Based on events from RotS: Luke retains the Skywalker name

Discussion in 'Revenge of the Sith' started by TheOutlawJedi, Dec 14, 2005.

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  1. TheOutlawJedi Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 25, 2004
    star 2
    This has bothered me for awhile, and I cant seem to find anything other than speculation on why Luke was been " Hidden from his father" yet was given his last name. The book Dark Lord goes into a little bit about Ben looking over baby Luke, and after a holovid, discovers that Anakin had indeed survived the duel. But this does not, as the films do, truly explain why Luke is a Skywalker in name.

    Based on events from RotS, where Yoda tell Obi Wan that he hopes the twins can destroy the Sith(they believe Anakin to be dead at this point in the story), this could possibly be one reason, although Palps would surely recognize the Skywalker hertitage if by chance he were to discover it. Was it just normal for the Lars to give him his birthrite? Did Obi Wan say anything to them at the end of RotS? We see nothing in the films that would support that he had told them or suggested Luke was to keep his fathers name. In theory I can only speculate several options:

    1: Tattooine is a remote planet, far the empires grasp.
    This option doesnt cut it for me, its to risky.

    2: Obi Wan, nor Yoda, suggested that anything be mentioned to the Lars, the Lars chose to give Luke his birthrite.
    This option is very likely, although, haveing Ol' Ben around to protect Luke, suugests that the baby could be in danger, so why advertise Luke to the Sith?

    3: The Jedi, Ben and Yoda, wanted Luke to have his name sake, knowing that the Force will one day bring Luke to begin his own journey, his own destiny, and knowing that neither Obi or Padme could appeal to Anakin in the end, Luke would only be able to follow his own path and cousre in life as Anakins son, and truly walk in the footprints of his father, as we see him do in so many aspects.
    I think this option is about as spot on as you can get, I would like to hear any feedback on this, or anyother of the options for that matter.

    4: The Jedi anticipate Anakins weakness and hope that Luke Skywalker will appeal to whats left of Anakin Skywalker, also known as the "redemption theory" that many of you have heard about. Through the Force, the Jedi find out that the Chosen One can return, and follow his destiny, and destroy the Sith, as only he can do.
    This option is also possible, however, there is not a whole lot of evidence to support it, but the general opinion of many fans beleieve the this is a likely scenario.

    After watching Ep. 3, and during the events that unfold, in the end, why do we not see an answere to this? Is there something we are missing?


  2. AnnLouise Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jul 10, 2005
    star 3
    I think that reasons 3 & 4 are pretty good. The explaination in Dark Lord is after the fact patching up to explain something that seems pretty stupid after ROTS. But since the PT Jedi are written as a bunch of narrow minded, not-very-perceptive dimwits, giving Luke his family name is just their style.
    Also, since Anakin did "die" and was reborn as Vader, Luke is carrying on the family name. In a way. I guess.
  3. Obi-Chron Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 11, 2003
    star 4
    The boy is Sith-bait!

    "Here Sithy, Sithy, Sithy!!!!!" [face_shhh]
  4. TheOutlawJedi Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 25, 2004
    star 2
    I too agree, that 3 and 4 are the likely reasons, but what do we have to support them?

    In the RotS book, Obi Wan said that if Anakin survived with the dangers of Tattoine, so could Luke. We can also assume that thee Jedi wanted Luke to grow up like Anakin did, in a family atmosphere, but why would Luke need to be a Skywalker in name, for this? It did not seem to effect his sister any. Leaning towards the option #4, it would seem the Jedi believed that Luke would appeal to Anakin. This would also seem very risky, and the Jedi cant just flat out announce it to Luke.

    I dont think they did it narrow-mindedly, the twins are the New Hope after all, I think they realized the importance of their future, and did not act hastly about it. Yoda did say in the end of RotS, that when the time was right , the Force would be bring the twins into action, and their training would begin.
  5. AnnLouise Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jul 10, 2005
    star 3
    well, for #3, Obi-Wan, IMO, wants to honor the memory of the friend he lost, who he thinks is dead. So the son will carry on the name. The real reason is that GL didn't make Luke and Vader related until after ANH, and couldn't change the main characters name
  6. Fat_Bird Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jul 1, 2005
    star 2
    You're putting way too much thought into this. The answer is quite obvious. Darth Vader wasn't Luke's father when ANH was made. Any other reason is just you trying to make the events of the PT fit the OT.
  7. TheOutlawJedi Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 25, 2004
    star 2
    Ofcourse I realize that GL didnt have this story figured out all in the begining, I guess I'm just curious WHY GL didnt explain this at the end of RotS when he had a chance, or infact, that he did in some fashion, like commentary, quotes or anything. That would be the question I'm asking, and I do appreciate your answeres, and would like to hear your questions aswell. Thanks-
  8. TheOutlawJedi Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 25, 2004
    star 2
    Putting way to much thought into this? Well, thats why many visit these forums right? To discuss and THINK about Star Wars.

    The events of the PT and OT should fit together, perhaps they do in regard to tjis topic, for you, it doesnt fit for me. And like the reply for the other poster above, which I appreciate your respose, is I'm aware that GL didnt have Vader as Lukes father originally, however, he had the opportunity, to explain some things with the release of the PT's, and in this case, I'm want to figure out if he actually did, and we havent noticed yet, thats all[face_peace]

  9. Count-Tyranus Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jul 7, 2005
    star 2
    Why not? Only a handful of people know Anakin Skywalker is Darth Vader.
  10. Fat_Bird Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jul 1, 2005
    star 2
    I think anyone who sits around trying to make events in the OT and PT make sense in relation to each other is putting way too much thought into it (especially when it comes to ANH). Certainly more thought than GL put into things. [face_laugh]

    When ANH was made, Luke's father and Vader were different characters. To try to come up with some REAL reason why Luke kept the Skywalker name when it should have made it easy for Vader to find him is kind of pointless to me. You're trying to make a valid reason out of something that is pretty foolish once it is revealed that Vader is Luke's father. No way would his last name had been Skywalker if Vader was going to be Anakin Skywalker all along. ;)
  11. TheOutlawJedi Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 25, 2004
    star 2
    Correct, and even if the Jedi believed Vader to be dead all the way up until ANH, is still not a good enough reson for Luke to carry his father name, why not go by Luke Lars. We know that wasnt going to happen obviously, but Perhaps Lucas has clarified the backstory to this and I just havent got it, who knows, I'm confusing myself[face_thinking]
  12. TheOutlawJedi Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 25, 2004
    star 2
    Listen, I completely understand what your saying, maybe I am puting to much thought into it, but its my choice, and if you dont want to wrap your mind around this, that is yours.[face_peace]

    Wait, Star Wars isnt REAL? j/k;)
  13. JediCouncilMember Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 15, 2003
    star 4
    A few things, Vader was told Padme was dead therefor he never knew he had any children, so the name Skywalker (on Tatooine) wasn't really a threat.
    Anyone in the Empire that knew Anakin was Vader (Emperor, who else knows?) believe Padme is dead and she was buried pregnant.
    No body was looking for him up till after ANH.

    And the number of people on Tatooine that could tie Luke Skywalker to Darth Vader is 3 (Obi-Wan, Owen and Beru), and they ain't talkin.
    I mean Owen told Luke his father was a Spice Freighter (or something) during the Clone Wars.

    Also about Tatooine:

    "The Republic doesn't exist out here." - Shmi

    "If your son was born in the Republic he would have been identified quickly" - Qui-Gon

    "If there is a place furtherest from the center of the galaxy this is it." - Luke

    The was no imperial presence on Tatooine until Leia went looking for General Kenobi and C3PO and R2 landed there in the escape pods.

    Plus even when the Empire comes to get the plans Vader never steps foot on the planet, yet he goes down to Hoth, goes to Cloud City, and goes to Endor.

    I think Yoda and Obi both knew that there was no way Vader would find out about Luke prematurely as long as he was on Tatooine.

    Edit:

    One more quote:
    "this place is a haven for those that don't wish to be found"

  14. TheOutlawJedi Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 25, 2004
    star 2
    Those are all very good points, and Leia has the name Organa because of obvious connectoin to her stepfather and senator, to protect her because she will be in the "center of the galaxy".

  15. voodoopuuduu Classic Trilogy Trivia Host

    Game Host
    Member Since:
    Mar 22, 2004
    star 5
    One of the most common explanations is that Skywalker is a very very common name in the GFFA, like Smith or Jones. But I like the dim witted Jedi one too. :D

  16. TheOutlawJedi Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 25, 2004
    star 2
    I guess Luke Skywalker is a little better that Luke Smith.;)
  17. SithStarSlayer Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Oct 23, 2003
    star 6
    There are no telltale events/signs or any reasons in ROTS for anyone to draw a logical conclusion regarding Luke's last name.

    It's that simple.

    The EU provides IT'S OWN LOGIC, but too many here that are quick to thrash the EU under their feet.

    Seems there are two types of fans. (aside from the usual PT vs OT debaters) Those who only embrace the films, and those embrace the WHOLE STAR WARS experience...


    It's funny to me that most of the FILM ONLY Fans don't know how much of the EU that has been incorporated into the films, Names... Planets... History... etc.



    Like it or not, the Expanded Universe is as much STAR WARS as the films are.



    EDIT: If it were not so, then George would never have allowed it.:D
  18. yoshifett Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 17, 2004
    star 5
    SithStarSlayer, those are fighting words! :mad:
    Nice bait though I'm not going to take it. I'll let someone else explain the reason why some people are not down with the EU cough*Luuke*cough...
  19. voodoopuuduu Classic Trilogy Trivia Host

    Game Host
    Member Since:
    Mar 22, 2004
    star 5
    But since the PT Jedi are written as a bunch of narrow minded, not-very-perceptive dimwits, giving Luke his family name is just their style.

    Yeah, based on that, a few lines need to be changed in Episode V so the trilogies merge better.


    YODA: Run! Yes. A Jedi's strength flows from the Force. But beware of
    the dark side. Anger...fear...aggression.....INTELLIGENCE. The dark side of the Force
    are they. Easily they flow, quick to join you in a fight. If once you
    start down the dark path, forever will it dominate your destiny,
    consume you it will, as it did Obi-Wan's apprentice.

    LUKE: Vader. Is the dark side stronger?

    YODA: No...no...no. Quicker, easier, more seductive, MUCH SMARTER.

    LUKE: But how am I to know the good side from the bad?

    YODA: You will NOT know. When you are calm, at peace. Passive. A Jedi uses
    the Force for STUPIDITY and defense, never for attack. :D :p
  20. TheOutlawJedi Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 25, 2004
    star 2
    Well, off-topic for a sec, the EU is Stars Wars, it keeps it going and explains plot holes and fills moments in between movies with more story, the only problem is what some consider to be "cannon". Its fun to debate and use EU as some guidelines for theory's, but in the end they are only theory's until proven correct. Which can only be done by Lucas. However, we can all see the movies for what we want and make up our own minds on how we see them.

    On-topic, This thread is base in theory, being Yoda or Obi Wan never discuss that Luke to remain safely annonomys(bad spelling) although his sister has. And I agree with many things others have had to say, but in a sense of " in order" of watching these films, it just makes to see how going from RotS to ANH effect how Luke will be handled, from a story point of view and the Jedi's point of view. Does that make sense?
  21. CJedi72 Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Sep 29, 2005
    star 4


    Bingo, please don't read anything into the original SW because all the Skywalker family drama was not written by Lucas yet, he did have many ideas where the saga goes, but that is why, though it is my favorite of all 6 and still my favorite movie of all time, it sticks out like a sore thumb when watching it in 1-6 order.

    Plus, I always this was a plot hole from the OT, but I always justified it by not knowing exactly who Uncle Owen was related to, and not knowing where Anakin came from, so there could be no coincidences.

    Fast forward to the PT, Lucas makes Anakin born on Tatooine, and in AOTC he visits the house of his now step-brother, Uncle Owen, who now owns C-3PO, also arriving with Anakin is R2-D2, and this will be the same house Luke Skywalker will grow up for 20 years. That is one of the worst thought out scenes by Lucas in the whole saga. I wonder sometimes if he watched the movies as much as we did.
  22. DINVADER_RETURNS Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Mar 10, 2003
    star 3
    Fast forward to the PT, Lucas makes Anakin born on Tatooine, and in AOTC he visits the house of his now step-brother, Uncle Owen, who now owns C-3PO, also arriving with Anakin is R2-D2, and this will be the same house Luke Skywalker will grow up for 20 years. That is one of the worst thought out scenes by Lucas in the whole saga. I wonder sometimes if he watched the movies as much as we did.

    Actually if you had only seen the prequels first, most of this would be a non issue.

    The fact that Kenobi said Owen thought Anakin should have "stayed HERE and not gotten involved." always implied to me that Anakin was from Tatooine. Owen saw R2 for like 5 minutes in EP2, and we already know how common looking R2 units and 3PO type protocol droids are. 3PO was rust gray looking, while 22 years later when Owen sees him again he is gold. Being there are so many types of these, why would Owen automatically assume they were the same droids? Especially considering 3PO had a new paintjob. Owen might have figured it out if he wasn't dead the next day. It seems to me Owen regards droids as appliances, not talkbuddies to have around the house as Luke does. C3PO would'nt be able to say he was once the droid that lived at the homestead, being his memory was erased.

    Seriously though, if Luke did not have the last name Skywalker, then how would have Vader and the Emperor discover him by the time of ESB, maybe they'd discover had force potential, but how would they guess he was Anakin's son other than his last name??
  23. TheOutlawJedi Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 25, 2004
    star 2
    I've also thought this was huge plot hole, and I guess I expected something more from RotS in regard to this topic.
  24. JediCouncilMember Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 15, 2003
    star 4
    But it is not a plot hole.

    There is just no reason for the Empire or anyone to suspect that there is another Skywalker.

    Here are the people that know about Luke:

    Yoda, Obi, Bail, Owen and Beru. That is it!

    Vader was told Padme died with her still being pregnant, and I'm sure if he didn't actually see the funeral he read about it in the Courscant Times: "Senator Amidala is Dead"...Senator Amidala died from unknown causes this past week. She was pregnant and the father was unknown.

    I'm sure it was quite the scandal.

    Why would anyone on Tatooine even make the connection between Luke and Vader? Only 3 people on the planet know who his father is and two of them lie about what he did, and Obi is a "crazy old wizard".

    No one on Tatooine really cares what your last name is. The Planet is loaded with criminals to begin with.

    "Mos Eisley Spaceport. You'll never find a more wretched hive of scum and villany" - Obi-Wan

  25. yoshifett Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 17, 2004
    star 5
    Well, that's actually not why Lucas allows the EU. And to imply that you must enjoy the EU to fully appreiciate SW is even more ridiculous.

    ?There are two worlds here,? explained Lucas. ?There?s my world, which is the movies, and there?s this other world that has been created, which I say is the parallel universe ? the licensing world of the books, games and comic books. They don?t intrude on my world, which is a select period of time, [but] they do intrude in between the movies. I don?t get too involved in the parallel universe.?

    Cinescape interview, 2002

    Don't put too much faith in the EU. It's glorified fanfiction that cannot stand up to the legacy the films have left.

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