Bye bye Big Three - Or how the EU needs to move on

Discussion in 'Literature' started by CeiranHarmony, Jul 28, 2008.

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  1. marmkid Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 29, 2001
    star 4
    i think the Big 3 need to be around a little longer, but not as a group together

    there needs to be Luke with either Ben or other jedi, going on some adventure
    this will keep Luke in the spotlight, but also develop another charactor
    it was started that way in the NJO with him and Jacen, but that sort of fizzled
    no reason we cant do it again

    I kind of like the idea someone had of Leia and Han going off with Allana for a while
    Leia could be her master and that would be her training, going off for years
    that could be a good series
    it might have to wait a little bit, since Leia isnt exactly master level yet, but it could work

    I, Jedi proved that a book about another jedi could work, as long as there is some familiarity in it
    Luke was completely secondary in that book, but still kicked ass

    I do think Luke is a little old to be going on too many missions, but that probably wont stop anytime soon
    he should be reestablishing the jedi on coruscant and setting up the academy again

    overall though, the big 3 dont need to go away completely
    they just dont need to be the only 3 people the galaxy turns to every other second when there is a problem

  2. Hope Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 27, 1999
    star 4
    While I agree that these characters may have a few more books/series worth of stories left to tell (depending on
    the author, I would love to see a couple of Luke/Ben adventures) I just don't trust the current creative team to tell these stories. As much as it pains me to say this, I would much rather see them all gone tomorrow than to see these characters be put through another disaster like LotF.
  3. marmkid Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 29, 2001
    star 4
    i agree to a point
    i think the solution is to have no 9-book series with multiple authors
    that seems to be where the charactor discrepencies all come in

    stick to trilogies at the most by the same author
    then it wont seem as bad as some think LotF was

    look at TTT
    it had a lot of different story lines going on, but it didnt seem disjointed or anything like that
    because one author was handling it all, and there werent 3 different agendas (seriously, the mando stuff should have been a completely seperate story than LotF)
    it was terribly obvious how you could tell the difference between who was writing what book in LotF
  4. Volderon Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 23, 2007
    star 4
    I agree with that, series that have one author writing it like TTT and DNT, I thought were very good at getting characters right.

    Now as for this nonsense about giving the Big Three time to retire, thats definately not going to happen anytime soon. Honestly, who WANTS to read about Jaina? I certainly don't. I'd rather read about Luke meditating for the whole book than Jaina in her X-wing saying "This is my favourite ship, I like fast shipz, I don't know what boyz I like today, maybe Zekk, maybe Jag." Garbage.

    It's way past time that we read about the other Jedi Council Masters, some of them are too old now...they missed their chance.

    LOTF tried to movie past the Big Three but they failed because...they killed Jacen. He could have moved the story along if he stayed on the light side...and we could make the three of them retire but they had to kill him because he was an interesting character, arrogant, but interesting.

    One character that I think is amazing is Ben Skywalker, he's not like his parents at all, and thats cool with his GAG training and everything. He can have some cool character development.

  5. Rouge77 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 11, 2005
    star 5
    About as much as a pampered little prince with a certain place on the throne can have.[face_plain]
  6. marmkid Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 29, 2001
    star 4

    thats a little unfair
    basically you were going to hate him from the start then, no matter what
    did you hate all 3 solo kids too, just because they have famous parents?

    btw
    Ben isnt a prince
  7. Rouge77 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 11, 2005
    star 5
    Ben's a little Jedi Prince, an heir to Luke's throne.[face_plain] His famous parents have nothing to do with my dislike, but the fact that other characters have been killed to make room for him at the top. The little maggot will get the role that should have belonged to Anakin Solo.[face_frustrated]
  8. GrandAdmiral_Frank Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 26, 2003
    star 4
    I totally agree with this. Republic Commando was one of the best SW stories I have read and it did not have to focus on the main heroes of the films at all. I would prefer to focus on that more which if you think about it the EU is supposed to expand the SW galaxy anyway.
  9. JaySkywalker01 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 25, 2005
    star 4
    Then wouldn't that make Anakin Solo the spoiled little prince who was guaranteed a place on the throne?

    I like the Ben character, although he has grown up so fast. You could argue that was a necessity based on his life experiences; however, it would be nice to see him occasionally act his age. The closest I can remember to him acting appropriate to his age was in Exile, when he so dogmatically believed in Jacen to the point that he arrested his "uncle Han".
  10. Darthbane2007 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 31, 2007
    star 4
    I agree.

    But it's not the fact that the big three need to die off quickily, it's the fact that they are advancing in age, and not that's there is anything wrong with it, I don't want to see 90 year old geezers leading the forefront.
  11. ChildOfWinds Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Apr 7, 2001
    star 5

    Darthbane2007 I don't want to see 90 year old geezers leading the forefront.

    Well, Dooku managed pretty well in his lightsaber duels when he was in his 90's. And in a galaxy where 120 is the average lifespan and Jedi can live even longer, even 90 wouldn't be all that old. But Luke and Leia were about 58 at the end of LOTF, so they're not even near 90 anyway.
  12. marmkid Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 29, 2001
    star 4
    anakin technically would have been a real prince

    plus he got a death that was one of the best done in the EU
    and was a long time ago, so maybe its time to let it go

    or is it that we need to bitch about things forever around here?
  13. NelanisGhost Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Jun 24, 2006
    star 4
    I agree. Ben is a brat. He's been dictating what he's going to do since he was 8. Luke and Mara were gutless parents. He dropped out of school when he was still in the single digits. And everyone will kowtow to him and his "officer voice", even adult three times his age. It's ridiculous. They all DO have bit more experience, don't they?

    Ben could stand to read a few more books. He never even wanted to be a jedi, and HE gets knighted at 14, after a six year tutelage with a sithlord, that liked wiping his memory for a hobby?

    Please. He really is just like his mother, gets a free pass for everything. Luke doesn't ask for much from his son. He just has to breathe evidently, for luke to think he's the greatest thing since hyperdrives. That's great for a father, extremely stupid for a "grand" Master. Ben gets Luke's job by default and he doesn't understand a single thing. It's Jacen all over again. These silver spoons prove that the no attachment rule was right. Love is BLIND.
  14. Charlemagne19 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 30, 2000
    star 7
    Ben is really an example of a major problem I have with the EU.

    He's an unbelievable character in every possible way.

    Unlike Luke or Han.
  15. marmkid Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 29, 2001
    star 4
    yeah he is at a maturity level about 10 years past his age
    i get that he has been through a lot
    but its still a stretch
    they could have just made LotF 5 years later and it would have been believable
  16. sabarte Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 8, 2005
    star 4
    The recent insistence of having pre-teens in major roles is driving me crazy.
  17. Rouge77 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 11, 2005
    star 5
    One could of course defend it by saying that the authors are just being truthful to George Lucas' own vision of Star Wars...[face_plain]

    :p
  18. Volderon Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 23, 2007
    star 4
    The more I read your posts about new characters makes me think that you hate every single one. And that you probably shouldn't read Star Wars if you don't like them.

    As for that Luke comment. He IS the greatest thing. Ever. He is the most powerful Jedi ever.
  19. NelanisGhost Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Jun 24, 2006
    star 4
    Put it this way: There is nothing I find more revolting, more sick, more destructive, than nepotism. Some lousy leeches riding the coat tails of one person in the family with balls, for generations. Generations of stupidity, mental illness, destruction, insanity, genocide, all carried out by the loser progeny of a hero, an innovator, or at least, a warrior. I am sick to death of them in every single way.

    Edit: Okay that was like going on and on, but you get my point...

    Maybe that clarifies things for you. I am sick and tired of the legion of half wits, dim wits, and airheads that get their parents' glory gravy train for the next 500 years. They world has suffered enough from these indigents. Period.


    How does this relate to SW? In a word: Jacen. Another word: BEN.

    Jaina has always been the pragmatic and most decent of the Solo kids. We have no way of knowing how Anakin would have turned out as an adult.

    That's why we need more characters thant he kids of the achievers. The kids cannot ever hold a candle to the parents.

    Luke and Leia achieved what they did with no help from parents. Leia was a spoiled kid, but she was never a brat. She always wanted to better herself. Han came from nothing. Wedge and the gang, came from nothing. Now Jag, another insufferable silver spoon brat, gets to run the Chiss section of the Empire. Just because of DADDY. Don't they do anything with mommy and daddy around. Jacen would never have gotten his foot int he door without his heroic relations. I'm tired of it. Even Palpatine fought his way up and Anakin Skywalker and Padme, all earned form hard work no silver platters or free rides. In fact Anakin freed himself from slavery, he saved everyone else, at nine.
  20. Charlemagne19 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 30, 2000
    star 7
    To be fair, Nepotism's alternative is meritocracy.

    Where essentially its every man for himself.

    and my solution to that is what the mob's general solution is.

    Kill the talented.

    :)
  21. NelanisGhost Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Jun 24, 2006
    star 4
    Spay and neuter the talented.

    :p
  22. Katana_Geldar Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 3, 2003
    star 8
  23. Charlemagne19 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 30, 2000
    star 7
    Alas, that shall lead to a future of dumb but prolific specimens.
  24. Katana_Geldar Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 3, 2003
    star 8
    Do not underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups [face_shame_on_you]
  25. dizfactor Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 12, 2002
    star 5
    The problem is that they're, in a sense, too well-rounded, as in "the circle is complete." Their character arcs (especially Luke's and Han's) are basically contained in the OT and totally done as of ROTJ. There's nothing terribly interesting to say or do with them afterwards, which is why the bulk of their EU adventures suck. Nothing important can happen to them pre-ROTJ, and nothing interesting can happen to them afterwards.

    Leia, I will concede, has some character growth potential in the post-ROTJ status quo, but not as much as a new character.

    No, no, no. Almost all the best EU stars someone other than the Big Three. I can't think of a major EU story I care about that involves the Big Three, except the Brian Daley Han Solo books and the occasional Marvel. Post-ROTJ stories of the Big Three are particularly awful.

    Except all the Star Wars stuff.
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