Captain America: The First Avenger

Discussion in 'Archive: SF&F: Films and Television' started by Jedi Vince, May 15, 2009.

  1. Jedi Vince Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 2, 1999
    star 3
    Captain America is finally headed to the big screen, and the choices for the principle crew are inspired.

    Director: Joe Johnston (The Rocketeer, Jurassic Park III)
    Screenwriters: Christopher Markus and Stephen Freely (Chronicles of Narnia films)

    But let's not beat around the bush -- the big question on everyone's mind is who will wear the shield.

    My list would start with two names:
    1. Mark Valley (Fringe)
    2. Gabriel Macht (The Spirit)

    Some rumors have the pic being a period piece set in World War II. That's a logical choice, but I was never sure a studio would make a period Cap film. So far, the signs are good. What's your thoughts?
  2. Merlin_Ambrosius69 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 4, 2008
    star 5
    Johnston also directed the Honey! I ----- the ----- movies, and the upcoming Wolfman with Benicio del Toro, which looks amazing. Incidentally, her also designed Boba Fett's armor and did storyboards for the OT.

    As for the cast, so long as Steve Rogers is young, buff, blond, and can act, I'm not picky. I do think it would be interesting to cast Brad Pitt as the Red Skull, since when he was a bit younger he was gung-ho about playing Cap. He can also do a good German accent, and can be malevolently evil when he puts his mind to it.
  3. -Phoenix- Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 21, 2005
    star 5
    Actually, I've never thought about Gabriel Macht before. That could really work... [face_thinking]

    Especially considering his charisma was the only thing I liked about The Spirit.

    And absolutely yes to a period piece. Someone here once mentioned it should play out with the end of the Captain America movie being Cap riding the German nuke into the air over the North Atlantic, saving the day, etc. He is believed dead, big memorial, blah blah blah.

    Then the Avengers movie can begin with Stark/Fury and co. finding and thawing out Rogers' little ice cube
  4. henchman24 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Feb 22, 2008
    star 2
    Actually chuckled out loud. Not picky? Lots of guys fit that criteria in Hollywood minus the "and can act" part, which will be the issue. This is going to be alot harder than you may think. The Brad Pitt idea was inspired however.


    Ben Foster from 3:10 to Yuma may be a bit short, but I would like the casting

    Neal Mcdonough from Minority Report could also be solid

    Johnny Storm from the Fan 4 movies, watch him in Street Kings and he will sell you

    I believe that the only way to do this movie with the gritty realism it needs is to set it during WW2. De-thaw at the very end with Stark/Fury...I suppose they could do it half way through, but they will end up ruining the film.

    I also believe a more middle aged Cap would sell the role better. I had no trouble with Tim Roth fighting the Hulk as a super soldier. A young actor is less likely to have the gravitas required to pull it off. I say less likely, not impossible, because after just watching Trek, Chris Pine far supassed the cool standard for Kirk, and he is a youngster.

  5. -Phoenix- Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 21, 2005
    star 5
    Actually, Chris Pine himself could work...[face_thinking]
  6. Merlin_Ambrosius69 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 4, 2008
    star 5
    I don't think it will be so difficult to find someone to fit the bill.

    ... young, buff, blond, and can act...

    There are some one million good looking young actors in HW; if just 1% of them are strong performers, that leaves 10,000 who qualify for the part. Finding the next Chris Pine (about whom I was doubtful till I actually saw the new ST) should not be too arduous a chore.
  7. soitscometothis Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 11, 2003
    star 5
    ^Yes, this is how we got Hayden Christensen as Anakin!:)
  8. Merlin_Ambrosius69 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 4, 2008
    star 5
    What, you mean the casting process? It's also how we got Al Pacino. What's your point?
  9. soitscometothis Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 11, 2003
    star 5
    ^I was just kidding.

    The thing is, even though we know that there must be many actors around who are suitable in terms of looks and talent, the studios can be a little funny about who the choose to front a film. Generally they want a known name, one that will guarantee a certain amount of box-office, and that is not always the right person for the job.

    I can't think of any visible young actor who fits the bill right at this moment.

    Edit: I would be thrilled to see Michael C. Hall in the role, though. Dexter AND Captain America!
  10. Merlin_Ambrosius69 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 4, 2008
    star 5
    Michael C Hall is too old and too effeminate for the role. He's a fine performer, but not a match for Steve Rogers at all, IMO.

    Mark Valley looks great, but at 44 years of age he's simply too old for the part. By the time the film comes out he'll be 46, and four years later a second or third sequel, or an Avengers sequel, will put him at 50 years of age. I'm sorry, but that is totally wrong for the vibrant, vital, youthful Captain America.

    Gabriel Macht again looks good, but he's 37 years old. I'm 39 and looking fit for my age, so this isn't "agism", so to speak, just a casting concern. In the original story Rogers was a young recruit, just out of high school. The actor needs to be 18-25 to fit the part.
  11. Merlin_Ambrosius69 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 4, 2008
    star 5
    Ben Foster, who played the X-Man Angel, is IMO too sly-looking and narrow-shouldered to fit the part. He looks mischievous and jesterly rather than heroic and square-jawed. Just my opinion on the matter.

    Neal McDonough is totally, TOTALLY wrong for this part. Honestly. The guy is 43 and looks like a cackling madman. Where are you getting these casting choices? The Big Book of Middle-Aged Antagonists?

    With Chris Evans, who played Human Torch in the FF movies, we're getting a little closer, IMO... but his facial structure is wrong, his chin too weak. He looks more like a juvenile delinquent with a chip on his shoulder than a justice-championing leader of a superheroic team. At least he's under 30 and his body type is what's called for, but that face is just too kid-brother-ish.

    I know Cap is out there somewhere, we've just got to keep looking for him!
  12. Dawud786 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 28, 2006
    star 4
    One thing straight... you don't want the guy that played Johnny Storm or the dude that played Warren Worthington III to play Cap because... first and foremost, those guys have already played Marvel characters and I personally wouldn't want to see a guy go from X-Men or FF into the Avengers playing another major Marvel character. That's just silly. And, moreover, I highly doubt Marvel would want to do that... let alone any other studio that could've had the Cap movie if Marvel wasn't doing it in-house.
  13. Jedi_Keiran_Halcyon Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 17, 2000
    star 6
    I think Marvel is probably going to do what you describe but I wish they wouldn't.

    A period piece is absolutely a great idea, but I don't think they should end the film with Cap's Arctic 'death'. They should end it with a big victory, a feel-good ending, though still in the middle of WWII. Then the Avengers movie should start with Cap's 'death' as a prologue. That way Captain America is left with his own open-ended WWII-era series, that can be produced in tandem with the Avengers series like the Iron Man series.

    Alternately, if Marvel is simply dead-set on making this a prequel to Avengers moreso than a Cap movie, then I think the movie should be ABOUT Cap being thawed and introduced to the modern world, featuring extensive flashbacks to the WWII era. It could be a double origin story, about both Cap's general super-soldier origins AND about the origins of how he came to be a WWII relic fighting in modern times.


    Either way, my main concern is that this first movie NOT be a downer/cliffhanger sort of deal. Let audiences get to know and cheer Captain America, and walk out of theaters feeling victorious and like they've enjoyed a WHOLE story. Can you imagine if Star Wars had skipped right back to ESB's downer ending in the first film?
  14. soitscometothis Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 11, 2003
    star 5
    I've said it before, but the guy who plays Captain Awesome in Chuck, Ryan McPartlin, would make a good Steve Rogers.

    Ryan McPartlin
  15. Jedi Vince Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 2, 1999
    star 3
    Excellent post. I never thought of the age factor, but I don't think it would be much of a concern for Macht.

    You bring up a good point about Rogers being a young recruit, just out of high school. It's a tricky line: You don't want someone too young and shiny that doesn't look like he could ever fight or lacks life experience. If it was me, I'd tweak the story a bit to get a different actor to play a young Rogers (kind of like the flashback scene in Superman Returns). He could --like many other young men of that day -- lie about of his age to get into the military to fight in WWII, or something like that.

    It sounds like a stretch, but I'd rather get someone that looks like he fight his way out of a situation, and have enough experience use his head too. Plus, I would want someone with a little bit of a presence so he didn't get devoured by Robert Downey Jr. on screen during the Avengers film.
  16. Jedi Vince Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 2, 1999
    star 3
    Wow ... I forgot about Wolfman -- that does look great.

    That reminds me -- if Johnston follows suit, his DP will probably be Shelly Johnson. His work on Wolfman and Hidalgo leads me to believe the WWII setting will be shot well. He has a magnificent eye for capturing period detail.
  17. Merlin_Ambrosius69 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 4, 2008
    star 5
    Yeah, Ryan McPartlin is all kinds of awesome for the role.

    [image=http://images.zap2it.com/20050624/ryanmcpartlin_smithpr_240.jpg]
  18. Merlin_Ambrosius69 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 4, 2008
    star 5
    The triumphant/fun ending is a great idea, JCK. Let the movie stand alone on its own, crowd-pleasing terms. Then introduce the frozen, defeated and reborn Cap in the Avengers film. If the developers have a brain in their head, they will follow this excellent suggestion instead of ending the first Cap movie with a "downer"/cliff-hanger.

    That said, I patently dislike the alternative you mention, that is, making the whole CA movie about Cap being thawed/reborn/re-introduced. That was the plot of the 1989 atrocity, and we should get as far away as possible from any and all semblance to that uproarious turd.
  19. -Phoenix- Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 21, 2005
    star 5
    Actually I also agree with JKH's idea with saving the freezing/thawing for the Avengers movie and ending Cap on a high note.
  20. henchman24 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Feb 22, 2008
    star 2
    LOL I mean yeah that is silly...well not fighting in WW2 in tights with a shield and a big A on your forehead silly, but still pretty silly =P

    Chris Hemsworth who played George Kirk in Trek also has the look, check him out on imdb. I found his performance at the beginning of that film to be way better than noteworthy.

    Will Smith would be a fantastic choice as well.
  21. Merlin_Ambrosius69 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 4, 2008
    star 5
    Hemsworth has been cast as Thor.

    Will Smith is the single worst casting idea for any superhero you care to name, ever.
  22. Jedi_Keiran_Halcyon Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 17, 2000
    star 6
    Here's my list of ways this movie could play out, ranked in order of which versions I would most like to see.

    1 (BEST version): Entirely set during WWII, Steve Rogers becomes Captain America and has a major victory by the film's upbeat close, at which point WWII is still raging. We are now set up for an ongoing WWII Cap series, and the character has been introduced so we know him when he shows up in Avengers.

    2: Set in present-day with extensive flashbacks to WWII and Cap's origin (think Batman Begins), Cap is thawed and has to adjust to life in the modern world. He has a major victory by the film's upbeat close. We are now set up for an ongoing present-day Cap series, and the character now has his established place in the modern world just like Iron Man, the Hulk, and Thor. All that remains to be done is getting the group together as the Avengers.

    3: Set entirely in WWII, Rogers becomes Cap, faces challenges, and ends the film by sacrificing himself and 'dying' in the Arctic. By starting and ending Cap's WWII involvement in one film, we've lost the opportunity for an ongoing WWII-era Cap series. Nor is a present-day Cap series possible, at least until after Avengers comes out and reveals Cap's true fate.



    Also, I would be very keen on a movie that doesn't necessarily proceed in strict chronological order as a rote origin telling. I would much prefer the film to begin with a big action sequence featuring Cap as Cap, and then have his background revealed over the course of the film through dialogue and flashbacks, ala Burton's Batman.
  23. Merlin_Ambrosius69 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 4, 2008
    star 5
    I like #1 especially, I'm willing to accept #3, but IMO #2 is right out -- not only because it's similar to what was attempted and failed in 1990, but because canonically, Cap's reawakening in the modern world is tied to the Avengers.

    Either way, I'm hoping to see Bucky in the 1940s segment and Falcon in the modern segment, as Cap's sidekicks/partners.
  24. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2000
    star 10
    I don't think we need The Falcon- now, granted, I'm not well-versed in Cap's adventures beyond his origin and a few things over the past decade, but whenever he teams up with the Falcon I just become extremely uninterested. "Captain America and the Falcon" was just the worst title you could give a comic book and they did it :p
  25. Merlin_Ambrosius69 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 4, 2008
    star 5
    Totally disagree. Falcon is awesome, was in the title of the comic for nearly 100 issues, and belongs in a sequel as Cap's modern friend and partner. Rogers trained former Harlem criminal and Red Skull pawn Sam Wilson to fight. Falcon later acquired real flying technology from the Black Panther. The Falcon is a community icon and the first black superhero, pre-dating both Black Panther and Blade. His partnership with Captain America is a key image, IMO, in the integration of the so-called races in this country, and apart from his social relevance is just a really great character IMO.