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Bolsheviks on the JC? Or, the Have's and the Have-not's strike again.

Discussion in 'Communications' started by Wattowatta, May 6, 2002.

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  1. KnightWriter

    KnightWriter Administrator Emeritus star 9 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Nov 6, 2001
    Exactly, and when they do post spam, other admins should come along and close the threads, which is precisely what happened.


    Or a moderator could do what was suggested a few posts ago, which is send a private message asking the moderator in question to close their own thread.

    Just a thought.
     
  2. jediguy

    jediguy Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jun 10, 2000
    What's your underlying point, Watto? That some moderators didn't deserve their position, or that too many moderators abuse that position, or a combination of both?
     
  3. Aragorn327

    Aragorn327 Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Aug 20, 2001
    well I would have to say that while you bring up good points, what you have attempeted to do (start a debate to help change the situation) isn't working

    It has only started a debate.(bordering on turning into a flame war)

    Unless people start coming up with ideas to fix this problem, I would have to agree with MJS that...

    "This thread is teh suck... "
     
  4. Wattowatta

    Wattowatta Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 5, 2000
    We've had a really tough problem with class distinction-specifically mod/user relations-for about three years now. We've now got mods acting like they're superhuman ("Random mass bannings are the perfect cure for stress"), we've got them stroking their egos (the "I can change my colors and you can't" thread), they're even posting spam (Liz and Vert's threads). That's essentially saying "I'm better than you are, ha ha ha." On a board like this with lots of impressionable kids running rampant, that's simply not the way things should be done.

    This thread was designed to highlight the current status of admin/user relations, and spark debate as to how things could be fixed/improved.
     
  5. JediMasterAaron

    JediMasterAaron Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Oct 14, 2000
    *claps hands and cheers*

    Watto my friend, I couldn't have put it better myself.

    The mods on this board are, in some cases, getting out of hand with their authority and need to be brought up short. This isn't to say that all mods on the boards are like this. Examples such as Kadue and Gatherer stand out as mods who seem genuinely concerned with creating a pleasant environment for SW fans to converse. But there are others, such as DarthLudicrous lately, Gandolf the Grey who's actions are questionable to say the least at times. And let's not forget Padme Bra and Commander Antilles, both mods who come into the Lit forum from time to time to do nothing but bash on the EU. These are the examples of the higher power on the JC boards? God help us.

    Something needs to be done.

    JMA
     
  6. AmazingB

    AmazingB Manager Emeritus star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jan 12, 2001
    "Or a moderator could do what was suggested a few posts ago, which is send a private message asking the moderator in question to close their own thread.

    Just a thought."

    But what's the difference? Mods don't PM regular users about their threads, and most threads are locked before editing time is up, which would give regular users enough time to lock them. If, as Watto says, there is a "class distinction," wouldn't PMing the mods simply serve to further that "distinction?"

    Amazing.
     
  7. DarthSapient

    DarthSapient Jedi Youngling star 10

    Registered:
    Jun 26, 2001
    Well, nobody cited their problems with me. I'm totally open to constructive criticism. What are the specifics with me about the way I have been moderating? Specifics, trends, observations, etc...
     
  8. KnightWriter

    KnightWriter Administrator Emeritus star 9 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Nov 6, 2001
    I'm waiting to hear what this thread's intent is all about or what you and Knight are offering up.


    :confused: I have no association with him. I'm just pointing a couple things out.

    And Knight, you said you aren't focusing on me, only going by what you read or heard. How about I start a thread on you about how your last 10 posts sucked and I can't believe they ever sent you an e-mail with a password to log in. Hurts, doesn't it? And it's uncalled for. That's why I never do it. It was just something I read, that's all.

    You're certainly welcome to do that, although I doubt it would get you anywhere. I was just saying that I disagree with the idea or practice of making yourself (yourself being anyone in this case) known through self-promotion. That's all. I'm not questioning your moderating ability at all. I trust that you are doing a fine job, and I see no reason to doubt cbjedi, among others.

    :).

     
  9. Aragorn327

    Aragorn327 Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Aug 20, 2001
    Aha- new way to fix the situation.

    Make me a mod, I shall use the magical powers against all equally, I shall not discriminate who to ban......

    Aragorn327 for modship!



    Maybe if the people of the boards could vote a user into the modsquad every 3 months or so, that would give us all representation...

    I think that is an actually good idea.
     
  10. DarthSapient

    DarthSapient Jedi Youngling star 10

    Registered:
    Jun 26, 2001
    Fine, I take no offense to what you write. But behind the username DarthSapient, there is a person. And I take offense to a thread in which a major portion of its intent was to discuss or devote an effort to painting me in a negative light. I don't do that to others and I'm concerned when I see others doing it to me.
     
  11. Wattowatta

    Wattowatta Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 5, 2000
    Basically, Amazing, those actions from my point of view say "I know what's best for the JC better than another mod does." Things could have been left to fly and let hillarity ensue, but the mods openly locked the threads, sending a really sharp message to the populace that:


    A. X mod is more imporant than Y mod, and

    B. That there is no clear, concise front from the mod staff (although, this point is not quite as important as point A, when taken in context with the admin "ego-stroking" issue. However, it is important when you're trying to get a question asked as to what type of threads are acceptable on the boards.)

     
  12. Aragorn327

    Aragorn327 Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Aug 20, 2001
    That is why the people should be able to vote one or two mods in.

    "A real government is based on a mandate from the massess....not some farcical aquatic ceremony!"
     
  13. McNerf-Burger

    McNerf-Burger Jedi Youngling star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 13, 2000
    Obviously, if a mod A makes a spam thread, and mod B closes it, clearly mod B DOES know whats better for the JC.
     
  14. DarthSapient

    DarthSapient Jedi Youngling star 10

    Registered:
    Jun 26, 2001
    Why is it that every once in awhile you create a thread like this? For instance, you and Knight have been the two who are most vocal about me kissing ass. But in Knight's words, he has no reason to doubt I've been moderating just fine. So that leaves my 'kissing ass' part which is in the past, prior to me becoming a moderator.

    That is why I get angry at threads like this. The part about me is all about what happened in the past. It's meant to stir things up, ruffle some feathers. If anything, your threads like this are what creates the misconceptions and perceptions of classes and divisions. My gut feeling says that your views represent a small minority and do not reflect the general opinion.
     
  15. AmazingB

    AmazingB Manager Emeritus star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jan 12, 2001
    "Things could have been left to fly and let hillarity ensue, but the mods openly locked the threads"

    So, are you saying it's ok for admins to spam, as long as "hilarity ensues?" How is that not part of the "class distinction?"

    "A. X mod is more imporant than Y mod, and"

    I didn't get that impression at all. My impression was X mod is doing his job, because Y mod posted a spammy thread.

    "B. That there is no clear, concise front from the mod staff (although, this point is not quite as important as point A, when taken in context with the admin "ego-stroking" issue. However, it is important when you're trying to get a question asked as to what type of threads are acceptable on the boards.)"

    The admin "ego stroking" was all posted in good humor. It let "hilarity ensue" which, from what you've said is a good thng.

    Amazing.
     
  16. Wattowatta

    Wattowatta Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 5, 2000
    Certainly, Nerf, but there are ways to go around that without compromising your position with the populace and looking like you're "stroking you ego," hence the PM recommendation.
     
  17. Aragorn327

    Aragorn327 Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Aug 20, 2001
    Watto and Knight, if you have issues with individual mods, please bring it up with them in a PM or email.

    If you have something against all the mods, please don't flame individual mods.....

     
  18. KnightWriter

    KnightWriter Administrator Emeritus star 9 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Nov 6, 2001
    I'm sorry for the trouble. I really didn't meant to paint you in a negative light.

    If you have something against all the mods, please don't flame individual mods.....

    I have not flamed anyone in this thread, and I would venture that I have never flamed anyone on the boards at all. I'm well aware that issues should be handled privately.


     
  19. Wattowatta

    Wattowatta Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 5, 2000
    Trust me, Aragorn, when I'm going to flame a mod, you'll be the first person I'll tell.


    - Edit- Vert has been a respected member of this community for several years now, Amazing, his integrity is not in question. Certainly, we would perceive this stuff as spam, but Vert's judgement is essentially sound. But, at the same time, we have the conundrum like you mentioned, we had a moderator appearing to post spam, and that certainly isn't good for the "Class Disctinction" issue.

    To put things bluntly, that thread should simply never have been made.
     
  20. Aragorn327

    Aragorn327 Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Aug 20, 2001
    Thanks Watto!
     
  21. JediMasterAaron

    JediMasterAaron Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Oct 14, 2000
    My gut feeling says that your views represent a small minority and do not reflect the general opinion.

    DarthSapient

    You're a mod. Of course you're going to feel that way. No offense to you here, but start a poll in every forum, asking about mod popularity. My gut feeling is that your gut feeling would probably be way off...

    JMA
     
  22. DarthSapient

    DarthSapient Jedi Youngling star 10

    Registered:
    Jun 26, 2001
    I respect that. And no ofefnse to you, but I don't care if I'm popular. I want to be thuoght of as consistent, fair, helpful, and one who upholds decent values. Whether or not I'm popular is a different story. Sometimes doing what is right is not popular. And that is what often makes this job much more difficult than you might imagine - always doing what is right.
     
  23. GriffZ

    GriffZ Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    May 27, 2001
    Now, I wasn't here when Sapient was promoted, but I talked to him often before I left, so I feel like I know him fairly well.

    Anyways, I think it's no secret he wanted to be a mod. Hell, I seem to recall him out-right saying he did. But what the hell does that have to do with him being a good mod or not? It's not as if he walked around making threads like "Sapient for MOD!" or something stupid like that. He simply wanted to be a mod. Where's the crime in that? The point is that he's good at what he does, so any past antics (and this goes for other mods) shouldn't matter.

    I'm not sure what his reputation is now a days, but before I left he was one of the most popular members in the PSA. And not for stupid reason like me; he was popular for being an all-round great poster. He really cared about this place. And I can't think of anyone who frequents the PSA that could do a better job of moderating than he does.

     
  24. Wattowatta

    Wattowatta Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 5, 2000
    That indeed was in banter and jest, cbj, I recognize that fully. But, appearances do have value, too. It looks like you're setting a tone of unprofessionalism, and doesn't help the belief some have voiced that mods "ban first and ask questions later."
     
  25. DarthSapient

    DarthSapient Jedi Youngling star 10

    Registered:
    Jun 26, 2001
    I really appreciate that, GriffZ. I was sad to think you weren't returning because via PM I would say I talked with you the most. I'm glad you're back.
     
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