Can you be a right winger or a left winger

As I said, I disapprove, but it goes on behind closed doors, it doesn't concern me. What does bother me is homosexuals openly pushing for equal rights and expecting Christians to shut up and accept it without question, which is what I can't and won't do. If a friend of mine told me he or she was homosexual, I would not cut off the friendship or respect him or her any less, but I would speak my mind about homosexuality if asked.

 

Except, again, you're doing more than saying you disagree, you're saying that you want to say that they, legally, can't partake in some things.

 

Lowbacca, here's something for you to think about for a moment...prior to the "gay rights" movement, everyone had the same right to get married, under the same restrictions. The specifics varied by state, but three mainstays were pretty universal: age, gender, and relation to oneself. I'd stand against adults wanting to marry children or close relatives with the same fervor. Some foolishly equate sexual behavior with ethnicity, in spite of the fact no conclusive evidence exists for a so-called "gay gene".

 

You still haven't responded to my earlier posts.

One of my points was that marriage has always been evolving... it wasn't that long ago that interracial marriage was illegal in many states. There's also polygamy in the Bible.

Marriage, recognized by the government, is a legal contract. So anyone who can enter a legal contract should be able to get married in the eyes of the government. That means any consenting adults. To deny based on the sex of the couple (whether it's male/female or male/male or female/female) is a form of sexism, it's gender-based discrimination.

 

I'm pretty sure that traditional marriage actually was fairly accepting of marrying children. That said, that comparison is completely irrelevant because there is a lack of legally consenting parties if children are involved. And of course, marrying close relatives also shows up in traditional marriage. As far as this goes, though, the issue as i see it is not the term marriage, it's how the government treats those relationships. They should have the same legal treatment, I don't care what you're calling it. Or we should once and for all stop the idea that the government should be sanctioning marriages. I consider the Duggar family to be far more dangerous to the fabric of America than, say, Neil Patrick Harris and his fiance.

I should also point out there's no such thing as an "ethnicity gene" either.

 

What we commonly think of as "ethnicity" or "race" is just a differing amount of melanin, which is the source of our individual skin tone. It reacts differently to heat and light under a series of factors, which is why those with European ancestry tend to freckle, while other groups like Africans or Jamaicans simply become darker or more evened out. Genetics has a hand in it too, since the dominant traits are what most often assert themselves in every generation.

As for the government removing itself from the marriage issue entirely, I've given that scenario a fair bit of thought; haven't reached a conclusion yet though.

 

Ethnicity is a social construct, race is a biological basis. The two aren't equivalent.

 

Ghost, you might want to go back and read the Bible carefully. God, in both the OT and NT, says that homosexuality is wrong, period. It's no more or less of a sin than others, true, but it is still sin. From what you have said, you support homosexuality and believe it is not a choice, but due to genetics or whatever.

By saying this, you are trying to straddle the fence between God and the world. It won't work. You are condoning a sin that God himself, through Moses and Paul, condemned. Someone once told me that Christians cannot pick and choose which parts of the Bible they like and dislike. It stands together as a whole.; if believers throw out what they don't like, then they are diminishing God's Word.

I do not apologize for my bluntness here, for you are trying to coexist with the world and that is absolutely impossible. We are called to come out of the world and follow Him.

I pray for you, my friend, and I urge you to go back to the Bible and spend time in prayer and think carefully about what God says and what you believe.

 

I take it you have never read 1 Timothy 2:12, then? You might want to go back and read the Bible carefully. It specifically says women are not allowed to speak or hold authority over men, but remain silent.

Furthermore, if your god says that homosexuality is a sin, then that's a pretty big sign that you shouldn't be listening to anything that god says.

 

Skywalker, you've probably heard it before, but President Bartlet had rather the answer when it came to the OT, Moses, and the injunction not the pick and choose which parts of the Bible they like and dislike:

I wanted to ask you a couple of questions while I had you here. I’m interested in selling my youngest daughter into slavery as sanctioned in Exodus 21:7. She’s a Georgetown sophomore, speaks fluent Italian, always cleared the table when it was her turn. What would a good price for her be?
While thinking about that, can I ask another? My Chief of Staff Leo McGarry insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2 clearly says he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated to kill him myself, or is it okay to call the police? Here’s one that’s really important ’cause we’ve got a lot of sports fans in this town: Touching the skin of a dead pig makes one unclean. Leviticus 11:7. If they promise to wear gloves, can the Washington Redskins still play football? Can Notre Dame? Can West Point? Does the whole town really have to be together to stone my brother John for planting different crops side by side? Can I burn my mother in a small family gathering for wearing garments made from two different threads?

 

Actually, I highly doubt that Skywalker is actually a Christian. Because Mark 16:17-18 says:

"And these signs will accompany those who believe: In my name they will drive out demons; they will speak in new tongues; they will pick up snakes with their hands; and when they drink deadly poison, it will not hurt them at all; they will place their hands on sick people, and they will get well."

I'd specifically like to know if she has drunk deadly poison or not.

 

*sigh*

How many times do I have to keep pointing out that Christians are not under the Law, but under grace? Everyone keeps ignoring it. Don't you think if God expected Christians to keep the entire Law of Moses (613 laws total), He would have had Paul and other NT writers pen something to that effect? The entire Law of Moses applies only to the Jews since Christianity didn't even exist in OT days; some aspects, but not all, are carried over to the New Covenant. Christians don't have to concern themselves with food restrictions, animal sacrifice, or the like.

http://www.gci.org/law/otl

 

So you follow the Bible verbatim, except for the parts you don't like. Looks like we've got another cherry picker here! "Someone once told me that Christians cannot pick and choose which parts of the Bible they like and dislike." Make up your mind.

 

I

I can't think of any stoning so recently in Jerusalem either, though. Or Brooklyn. It's only idiot literalist religions like Islam, which fanatically do not pick and choose the parts of a holy text, that seem to take that approach.

 

Did you read my last post from yesterday?

 

Basically a "love the sinner, hate the sin" kind of thing? How about you just don't hate at all? After all, it's only a "sin" according to your religion. So you know what that means? It means it is a sin for you to be gay, not anyone else. The only person who has to live by your own standards is you. Let others live their lives how they want to and stop judging folks for things that are not harmful in any way.

 

I am not judging people.

Sin is sin, no matter what. People have the choice to do what they wish, but if they do something that God has specifically forbidden, then they are engaging in sin, whether willfully or not.

Going back to the OP's original post, it is possible to be a Christian and love sinners, but not their sin. There are many Christians who take things to the extreme, Westboro Baptist being a prominent example, but non believers take things to extremes too. We're all flawed and we all need to learn love and patience, but constantly slinging mud at each other and refusing to even listen to what other people believe but rather shutting them down because they disagree with you is something non Christians especially (people like you, timmoishere) need to stop.

By the way, timmoi, no comment on your previous post.

 

Sin is only sin because your book says so. That doesn't make it actually true.

You still haven't acknowledged that your book specifically forbids you from speaking.

And just so we're clear, I am in no way "shutting you down" just because I disagree with you. But you evidently have a hard time understanding that your religion in no way affects the lives of nonbelievers. Those who don't believe in your bible or your god are not obligated to live by those standards. And even for those who do believe don't necessarily believe it in the exact same manner as you do. That's why there are countless Christians who do support the idea of homosexuality and gay marriage. You might say those aren't "true Christians," but they could just as easily claim that about you.

 

Not what I meant, Jedi Merkurian. Or did you ignore what I wrote directly after that?

timmoishere, you're right that people can live their lives the way they choose, but Christians are called on to preach the gospel to the ends of the earth. When speaking with non believers, that calls us to let them know as well that we are all sinners and outline why we are all deserving of death and would be completely lost without God's grace. No matter if it offends them, we are not supposed to shrink from speaking the plain truth. As for those Christians who support homosexuality and gay marriage, read my relpy to Ghost.

CHRISTIANS CANNOT STRADDLE THE FENCE, PERIOD. Compromise with the world is not what we're supposed to do. We're supposed to stand apart from the world.

 

None at all.

However, loving God with all your haert, mind, and strength means, in part, standing up for what you believe is wrong, which is what I'm doing.

Are you satisfied now? Good, then let's move on.