6 we have just one of the good ones remaining - this is no balance.
    So what if it is Lukes destiny to bring balance to the Force? He is not the last of the Jedi but the first of a new order, having been trained without the constraints of the codex. By him creating a new Jedi Order as well as being responsible for the return of the Sith would bring the balance between good and evil.
  2. TaradosGon SWTV Mod - Like Palpatine with animals

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    Feb 28, 2003
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    Part of me fears that this is really the only place they can take the story and still keep it part of the "saga."

    If they wanted to start an all new trilogy of sorts, or films that fall outside of the "saga," then the door is wide open. But Episodes I-VI are about the rise and fall of the Empire and Vader's fall and redemption. How can VII-IX have anything to do with that? The Skywalker saga pretty much concluded with ROTS. And even if Luke appears in this Sequel Trilogy, speculation seems to be that it will be in a "passing the torch" type role, which would still imply that it has nothing to do with the Skywalker tale.

    Lucas at one point suggested that what the EU did with the post-ROTJ story was nothing like he would have done and insisted that Luke didn't get married (which I think would imply that he didn't have kids either unless Luke's having kids out of wedlock). So unless Lucas went back on that idea, then I think that shoots down the idea of the Skywalker story being carried on through Luke. Perhaps Leia has a kid and we see the Skywalker saga continued through Leia's bloodline with Han as the father. Though I don't know if Lucas would stick with the names Jaina and Jacen just as he borrowed Coruscant from the EU, or if he would do something totally different.

    And who would the villains be? The Empire? They seemed pretty fragmented and powerless at the end of ROTJ. Riots and celebrations are breaking out on Coruscant, and it just seems to undermine ROTJ if Luke and Vader didn't accomplish anything. Vader destroys the Sith and brings balance to the Force only for the Sith to pop up again, conquer the galaxy and the Force to get out of balance once more? Then what was the whole point of the prophecy of the prequels and the OT? If the Empire never fell completely, and if the Sith come back, it just seems like it undermines both trilogies that came before.

    So Luke passes the torch to his nephews and a new era of Jedi to fight...?
    Last edited by TaradosGon, Nov 1, 2012
  3. George Roper Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 31, 2012
    star 4
    Luke couldn't balance a cheque book.
  4. Darth_Darkmoon Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Nov 1, 2012
    If the new movies are really called Episodes VII, VIII and IX they must be connected somehow as the ongoing episodes imply a saga with a bigger story, a theme that carries through all of the episodes. Totally new stories in the Star Wars universe that are not connected to the other movies and the Skywalker saga would not need to be called Episodes VII, VIII and IX.

    I think that Disney will do real sequels that are connected to the stories as well as seperate movies taking place in different times and telling completely different stories.
  5. PrincessKenobi New Films Manager of DOOM

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    Aug 12, 2000
    star 6
    That would undo everything they've done. Now that will not stop them but it should.

    And by balance I think the force needed someone just as powerful ad Sidious to destroy him. There are still those force sensitive out there.


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  6. CoolyFett Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 3, 2003
    star 4
    Forget Luke, his story is over, bring on new characters, new talent, new action figures, leave the first generation of movies alone and Make some new starwars product NOT involving old people.
  7. Lars_Muul Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 2, 2000
    star 6
    I agree that the reemergence of the Sith would undermine the current saga. The whole trilogy would be a pointless extension of ROTJ. I think GL has something different up his sleeve, though.
    How could the ST have anything to do with I-VI, then? Well, GL has mentioned that the sequels would, amongst other things, be about Jedi Knighthood, justice, confrontation and passing on what you have learned. This trilogy could very well deal with the consequences of the Empire, the aftermath - war criminals brought to justice, people blaming people, feelings of guilt, that sort of thing. For instance, what happens if the citizens of the new Republic find out that Darth Vader was Luke and Leia's father? How does that affect the Skywalkers? Do they lose the trust of people they saw as their friends? If they've kept Vader's identity secret for 40 years, what does that say about them from the citizens' point of view?
    Could this generate a greater conflict in the long run? Those who oppose the new Jedi Order because they fear that the Sith will return vs those who support the Jedi?
    I think there's lots of potential there.





    Star Wars has greater potential
    /LM
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  8. Ben H. Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Oct 31, 2012
    First question, were there other Jedi that were alive at the end of ROTJ? Second question, did Darth Sideous and Darth Vader truly adhere to the "Two Sith Rule"? Third question, what about the conversation between Mace, Obi and Yoda in ROTS about the prophecy being misinterpreted? Finally, did the prophecy even refer to Anakin Skywalker in the first place? There were questions left unanswered by the movies so far.
    Last edited by Ben H., Nov 1, 2012
  9. Healer_Leona Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jul 7, 2000
    star 9
    Seriously I hope we don't have Sith in Ep7. I could see looking at that in a future movie, but lets get something fresh to invigorate the franchise. Rehashing the same old thing was what I disliked about the EU.
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  10. Darth_Darkmoon Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Nov 1, 2012
    They don't need to be Sith but someone succumbing to the Dark Side...
  11. Force Smuggler Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    As long as they don't bring back Jedi from the PT Jedi Order. I hope
  12. Lars_Muul Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 2, 2000
    star 6
    Darkmoon: Same thing, different name.





    The dark side is the dark side
    /LM
    Last edited by Lars_Muul, Nov 1, 2012
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  13. Lord Tuvitor Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 27, 2003
    star 4
    They don't have to be Sith to be evil and use a lightsaber. How about a corrupted Jedi who believes he/she is doing the right thing to save the galaxy, but continues to fall deeper into the Dark Side without any Sith influence, or a post-Luke scenario where the Jedi Order has become corrupt.
  14. TaradosGon SWTV Mod - Like Palpatine with animals

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    There's actually an idea that The Old Republic touches upon in which the normal beings of the Galaxy get sick of the Sith and Jedi controlling everything and pretty much begin a secret organization aimed at taking the Galaxy back for normal individuals with the long term goal of destroying both Sith and Jedi.

    That idea modified to fit into a post-ROTJ timeframe actually sounds interesting to me. That the Jedi could be getting sidelined as people are afraid of the Force and see the Jedi as some archaic organization that the Galaxy no longer needs since the Sith are gone and that their religion's influence in political matters is some uncivilized holdover from a previous era. And technological advances make the Jedi unnecessary and easier to kill. Play sort of a nature vs. technology or religion vs. strict rationality angle.

    Wouldn't know how to flesh that idea completely out into three films, and maybe the Jedi Order is dying as individuals are just packing up and leaving. The New Republic might keep them marginalized out of fear of what happened with the Clone War in which a Jedi turned to the Dark Side and split the government in two and then Palpatine turned out to be a Sith that built a Death Star and held the Galaxy at gun point.

    Don't have any ideas on who the big bad villain would be, but he/she will inevitably have a lightsaber I'm sure (though hopefully not a resurrected Palpatine nor a descendant of his).

    Rather about being restoring balance to the Force, it would be about simply keeping the Jedi Order alive in a changing Galaxy that doesn't value them anymore, and the injustices that are allowed to happen without the Jedi there to help.
  15. Healer_Leona Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jul 7, 2000
    star 9
    No turning to the darkside. OLD!

    I'm sure in the vast GFFA there's more than enough villains that can be brought out.
    JainaSoloYJK likes this.
  16. DM99 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 26, 2012
    star 3
    The last Sith are dead, so the last Jedi also needs to die, to bring balance to the force.
  17. TaradosGon SWTV Mod - Like Palpatine with animals

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    star 4
    I agree, but I'm not holding my breath. No Sith/Dark Jedi means nobody for the Jedi to engage in lightsaber duels with at the climax of each film. I'm pessimistic about the creators coming up with an equally engaging alternative.
  18. Lars_Muul Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 2, 2000
    star 6
    Your idea ties in well with mine, TG. I'm not as pessimistic about their ability to come up with worthy adversaries to the Jedi who don't wield lightsabers, though. ROTS already introduced electrostaffs. I'm sure GL has more ideas. We still have yet to see space pirates led by a real badass captain, for example ;)
    There could be a former Jedi who comes out of hiding, though - one who has lost faith in the ways of the Force. For instance, Sifo-Dyas.





    The Force is in dispute
    /LM
    Last edited by Lars_Muul, Nov 1, 2012
  19. Darth_Darkmoon Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Nov 1, 2012
    I thought about the villain... Palpatine said that Darth Plagueis was looking for the secret to eternal life. What if Palpatine found this secret... Not that I would think it a good idea to bring him back.
  20. Lars_Muul Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 2, 2000
    star 6
    GL has said in the past that in his version of what happens after ROTJ, Palpatine doesn't come back.





    Sidious is a goner
    /LM
  21. chicago103 Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Nov 1, 2012
    A combination of this and what the original poster said. Except the the organization you mention should be a group of force sensitives who simply reject the idea of light side and dark side and just want to use the force and reject the dogmatic dualism of the Jedi and the Sith. The sequel trilogy could be about shades of grey and moderation versus dogmatic absolutism and the outcome of that conflict is how balance is brought to the force. Now that is quite cerebral and philosophical for the average movie goer but it is similar to something I remember reading regarding what George Lucas said about the sequel trilogy and really it is the only place the story can go and still keep a common theme of some kind. The idea of a prophecy to bring balance to the force is brought up in TPM and thus it is something that should be resolved in IX. The PT and OT have conflict themes that have already been used, in the PT the Sith (bad guys) win, in the OT the Jedi (good guys) win and with the latter from a more moral simplistic standpoint that settles the matter, the good guys just won right? More Jedi defeating Sith or visa versa would just be redundant, the next moralistic victory has to evolve beyond the traditional dogmatic boundaries of good and bad in order to be fresh. Balance could come in both the Jedi and Sith not so much becoming extinct but rather evolving to the point that neither is polarizing each other, a peace is reached by realizing they are just two different schools of thought on the force, the only "evil" that exists is the false pretext of conflict.

    I think when Palpatine tempted Anakin by saying "in order to understand the great mystery you must go beyond the narrow dogmatic view of the Jedi and embrace a larger view of the force" he was in fact was reading Anakin's mind about what he wanted the Jedi to be in order to balance the force in an attempt to manipulate him, Palatine's true motivations were evil and to institute the dogma of the Sith and the dark side. The Jedi are flawed but honest about their motivations even if they know you don't want to hear it whereas the Sith are flawed but will try to deceive you by telling you what you want to hear.
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  22. EviL_eLF Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 16, 2003
    star 4
    The Galaxy is a very large place. Just because 2 Sith we know of died doesn't mean there wasn't another in hiding somewhere.

    I have always believed as long as there is light, there is darkness, and in the Star Wars universe, as long as there are Jedi there are Sith.
  23. StarWarsFan91 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 14, 2008
    star 4
    Even if all the Sith did die in the star wars universe in ROTJ.....doesn't mean the Sith could never come back.

    For there are 3 THINGS that are needed to make a Sith.

    1. Evil

    2. Darkside

    3. Sith Ideology, which can be found in ancient ruins of sith civilization

    I don't see how the Jedi or good guys, could get rid of those things, how do you destroy the dark side, or the evil nature that can exist in Man? Or how do you destroy an idea, the beliefs of the Sith?
    EviL_eLF likes this.
  24. Darth_Darkmoon Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Nov 1, 2012
    The balance between good and evil, light and darkness has to be found. Maybe Palpatine was right, but the temptations of the dark side are very strong. So resisting those temptations while still having to find the balance will be very difficult and maybe it is this, the new force-users must master. And Luke must realize this, he must accept that there always will be evil and that there cannot be a good/light side only.
  25. chicago103 Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Nov 1, 2012
    Yes and also some Sith perhaps realizing that the dark side can never have a lasting domination over the Jedi, it is the constant conflict that actually works against their philosophy. I actually for years had discussions with a fellow Star Wars fan that is a close friend of mine about there being two types of sith; pragmatic sith and devout sith. Examples of "devout sith" are Palpatine and Darth Maul, they are purely about the destruction of the Jedi and total domination over the Sith and everyone else and in some cases melicious evil simply for the sake of it. Examples of "pragmatic sith" are Darth Vader and Count Dooku, they are more about using power for practical gains and are willing to co-opt Jedi and the government in order to improve it and live in eventual peaceful coexistence. Just think of the parallels between Vader tempting Luke and Dooku tempting Obi-Wan, they both claimed to want to kill Palpatine/Sidious and end the destructive conflict. On the flip side there are devout Jedi (Yoda, Obi-Wan) and pragmatic Jedi (Qui-Gon Jinn, perhaps Luke). So really the sequel trilogy could be about four different factions or more simply about moderates of both sides and extremists of both sides. The dogmatic factions want to go to war and the moderate factions want to compromise in order to attain peace. Gosh, this could all be a very elabore commentary about political polarization in the United States and elsewhere all with awesome lightsaber battles and action along the way.