ST Bridging the gap, the screenwriters' challenge.

One of the things on my mind lately beyond the detailed plot points and rumor speculation is just how big a challenge the screenwriters face in creating a new story so far removed in time from the last entry in the saga. Almost as much time passes between ROTJ and TFA than that spanning the whole of I-VI. That's the entire downfall of the Republic through the fall of the Empire! So some questions I'd like to see some speculation upon:

1) How will the writers manage to push the new story forward while still revealing things of interest about the huge "missing" period? Exposition (boring), flashbacks (unprecedented), dump it all into the crawl and hope for the best? Ignore it and assume it will come out later?

2) Not exactly the same question but: the writers' second challenge is to glue the six movies together. The PT didn't exist when the OT was written. The PT added a huge amount of lore to the saga that really couldn't be mentioned in the OT since no one had thought of it yet. How can the ST still refer to the PT in a plausible way in order to tie things together, without ignoring that much of what happened wasn't mentioned in the OT? For example, if Luke suddenly knows Padme's name without explanation, that would seem weird. Yet *not* mentioning anything we know only from the PT seems weird too...

Thoughts?

 

I used to be against the idea of Plagueis being in the ST but I think he's the only connective tissue they could use for the villain in the movie without pulling something out of thin air.

I'm sure the crawl will explain some big things, like the state of the galaxy, the empire, and the rebel alliance. They'll have to show some things rather than tell to really get the 'mood' of the galaxy across and distinguish it from the other trilogies. Hopefully the next trailer helps us with figuring some of that out.

 

Plagueis is one option, however no one in the movie will know of his significance, so it's an odd choice for a bridge. One thought I had: if the Rebellion/Republic gained control of Coruscant (which the celebration at the end of ROTJ certainly suggests), then they would have access to the old Jedi Temple/Palpatine's Lair. That would give them access to a lot of "lost" information including a complete history of the Clone Wars, Order 66, Vader's attack on the temple, etc. I don't know how to incorporate that into the screenplay in a compelling way however.

 

As much as I disagree about what should or should not be included, I'll politely play along:

Talking technical screenwriting here: Not all exposition is boring and flashbacks can and have been overused.

That said, we'll see young Leia.

I am not sure the PT will be referenced all that much outside of perhaps Padme, Anakin / Vader, Order 66 and the character from the PT who is still around. Now that's me being optimistic about the villain being someone entirely new rather than a call back to the Sith we know.

I am not all that worried about them filling in time. I am sure we'll hear something in the conversations between all the characters. And anything that is not filled in by the film will most likely be fleshed out in other media.

All I want is for the film to put me back in the Star Wars universe and entertain. I am not putting any kind of expectation beyond having fun with this movie. Anything I get beyond having fun is a complete win.

 

Oh, just fostering discussion, so no worries about disagreement.

I think that's probably right. I am still hoping for some clever way to tie some things together beyond throw-away lines, though. A discovery of an old holocron perhaps that could lead into well, not a flashback, but a playback perhaps? But maybe they won't. So much of Star Wars is "we're going to dump you into the middle of the most important events, figure it out as you go", maybe they just won't bother for now and leave the stage open for further movies.

Totally on board with that. That's pretty much how I feel about it.

 

Foistering discussion is always a good thing, no worries. I applaud you for it and understand why you wish to fill in the gaps. I have a feeling the history won't be confined to throw away lines (some of the best concepts in otherwise meh films were throw away lines and that makes me a bit batty), I think J.J. will make the important points stand out.

I suppose I simply wish to let go and let them surprise and delight me. Like you astutely said, some much of Star Wars is "we're going to dump you in the middle of the most important events, figure it out as you (and the characters) go." That's solid screenwriting practice to start the scene as close to the end as possible. It also makes you more interested in the story and the characters. I've not seen much of that lately and I'd welcome a return to it.

But I'll skidaddle off and let everyone else speculate here.

Carry on!

 

I too think the crawl will explain a lot and I think Plagueis is the best possible villain. He's probably the most worthy opponent for Luke and any new Jedi. And even though the characters won't know much of him, the audience will (if they saw ROTS and paid attention). I think JJ and writers will definitely do a lot of call backs to the PT and the OT. Maybe not directly saying it on screen, but I suspect a lot of hints to the previous films.

 

An interesting thread...

For sure I think that the screenwriters have a mammoth task in intelligently connecting the ST to the OT (let alone the PT), and evolving it organically. And one of the reasons why I didn't think Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull didn't work half as good as it should is that it didn't address, in any meaningful way, the complexities of a changing character and changing time period... which isn't a problem nesersarily if the story/film is chronologically close to the previous... but is more problematic if it's set 20/30 years later.

What I do find concerning, if indeed the main elements of Lucas'/Ardnt's treatment have been dropped, is that JJ has had a relatively small period of time to construct not just a strong/compelling standalone story, but one that naturally evolves the characters and situations in a meaningful way... and that also sets up the next 2 films. Without doubt, if JJ has written this from the ground up, I think it's going to be closer (in terms of quality/complexity) to Star Trek than it will be to the OT.

 

Indy 4 was only ten years or so later too, right? Plus he exists in our world, so the history is well known. This is an even bigger challenge!

While I appreciate that concern and share some of it, I feel like much of that topic and debate has been done to death on other threads. It's part of the reason I started this one.

 

Indy 4 is set in 1957 and Last Crusade in 1938 so almost 20 years, but yeah, since the history is known, the audience knew to expect Russians and greasers and Elvis music and an old Indiana Jones hobbling around.

And while we don't know all the details (yet) about the Lucas plot ideas and how they changed to what we're getting, I have a feeling JJ shifted stuff around and kept the general ideas intact, so the state of the galaxy won't be something made up over the course of a few months but something that has been there since the Arndt draft. But that's just me speculating.

 

I think they will leave it to the novel and game writers to fill in the blanks from EP 6-7.. perhaps have a few stand alone spin offs.

 

I think the only flashbacks we see will be Luke's visions and quite frankly they could tell the whole story especially if we get input from the Force Ghosts. However, we don't want to see half the movie used up in this way so we will find out bits'n'pieces as we go along. Long explanatory history stories will feel forced if not use correctly and the screenwriters are well aware of that.

 

I would be willing to bet we'll get one short scene, a la Obiwan and Luke in the Tatooine hut, that lays out some vague exposition. Maybe between Luke and Finn or Rey. Would be a nice callback...

And since

Spoiler

it looks like Luke may learn a lot of what I was thinking regarding the Clone Wars during Heir to the Jedi, there's at least canon explanation for him knowing more than we thought durning the OT.

 

Well, not only will the writers need to bridge the gap... they'll also be encouraged to leave some things unexplained for subsequent spin-off and tie-in material.

 

When you think the PT only showed the first and last battle of the clone wars, it seems not that unrealistic that the interim of 6-7 will be explored with books and to, rather than on screen

 

It's crazy how the Star Wars trilogy saga is actually structured narratively. There aren't too many other epic stories like it that just routinely jump around in time by such huge amounts and only show a few days/weeks worth of events in each episode. LOTR was a fairly continuous story, though it spanned many months. Bond is episodic, but without much of import linking the episodes.

 

I agree. It's weird - each episode (aside from ANH) is structured as if it's part of a tightly structured saga, but then take a step back and look at it as a whole and a lot of what should be continuous threads end up being dropped between episodes.

 

The bigger challenge is creating a compelling new story, new characters, and new plot for this film. They need to get us invested in the world as it is *now* and get the story going asap.

That's more than enough on the plate.

Referencing random things from the prequels, a time period like 60+ years past by the start of this movie, isn't exactly a big priority and nor should it be.

Besides people like to leave things to the imagination, Obi-Wan mentions the Clone Wars in ANH, and then its never mentioned again in ESB or ROTJ. Some things are better just left off screen.

 

Luke and Kylo Ren would both know exactly who Plagueis is. They are both constantly rumored to be dealing with the ancient Sith.

 

This. The "deep background" should remain there, otherwise it loses its depth. In more pretentious terms, its important to keep the high mimetic elements and the low mimetic elements in their place, otherwise you get a muddle.

 

The point being is that they tried to write the charcater and situations the same, almost like a straight sequel. It may have only been set 10 years later, but it was more than 10 years for audiences eyes and obviously Ford looked considerably older. Neither were taken into account... which I believe was a mistake and impacted overall quality. For sure, TFA has a bigger challenge.

I feel it's germain to the topic though... If JJ has pretty much written this from the ground up, then any 'bridging' and advancement of themes and narrative will be limited at best.

I personally think the use of flashbacks will just by a symptom of underdeveloped ideas if anything, but saying that I doubt they'll be used. The opening crawl should be enough to set the scene... the rest should be done via dialogue and interpretation of character.

 

This movie needs to work on its own though to be honest.

Even if you have never seen a Star Wars movie before (which believe it or not will be the case for a chunk of the audience) and don't know an Obi-Wan Kenobi from a Santa Claus or Roger Rabbit or something, you should be invested in the film within the first 10 minutes.

 

The main bridge from ROTJ to TFA is Vader's severed hand and lightsaber, and the bridge from ROTS to TFA is that Vader's light saber opens Plagueis' tomb.

 

Regarding 1), it is not so difficult. TFA is being made with not just long time fans in mind but also fans unfamiliar with the OT, newcomers and people who just go to the movies (who are movie watchers not franchise fans). Therefore, the film will be light on details of the years since RotJ so as not to bog the story down in elements irrelevant/unnecessary to the plot this film. So, TFA will explain the current state of the GFFA in much the same way as ANH did with the opening crawl and the characters giving explanations were necessary - although remember that Star Wars very rarely explains itself anyway, e.g the Clone Wars was mentioned with no details whatsoever. We will be told what we need to know for TFA - the post-RotJ will be for fans to read about in other media

Regarding 2), the glue that will bind the whole Saga together is Anakin's legacy. His actions as both a Jedi and Vader will influence the GFFA long after even Luke and Leia are gone. For example, Luke is rumoured to be imprisoned/exile/missing - perhaps the truth about Vader got out and now he (and other Force sensitives are pariahs, or his niece Rey is afraid that she will fail like her grandfather did and refuses to learn how to use the Force, or politically the star systems who are free of the Empire refuse to rebuild a one government alliance like before. And as to a general influence of the PT over the Sequels, it will be there in the costumes, designs and aliens as much as the OT will be but not exactly the same. The PT has indeed added a lot to the mythology but it isn't necessary to mention it - if the Clone Wars are not discussed in TFA, this doesn't mean that the Sequels are ignoring TCW, it is just irrelevant to the story at hand. Stuff like Luke "suddenly" knowing Padmé's name isn't that big a deal - just because he never says the name doesn't mean he didn't know it - and even Anakin's name isn't spoken on screen until RotJ as far as I remember. Plus, how often do we refer to our parents and grandparents by their names?

 

Who would they have found about about him from though?

Anakin's ghost, narrating the tale of his fall, and what Palpatine lured him with?

Or Palpatine's own private records?