Book Club Discussion Thread *currently reading: Watership Down*

Welcome to the discussion thread for the new book club that droideka27 started. We'll be discussing a different book every week. These books were chosen in the nomination thread. Look below for the schedule so you can get and read the books before the discussion. More will be chosen as those are read.

Currently Reading: Watership Down by Richard Adams


July 15-21: 1984 by George Orwell
July 22-28: The Elenium by David Eddings
July 29-August 4: Fahrenheit 451 by Ray Bradbury

Since some of these books are in huge series, we will only be discussing the first book in each series except where noted. Information about sequels will be considered spoilers and are not allowed. Discussion of the current book and anything in it will not be considered spoilers. Please try to only discuss whatever the current book is and not previous books to avoid confusion.

Look below for the first discussion.

 

The first books are the Harry Potter series by J. K. Rowling. Since this is a pretty popular series, all of the books may be discussed. Below are some questions to start off, but if you think of anything else feel free to ask it. This discussion will last the week of May 20-26.


1. What makes Dumbledore a great wizard? What makes Harry one? Voldemort? Are they great? What makes a wizard a great one? What is the difference between greatness and goodness?

2. When Harrry chooses not to kill Pettigrew in PoA, what does this mean? How does it make him different? What choice would others have made?

3. How does the fame he got from deflecting Voldemort's killing curse influence Harry's life and the decisions he makes?

4. In The Sorcerer's Stone or The Philosopher's Stone, Dumbledore admonishes Harry to "always use the proper name for things. Fear of a name increases fear of the thing itself" (page 298). Explain what he means. Why does naming something make it less intimidating?

5. When Harry breaks the rules, he doesn't always get in as much trouble as another student would (like in PS/SS when he gets on a broom when Madame Hooch takes Neville to the hospital wing. Instead of being expelled, he gets onto the Quidditch team). Why isn't he punished as much as others? Why?

6. What person (or people) influences Harry the most? Why?

7. Which of his confrontations with Voldemort or a Dark wizard (except the time when his parents are killed) influences or hurts Harry the most? Why?

Some questions gotten from or influenced by Harry Potter: Discussion Guide for Books I-IV

 

Sweet! I need to get a copy of Hitchiker's Guide it seems

I don't have my Harry Potter books on hand right now so I'll join in on this discussion maybe later this week.

 

Looks great! I will be giving my input later

 

The Harry Potter series started off well with the first few books but went down hill after the excellence that was Azkaban.

 

Without ownership of many of these books illicit or otherwise, I demand the best calibre of discussion to sate my curiousity for what lies within their crap Aust covers. My palantir is watching. I can't dine but I can wine from afar.

 

Ex, we have the same covers as the Poms do and IMHO they're better than the grainy smeary US ones.

I'll see is I can pick up the books at the library this arvo, looks to be a good discussion!

 

Aust covers usually have landscape imagery, for reasons a rabid wampa's pelt could only fathom, whereas US covers always have these (ridiculous) swashbuckling heroes. The covers for The Dark Mirror vary considerably. We got a pond lake. yes, that'll entice readers in!

Pity, you missed out on a good Memories of Ice featuring the famous T'lan Imass, just to show Gruntle's bulging muscles. I always did think the Brits had better sense. They're not to be underestimated; they gave the world Doctor Who.

 

Right I'll start things off.

I'm no literary scholar but I do like reading. I don't read much into anything as I feel most books are written as a labour of love or as a means for money (successfully or not) and it's the reader who add's deaper meanings to the story not the author (although I will admit that some author write cryptically on purpose)


I'll answer the initial questions put out and will no doubt create my own as I go along.


1. What makes Dumbledore a great wizard? What makes Harry one? Voldemort? Are they great?

In Turn

Dumbledore: Is a great wizard but only in some peoples eyes. Dumbledore has spent most of his later career concentrating on the "demise" of Voldemort possibly at the expense the greater impact he could have had. He was shortsighted in not taking the head of the ministary role as with him in charge the Wizarding world could have been adequately prepared for a potential return, not just of Voldemort but of any Dark Wizard.

So while he is immensly powerful and knowledgeable I feel he is also immensely shortsighted and the fact that he holed himself up in a school waiting for the one mentioned in the prophesy was a base mistake. Harry was always safe at the school and with another strong headteacher Mcgonnagal or Lupin (if possible) then Harry would have continued to be safe.

Lets not forget that Dumbledore had no direct contact with Harry's training throughout his 6 years there and only helped out when things went pear shaped.

Harry: Is not in any way a great wizard. Yet! he could be but his lack of experience obviously marks him down as still being a wizard in training. His luck has been the aspect that has marked him as great so far but until he is able to have more self control he will continue to be impetuous and a possible danger to his friends. Look at the way he dismissed his Occlumency lessons purely because of his teacher.

That being said this is an issue that all youngsters have and due to the burdons on his shoulder it was always likely that he would struggle in places.


Voldemort: Is indeed a great Wizard. His devotion to a craft he loves (so far as he can) and the extent he is prepared to take himself shows a one track mindedness that many people wish for today.

However the direction of his studies is one of question. The dark arts is a path the wary should not follow and IMO only the pure of heart could study it without being tainted by it.

Voldemort with his many issues followed this path and it lured him in deeper to his eventual defeat. Only his prior delvings left him a get out and that itself came at great cost.



What makes a wizard a great one? What is the difference between greatness and goodness?

These can be discussed in mroe depth later.




2. When Harrry chooses not to kill Pettigrew in PoA, what does this mean? How does it make him different? What choice would others have made?


Harry would have been unable to kill Pettigrew as he doesn't have enough hate in his heart (Bellatrix OOTP iirc). Regardless though, Harry saw a broken shell of a man and his "love" took over preventing him from attempting the kill (Not that he would have known how to do it as he wouldn't have known the curse by then). The future of Pettigrew remains unresolved. Many fans feel the issue of the new silver hand could lead to bad tidings for Lupin, Dumbledore feels that Pettigrew now owes a debt to Harry which he will feel compelled to uphold.



3. How does the fame he got from deflecting Voldemort's killing curse influence Harry's life and the decisions he makes?

Harry is unwittingly famous. He has burdons on him that no one else could ever hope to understand and with his prior history people will be expecting him to be the savious again. As a result of this he could have aquired a hero belief and his natural propensity to mischief means he will continue to get into trouble and look to deal with any issue that comes his way.




4. In The Sorcerer's Stone or The Philosopher's Stone, Dumbl

 

So just because he's the chosen one he gets special privledges? How is that fair? I can see why he wasn't expelled, but I would have given him a detention and made him lose points. I wouldn't have made him a Quidditch player and given him a top-model broom (if I was McGonagall).

 

Many fans feel the issue of the new silver hand could lead to bad tidings for Lupin, Dumbledore feels that Pettigrew now owes a debt to Harry which he will feel compelled to uphold.

It is possible, but I just can't see that worm ever standing up against voldemort to side with harry, soif he did so, voldemort would have to be dead... and then it wouldn't be much of a sacrifice as self preservation

 

I think if it did turn at a crucial moment and hep Harry defeat Voldemort, it would be far too cliche.

 

Oh I agree but his history and appearance of vunerability can make people naturally more reserved whn punishing people (I know I got off with a lot when I was younger //reminices)


It's in no way fair and he did get hammered at times but certain "special" people will always get preferential treatment.

He is one of them

 

I think if it did turn at a crucial moment and hep Harry defeat Voldemort, it would be far too cliche.

All of the books are just one big cliche, no?

 

Okay! Let's see if I can do this right


1. What makes Dumbledore a great wizard? What makes Harry one? Voldemort? Are they great? What makes a wizard a great one? What is the difference between greatness and goodness?

err.... pass!

2. When Harrry chooses not to kill Pettigrew in PoA, what does this mean? How does it make him different? What choice would others have made?

There's no doubt in my mind that Sirius and Remus would have killed Pettigrew if Harry hadn't stopped them. Sirius seems to have always been an extreme person and I don't find revenge impossible for him and I believe he would have rather enjoyed getting back at the little rat for everything he did. Remus, I believe, has the capacity to be very harsh and probably sees death as the only fitting punishment for the betrayal. Harry has the ability to be more objective than these two because he didn't really know James or Lilly. Sure they're his parents but as Harry has learned over the course of the books, people aren't always what they seem (in fact, that seems to be a major point in all of the books). So he's not totally blinded by revenge. And anyway, they needed Pettigrew to prove Sirius's innocence. That's reason enough to spare his life.

3. How does the fame he got from deflecting Voldemort's killing curse influence Harry's life and the decisions he makes?

I think it's given Harry a lot of unwelcome and unfair attention. He grew up in a household where he was basically nothing and no one gave him any sort of attention unless it was to yell at him. Then he's thrown into a world where everyone knows who he is. People either automatically hate him like Snape (although, I would say there's a bit more to it than just fame that Snape doesn't like) or they worship him like everyone he meets in the Leaky Cauldron the first time he visits there. He's famous not because of something he did but because of something his mother did, she died for him. He doesn't deserve the attention because he didn't do anything. And I think Harry's realized this over the course of the books. It?s also a lot of pressure and it seems to make Harry more acutely aware of what people think of him.

4. In The Sorcerer's Stone or The Philosopher's Stone, Dumbledore admonishes Harry to "always use the proper name for things. Fear of a name increases fear of the thing itself" (page 298). Explain what he means. Why does naming something make it less intimidating?

The Scottish Play! Okay, my point is we can even see this at work in our world. It?s just a superstition that if you name something evil then you will bring that evil power?s attention upon yourself. Of course by not naming the thing you?ve automatically given into your fear of it. You?ll always be afraid of naming what you?re afraid of. You?ll never face it and it will always scare you.

5. When Harry breaks the rules, he doesn't always get in as much trouble as another student would (like in PS/SS when he gets on a broom when Madame Hooch takes Neville to the hospital wing. Instead of being expelled, he gets onto the Quidditch team). Why isn't he punished as much as others? Why?

I think a lot of it has to do with everyone knowing his story. Everyone knows how his parents were murdered in front of him and how Voldemort tried to kill him too. I think they feel bad for him. A lot of people I imagine would be predisposed to give him a break. I also think a lot of it has to do with Dumbledore. I seriously doubt the old man would have let Harry be expelled for almost any reason.

6. What person (or people) influences Harry the most? Why?

I would say Ron and Hermione are the two biggest influences in Harry?s life at this point. Harry may forget what a teacher tells him, even Dumbledore on occasion, but what Ron and Hermione say really seems to stick with him.

7. Which of his confrontations with Voldemort or a Dark wizard (except the time when his parents are killed) influences or hurts Harry the most? Why?

I think the confrontation in th

 

1. What makes Dumbledore a great wizard?

McGonagall sums it up at the start of PS/SS when she says how Dumbledore may how powers beyond Voldemort but he chooses not to use them.

What makes Harry one?

His ability to love. Dumbldore says in HBP this is why Harry would no be tempted by going to the Dark Side for one moment, he is protected by his ability to love. This is shown in PS/SS when Harry does not see greatness for himself like Ron does but sees his family, something that would have been rare for anyone else to see.

Voldemort?

If Voldemort has greatness, i think it lies in him pushing the limits of magic as described in HBP. Whether this is a good thing or not is irrelevant as Ollivander said in PS/SS that Voldemort did great things "terrible, yet great"

Are they great?

Yes, they do have faults no doubt but even greatness have faults.

What makes a wizard a great one?

I think greatness needs to be defined under it's own characteristics. The reasons for greatness I had above are all quite different.

What is the difference between greatness and goodness?

Greatness is more about ability and what a person has done yet goodness is more about morals and why a person does something. For Dumbledore and Harry, their greatness is their goodness, the fact that they could do something bad but choose not to.
Like Dumbledore said (I think it was in CoS), it is our choices that define us.

2. When Harry chooses not to kill Pettigrew in PoA, what does this mean? How does it make him different? What choice would others have made?

Harry choosing not to kill Pettigrew shows his compassion. It shows his greatness of character as by having the man who is responsible for his parents death in front of him and Harry chooses to spare him.
And Sirius and Lupin were going to kill him, as would have Snape if he knew the truth.

3. How does the fame he got from deflecting Voldemort's killing curse influence Harry's life and the decisions he makes?

This is an interesting question as it has two parts. One shows Harry's tendency to kinda hide from fame and the other is his need to avange his parents.
The first can be accounted for by the fact he was brought up by the Dursleys. When Harry learned he was famous it was something he was uncomfortable with and he did not like people approaching him purely because of what he was rather than who he was, like Draco Malfoy as opposed to Ron and Hermione. Dumbledore may have felt uneasy for the childhood Harry had with the Dursleys, but it was ultimately good for him in the long run.
The second is what Dumbledore tells to Harry in HBP when he explains to true nature of the prophecy and he asks Harry what would have happened if Harry didn't know about the prophecy. Harry realises that he would have wanted to kill Voldemort anyway.

4. In The Sorcerer's Stone or The Philosopher's Stone, Dumbledore admonishes Harry to "always use the proper name for things. Fear of a name increases fear of the thing itself" (page 298). Explain what he means. Why does naming something make it less intimidating?

This is actually nothing text based but something I actually understand. Naming something actually gives you power over it, and knowing a name to have power over it is quite an old concept. Such as the hidden name of God in Judaism which no one was allowed to say (think Life of Brian). Jo is aware this and said so in an interview about these sort of traditions.
With Voldemort it's a kinda reverse, not that you have power over him but that he won't have power over you.

5. When Harry breaks the rules, he doesn't always get in as much trouble as another student would (like in PS/SS when he gets on a broom when Madame Hooch takes Neville to the hospital wing. Instead of being expelled, he gets onto the Quidditch team). Why isn't he punished as much as others? Why?

Harry actually does get punished, sometimes most unjustly such as when Snape punishes him and doesn't punish Drac

 

This is actually nothing text based but something I actually understand. Naming something actually gives you power over it, and knowing a name to have power over it is quite an old concept. Such as the hidden name of God in Judaism which no one was allowed to say (think Life of Brian). Jo is aware this and said so in an interview about these sort of traditions.
With Voldemort it's a kinda reverse, not that you have power over him but that he won't have power over you.

Plus it immediately elevates Harry from just about everyone else in the wizarding world... except those like dumbledore. WHich makes him look pretty darn good!

 

Discussion for Harry Potter is now closed.


Next book: The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy by Douglas Adams (just the first book, please). I really enjoyed this because of the totally wacky humor. I couldn't find any discussion questions online, so . . .

Who is your favorite character? Why? Do you like the humor? Do you get the humor? Tell a story about your experience the series--the first time you read it, or when you saw the movie, or heard it on the radio.

 

Okay, I just got Hitchiker's Guide a couple of days ago. I'll start reading it this week (I hope). I think I'll post my thoughts of the book as I read it since I probably won't finish it.

 

Best. Comedy. Book. EVER!

As a Brit I understood all of the humour, including the Ford Prefect (Which people still seem to have trouble getting). Douglas Adams' humour style is very refreshing and completely random, which is why I like milk.

 

I love it, too. One of my very favorite books. Not being a Brit, I don't get all the humor, but I get more than most people where I live who have read it. The Ford Prefect thing . . . type of car, correct? And when he got to earth he thought at first that the dominating species on the planet were cars . . . I think it's funny

I had heard about this series in a couple of places, and so I checked it out in 6th grade (the first 4 books were in an omnibus edition) and I kept it out of the library for three or four years and read it (at least, read the first one) a bunch of times. Then when the library wouldn't let me stop renewing it, I bought it

 

I quite enjoy the opening few pages about the digital watches.

 

The digital watch part has now been replaced with mobile phones.

Favourite charcater? It has to be a tie between Zaphod and Marvin. Zaphod has to be one of the most original.characters I've ever read or ever will read. And I just love Marvin's complete hopelessness.

I abosoultely LOVE the humour and get quite a lot of it (though not the Ford Prefect until fairly recently) even though I'm an Aussie, not British.
There's something about Douglas Adams hyperbolic deadpan style than never will die and that can't be really captured in film.

My first exposure to the series was through my religious studies teacher in high school, she told us about 42 and then I got into the series through the novels. Then it was the film and finally the radio drama, I have yet to see the TV series.

I know we're just discussing Hitchhiker, but is there anyone else who thinks Adams kinda lost it at the end of Restauraunt and the series went down hill? I thought So Long and Thanks for All the Fish wasn't that good and though Mostly Harmless was pathetic.

 

The digital watch part has now been replaced with mobile phones.

Really? Did Adams authorize that before he passed away?

 

Yeah, he was writing the Hitchhiker screenplay before he died.

It's funny and kinda sad as he collapsed in the gym, even at the last moment Douglas knew where his towel was