VIDEO Batman: Arkham City (Arkham Asylum 2)

Discussion in 'Games' started by Reynar_Tedros, Dec 12, 2009.

  1. Valyn Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 2, 2002
    star 8
    Finished the game; disappointed. Arkham Asylum was better imo. This game had cool moments, but it was short and the story was no better than the worst TAS episodes, imo.

    Conroy's lines too often sounded like something West's Batman would say. Definitely not worthy of TAS.

    Plus the costume looks lame :/
  2. Darth_Invidious Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jun 21, 1999
    star 5
    You've hardly finished the game if you haven't cleared the side missions and everything else. I have to disagree with you; the story was hardly dissapointing. Perhaps too short if you do nothing but (which I believe was Rocksteady's intention, fill the city with missions and Riddles so as to distract you from that fact), but not worse than Asylum's, which in short was just another attempt by Joker to break the Bat and bring him down to his level. The stakes were considerably higher in Arkham City.

    I always thought Conroy's delivery in AA was...off. His Batman sounded too tame and nice. At least this time around he put an edge to his performance. And the costume is the same one he wore in Arkham Asylum. What's so lame about it? It's virtually the classic Bat costume with a few tweaks here and there. What did you want? Tim Burton's or Nolan's?
  3. Valyn Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 2, 2002
    star 8
    It just didn't look right. It looked too bright and too drab at the same time.


    And I'm sorry, but you're complaining about campaign challenges not really qualifying as something relevant to the campaign, so why should every single riddle count as part of the game's story/campaign?

    I've done side missions and so forth, just not all of them. I shouldn't need to in order to determine the quality/length of the game's story.

    And when I say Arkham Asylum was better, I meant that maybe because it was groundbreaking for Batman games. I expected much more from the sequel. I expected some real tension between Batman and Catwoman (seeing as how she's in so many ads). I expected more interaction, more dialogue, more intensity between those two characters.

    Instead, it was mostly:
    Batman: "Oh hi, Catwoman, you're here too?"
    Catwoman:
    "Yeah. I'm stealing."
    Batman: "Oh. You shouldn't."
    Catwoman: "Well, it doesn't matter what I do because you'll hardly see me anyway."
    Batman: "Hmm...true. Carry on, I guess."

    And then Talia...what. the. hell.

    Talia gets shot and Batman walks out carrying JOKER instead of Talia?!

    The drama between Batman and Talia could have been played into more, therefore solidifying some sort of story.


    You say that the stakes were higher this time around. Sure. But not once was I ever really made to care about the stakes. Oh, the scum of Gotham are sealed off and about to die. Talia wants to kill Joker. Batman just gives us a lame, "No, you shouldn't. No, murder is bad, mmmkay?" There was no intensity, no drama, nothing. It was just a cookie cutter of Batman characteristics without any of the substance.

    For example, The Dark Knight featured a Batman who wouldn't kill--but it also made you understand and empathize why he won't.

    Arkham City was just...dry and bland. Batman doesn't kill, so he won't even when Talia tries to argue with him about it. "Well, I'm Batman and killing's bad, mmkay?"


    I enjoyed playing the game, yes. But there's no way it's living up to it's premature "Game of the Year" hype.
  4. Darth_Invidious Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jun 21, 1999
    star 5
    The stakes were higher because Arkham City was just stage one of Ra's plan to -- once again - destroy Gotham and, somehow, once again seduce the Detective to become his heir. First with a purge of its most worthless inhabitants, then the rest. Perhaps they were just as high in AA since Joker wanted to create an army of monsters while at the same time bring Batman down to his level, but I guess the execution of that plan sort of fell apart at the end (what can you expect from a lunatic, anyways) that it felt flat to me.

    Yeah, the ending custscene disturbed me. Maybe this Batman didn't care that much about Talia (and let's face it, she IS an annoying b*tch of a daddy's girl, in this and any other continuity; that's why I've always rooted for Selina). But Batman lovingly cradling?s Joker?s dead carcass out of there was just wrong.

    I?ve stated it elsewhere in this thread: Catwoman could have ? should have ? been handled better, but this isn?t a Catwoman game. Nor should we have expected her to be his sidekick even though the early promos might have deluded us into that notion. I know I wanted more of her in the game. Maybe we'll get it for game 3.

    I complained that the challenge ?campaigns? are tedious and repetitive. The Riddler?s trophie puzzles and riddles were anything but and were always fun to crack. And there?s a purpose to them. Maybe you forgot but the Riddler got himself some hostages. The only way to get to each and every of their locations is by resolving all riddles and collecting all trophies. Yeah, all 400+ of ?em. Maybe it?s tedious, but the payoff was oh so sweet. I?m afraid if you only played the game for the story just to get it out of the way and forgot about everything else, you deprived yourself not even of half the game, but I daresay nearly all of it.

    To me, it?s GOTY; Skyrim can go to hell for all I care. It?s superior to its predecessor in every single way. And once the alternate skin packs are available, I?ll do a playthrough alternating Bats appearance on every other game load.
  5. JediKnight20043 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 18, 2004
    star 5

    Lol there is a whole lot of fanboy going on there. Skyrim is a better game by far. And I really like Arkham City, but Skyrim is a different class.
  6. Darth_Invidious Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jun 21, 1999
    star 5
    Not really. Skyrim simply doesn't do it for me. I let Bethesda own me with Fallout 3 solely because it was an awesome game not set in a medieval fantasy setting. I tried it, but I just couldn't swallow it. It doesn't help either that I've never played any previous Elder Scroll game so I just don't know diddly squat about the lore.

    And anyways, someone here's gotta stand up for the goddam Batman.
  7. Dark Lady Mara Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 19, 1999
    star 7
    I'M THE G.D. BATMAN AND I'M PLAYING THE G.D. NEW GAME PLUS.

    Regarding the Riddler trophies and the story progression, I liked that this game provided an actual reason for why Batman has to run around picking up stupid question marks (unlike Arkham Asylum).
  8. Valyn Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 2, 2002
    star 8
    I think Yahtzee of the Escapist kind of feels the same way I do about Arkham City (ie. bigger doesn't always mean better).

  9. Darth-Vassago Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 28, 2004
    star 5
    Please, name three of four moments when Conroy's Batman sounded anything, and I mean...anything...like West's. As noted, the costume is essentially the same as it was in the first game, if not slightly improved (more details, better facial animation, etc.) For it to look "too bright and too drab" at the same time is relatively impossible.

    Because, they were misnamed. That's why. We aren't complaining because they aren't relevant to the campaign, we are complaining because the name is downright misleading. There's nothing "campaign" about them. Riddler trophies, while yes, are meant as a distraction, add up to something and the riddles definitely lend to the story with them unlocking Arkham Stories, etc. Also, to get closure on the Riddler you have to find all of the trophies/riddles.
    The side missions also lend to the game quite a bit. If you strip this puppy down and just have the main storyline, I think everyone would cry foul. The side quests are there for a reason. Look at a game like Skyrim; take out the side quests and you have a straight forward march. Get it?

    No, you should.

    I see a lot of you building Catwoman up to be more than she was. You expected tension, you expected interaction, you expected dialogue, you expected intensity...all based on some ads that include Catwoman? Wow, seems like a lot of real estate is placed in some posters and trailers these days, huh? Ice T (or whoever) was promoting Gears 3 and was at almost every event it was shown at, yet his character had about 5 collective minutes of screen time. THAT'S misleading. Catwoman saves Batman. Seems kind of crucial to me.

    Really? I think we've all said this and I'm going to go ahead and guess Rocksteady has more of an explanation for this down the road, either through DLC or just a flat out comment on it. Or, maybe, since this Arkhamverse they've constructed is not the canon universe and the comics/source are not 100% followed, maybe...just maybe...Batman and Talia aren't quite as close as they were in the comics. However, I believe it is stated she's the only man Batman will ever love and oh me, oh my. Guess that'll just have to be a gripe everyone shares.

  10. Darth_Invidious Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jun 21, 1999
    star 5
    Thanks for the backup, Vassago. You can always put things more eloquently than I can. I think Batman fans, both hardcore and casual (I guess I fall somewhere in between), came into this game with very high expectations and preconceptions. I'm included in that bunch and though certain things annoyed me, I remember that when all is said and done, it's a excellent video game and just one vision of the Batman and his world. It's not the comics version. It's not TAS (regardless on who voices Bats and Joker). It's not any of the movies. Things will be different, but at the same time similar.

    Anyhoo, Perfect Knight Day 2 is done. What to do now? Put on Ezio Auditore's cowl for one last stabby-stabby ride or give another try to glitchy, buggy (but by all appearances GOTY) Skyrim just to see if I'm being too harsh with it?
  11. Darth-Vassago Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 28, 2004
    star 5
    No worries. [face_peace]

    I'm waiting on New Game+ to get new skins. I'm dying for that Year One skin.

    In the mean time I've been holding over with Saints Row 3 and Skyrim. I'm enjoying both, the former a bit more than the latter. It's not that I don't particularly like Skyrim, because I do...I think it's great...it's just that Saints is that "mindless fun" I need when I get home to take a nice break. Ezio and his grand finale are waiting on my dresser for whenever I get to them. Not that AC: R is a crap game or it's being saved for last, I just haven't been in an Assassin mood lately.
  12. Valyn Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 2, 2002
    star 8
    Vassago, you seem to be taking my criticisms about a game personally. Did you have a hand in making it? No? Okay then.

    The game disappointed me. It suffers from a disappointing ending, glitchy combat, weak (cliched) dialogue, and lack of length.

    Does completing all sidequests make it longer? Yes. But collecting trophies doesn't improve upon the weak story.

    Also, one can play ocarina of time without doing all side quests and still feel that they played an epic game. If I collect all trophies and save every hostage, I'm still left with faulty combat, lame dialogue, and lackluster story.
  13. Reynar_Tedros Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 3, 2006
    star 6
    I can understand other complaints, but this one does not compute. It's probably the slickest combat system I've ever gotten my hands on.
  14. Valyn Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 2, 2002
    star 8
    As Invidious also noted, there are times when the combos simply stop working. It's not as glaring a flaw as the others though.
  15. Penguinator RPF Modinator and Batmanager

    Manager
    Member Since:
    May 23, 2005
    star 6
    Having put down Arkham City for the past while in favour of not failing classes, I've had a chance to think about it more.

    I still have issues with characterization, but hey, that's been done to death, and I don't stand a chance of swaying some of you in your opinions. :p Fair enough, my thoughts on story and setting are that I'm trying to appreciate it more for what it is instead of what it isn't. Nolan did his own thing, the West folks did their own thing (which does get a bad rap, unfairly so) and so are Rocksteady. It all boils down to Batman being completely applicable to so many interpretations.

    If I want something other than what the game is offering, I'll just go read a comic. Great game, marred by some flaws. I think the next chapter in Batman games, if it's a sequel or something new, is going to build off this quite well. Bar gets set higher each game, so hopefully we'll get to deal with sprawling, towering Gotham City in the near future.

    What's everyone looking for in a sequel?
  16. Darth-Vassago Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 28, 2004
    star 5
    Okay, simple solution: play Ocarina of Time and not Arkham City.

    As for a sequel, I think Ra's should make a full return and not be a "background" character. However, in all likelihood, I think Scarecrow will be a huge part of the next game (given the hidden stuff on the boat and the impact of the hidden stuff from the previous game). The only thing that I can really ask for in the next game is less "campaign" challenge maps. :p
  17. Darth_Invidious Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jun 21, 1999
    star 5
    Hey guys, let's try to keep this civil. I don't know what Valyn expected from the game, but if it dissapointed him, that's that. If I were to guess, a lot of it has to due with the sorta open world sandbox setting of this game, whereas in AA things were decidedly more lineal and focused. But considering Valyn liked Spider-man 2 and similar Spidey games that have sort of mantained a big open world setting, I'm guessing his main beef solely lies with the very short main story within that big open world full of distractions, side missions and perhaps too many villains. Arguments can be thrown back and forth about the virtues and flaws of Rocksteady's decisions in this game, but ultimately I vote in their favor. And anyways, had the sequel been set in GOTHAM City itself, what other choice would there have been but to make the setting an open world sandbox, with your inmediate modes of transportation being either the Batmobile (PLEASE Rocksteady, give us a driveable and fully armed Batmobile next time around!) or the Batwing. Maybe next time, Rocksteady should ditch all Riddler stuff (be it trophies and riddles since at this point it's been done to death), drive the story a bit longer instead of just setting it on yet another very long night. Finally keep it focused on just a set number of villains (Ra?s, with Hush and Scarecrow as his agents/servants/cronies). Azrael will still be in the shadows, still watching and waiting to ?judge? Bats on his actions. And yeah, Catwoman should return and get a better treatment than what she got. And at some point in the game when things are at their bleakest, Bats should just remove his cowl, kiss and make sweet angry love to her in a rooftop before going off to that last boss fight and save the world?or just Gotham (again).


    Yes, I did note that. But after spending a ridiculous amount of time doing the combat challenges and campaigns (and also gawking at the insane leaderboard scores), I?m afraid I have to conclude that the combos stops only if you let them stop, either by countering when there?s no need to, by not jumping to your next target when you have to, or by simply letting yourself get hit like a punk. Sometimes the game will help you, but as the crowd starts to whittle, you have to keep an eye on available targets so as to not break your combo. And on that rare instance when I finished a round with a 100-hit red hued focused combo, I couldn?t help but grin from ear to ear and take back all I said about the combat system.



  18. Valyn Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 2, 2002
    star 8
  19. Valyn Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 2, 2002
    star 8
    I think Invid understands where I'm coming from. Bigger isn't better when you're throwing in a ton of characters with little screen time and plot. I like the open world. I just wish they hadn't sacrificed good writing to do it.

    I still recommend the game to my friends and my combat gripes are very small. Regarding the costume...it's just not intimidating. It looks silly. But maybe Batman's traditional costume/colors is/are just silly.
  20. Darth_Invidious Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jun 21, 1999
    star 5
    Jaysis, dude. Again with the costume. And once again, it's pretty much the same comic book costume! I swear, you wanted either Bale's or Keaton's, which looked good on screen but are NOT the traditional Bat-suit. If anything, the game's costume is a perfect amalgam of his original or Year One variant with the sole black batshield and darker look with that of more modern versions. At least the cape, cowl, gloves and boots aren't the inexplicably bright blue of the 70's/early 80's. Wait 'til next week or so, DL the alternate skin packs and play with either the Year One version, the Batman Inc. TAS' or Beyond's to see if the'yre more to your liking. You can't go wrong with TAS. Problem is, your Batman will look like a toon, which is ok in a surreal kind of way. I'm kinda dissapointed that the armored version you could unlock in Asylum didn't make the cut.

    As whether the costume -- whichever version -- intimidates or not, you're thinking in R/L terms. In the real world, a guy that'd go around fighting crime dressed like a damned bat would be deemed either a fool, a lunatic or simply a Batman wannabe looking to suffer serious bodily harm. After all, in R/L everyone knows Batman is a piece of fiction, meant for us to suspend our disbelief into imagining that a man with the means and the will to do so can dress like a bat, scare the crap out of the superstitious and cowardly lot and kick their asses like nobody's business. Like Liam Ra's more or less said, theatricality is just a means to an end. Batman doesn't rely solely on the costume to intimidate; it's what else he can do while wearing it that makes him intimidating. For example, if I saw in R/L a guy wearing a bat costume -- or any other costume -- pretending to be a crimefighter, I'd LOL too. But I wouldn't be intimidated if he were to suddenly grab me, talking to me with a voice grating thunder while suspending me in mid air by my ankle, hanging from a 20 story building. No, I wouldn't be intimidated. I'd be scared #!@+less, praying to God not to let this thing kill me! I think that's the point you're missing regarding Bats and the suit.
  21. Penguinator RPF Modinator and Batmanager

    Manager
    Member Since:
    May 23, 2005
    star 6
    With regards to defending the game and critiquing it, in the end it's all just criticism, though, and that shouldn't mar anyone's enjoyment of the game.
  22. Darth-Vassago Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 28, 2004
    star 5
    When does Robin come out? Tomorrow?

    I already have him, just trying to throw a reminder out for everyone else. I'm still waiting on that DLC costume pack. Year One, please. :-B
  23. Darth_Invidious Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jun 21, 1999
    star 5
    I haven't bought Nightwing because I'm not really sure I'd wanna spend so much for storyless challenges. Same thing goes for Robin, I guess.

    The skin pack supposedly comes out 12/6. I rented Year One yesterday thinking that skin would come with the DVD. No luck there. Either you gotta buy the actual retail DVD or it'll come out later.
  24. Penguinator RPF Modinator and Batmanager

    Manager
    Member Since:
    May 23, 2005
    star 6
    Yeah, he's now out.

    In other news, I HATE BEING UP THIS LATE. Or early?
  25. Darth_Invidious Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jun 21, 1999
    star 5
    I guess that'd be early. It's one of those "depending your point of view" things, of course. :p